Should I buy another 1200GS?

[Cornwallis]

During a night down the pub, as always, the conversation turned to bikes. My mate has a nine year old Kawasaki 1200 ZRX with 52K miles on the clock that has never had any problems. I’ve ridden it. It’s a great bike although now out of production. I have five year old 1200GS with 22K miles that has had the following failures:

- Battery at 18 months (requiring recovery)
- Corroded alternator cover at 20 months
- Fuel control module at 30 months (requiring recovery)
- Ring antenna at 48 months (requiring recovery)
- ABS pump at 59 months

Having been delighted that BMW picked up the bill for the ABS pump part at around £1300 (but not the labour), he started to grin when I told him that, less than a week after the repair, I have the red “brake failure” light flashing on the clocks and no servo assist. I’m taking the bike in next week to be looked at.

“If you want reliability, get a Jap bike” and “you’re riding the badge” was the tone of the conversation and, in many respects, he had a good point. He was taking the p**s out of my beloved Beemer and, if I’m being honest, when compared to his Kawasaki it deserved it.

I had an 1150GS before the 1200 and had no problems with it. I love the 1200GS, but I’m now thinking about what to get when I look at replacing it in around 6 months time? I’d like to think that BMW have learnt from their mistakes and that the latest 1200GS is sorted but I’m not sure. I know that there’s been much discussion on the forum about quality but, before even contemplating the 1200 Tenere, I have 2 simple question to members:

- If I purchased a 1 to 2 year old 1200GS, are the problems pretty much sorted?

- Does the current 1200GS have the reliability of its 1150 predecessor?

Thanks

 

[FatAl]

What about a moto guzzi stelvio? I went from a GS1150 after six years to a stelvio, as have a couple of mates, all loving them.

 

[Packer]

What about a moto guzzi stelvio? I went from a GS1150 after six years to a stelvio, as have a couple of mates, all loving them.

What has the build quality and reliability been like?

 

[sidestand]

Aren't Stelvios the ones that are failing their first MOT's because they all have European headlights

 

[forest biker]

Stick with a bmw i would , they have a few probs from time to time but still the best all rounder out there i think i did see a stelvio today for the first time to have a good look around it , and you can see alot of bmw design in it

 

[Alex B]

BMW GSs (and Stelvios) are bikes you develop a long-term "relationship" with. There's a brilliant saying that goes "Italian bikes are like Italian women .........sometimes they stab you for no reason". BMW GSs can be the same.

But, and it's a big but, the GS is longer term more rewarding if you can stick with the ups and downs of ownership.

Kawasakis are good and I really like them (having owned everything from an S3 400 triple to a Z1 900 to a GPZ600R) but the GS "speaks" more than the Kawasakis did. I've had three GSs and they've all "stabbed me" at some point, but I forgave them and they took me a long way.

It's a bit "Zen", and not the road for everyone. See how you get on.

 

[snerkler]

You have to put it all in perspective. One person can buy a GS and have multiple issues, then a dozen can buy one and they have problem free riding. Jap bikes tend to be mechanically more reliable but can be bland, especially the newer ones. Plus you get bikes like Bandits that just turn to rust at the first sign of winter.
Things are getting more sophisticated which unfortunately means that more can go wrong. They call this progress I'm afraid. If you're concerned about reliability buy a Honda (but prepare to be bored) or buy a 'simple' bike where less can go wrong.
I personally tend to buy the bike that gives me most enjoyment (and comfort these days) and keep my fingers crossed and hope nothing goes wrong. However I make sure I keep the warranty up just in case. And is it that bad a thing if you have to take your bike in for something to be fixed? I don't think so as you get another bike to play with while you're waiting
I personally prefer to have all the modern gizmos such as ESA and traction control even though there's more to go wrong rather than have something like an 1150 which apparently is more reliable but has very few gizmos in comparison and feels dated (waits for a barrage of abuse )

 

[BBB61]

I guess I must have been unlucky with my GPZ900R when the big end went at 58000 miles. It also needed new cams and followers at the same mileage as the cams had pitted.

 

[Rasher]

And is it that bad a thing if you have to take your bike in for something to be fixed? I don't think so as you get another bike to play with while you're waiting

You may not see it that way if you have saved for years for a 3 week trip somewhere and then one day 2 get a failure that dumps you back home with a f**** bike, bet they won't let you ride the courtesy one across Morroco while your waiting.

 

[snerkler]

You may not see it that way if you have saved for years for a 3 week trip somewhere and then one day 2 get a failure that dumps you back home with a f**** bike, bet they won't let you ride the courtesy one across Morroco while your waiting.

True. Obviously this is an extreme case though, but if you're unlucky enough for it to happen to you I bet you feel like ramming your bike up the CEO's arse

 

[MacFarlane]

You may not see it that way if you have saved for years for a 3 week trip somewhere and then one day 2 get a failure that dumps you back home with a f**** bike, bet they won't let you ride the courtesy one across Morroco while your waiting.

True. Obviously this is an extreme case though, but if you're unlucky enough for it to happen to you I bet you feel like ramming your bike up the CEO's arse

Oh my, then theres the oil question

 

[BBB61]

You may not see it that way if you have saved for years for a 3 week trip somewhere and then one day 2 get a failure that dumps you back home with a f**** bike, bet they won't let you ride the courtesy one across Morroco while your waiting.

All you have done since you came here is worry and wonder "what if this breaks, what if that breaks?" If you are that paranoid why not sell the GS and get something else! Life is too short, just get on it and ride the bloody thing!

 

[skywalker]

Well said Bob ! He really is a pain in the arse. I've never seen anything else from him rather than doom & gloom.

 

[GSband]

...
I have five year old 1200GS with 22K miles that has had the following failures:
- Battery at 18 months (requiring recovery)
- Corroded alternator cover at 20 months
- Fuel control module at 30 months (requiring recovery)
- Ring antenna at 48 months (requiring recovery)
- ABS pump at 59 months
...

I have 2 simple question to members:

- If I purchased a 1 to 2 year old 1200GS, are the problems pretty much sorted?

- Does the current 1200GS have the reliability of its 1150 predecessor?

Thanks

Hi,
I understand your dilemma completely. I had exactly the same problems happening to my 2005 bike, and then some, so there's worse bikes out there. And I also wondered if I should stick with BMW, when my brakes broke down in autumn 2007. But the ride on a GS is so thrilling, I decided to try another GS. After all, things couldn't get that bad again !

I part exchanged it in december 2007 with a new R12GS, thinking most teething problems would have been delt with. I still had one fuel pump module go bust, but over a total of 77000km, it was very reliable. The only thing that went wrong was the joint in the FD where I got some oil spill, probably due to pressure build up inside the FD. Since then the recommended quantity of oil in the FD has decreased to take this into account, and the new DOHC model has a valve on the FD to let excess air pressure escape.

Most problems you experienced seem solved by BMW :
- better batteries (in conjunction with the disapearance of the servo brakes that consumed batteries)
- higher alternator output (from MY 2008 onwards)
- no more servo brakes (from MY 2007 onwards)
- improved fuel pump modules (recall and new bikes)
- improved ring antennae (recall and new bikes)
- improved paint work on front of engine

In the same way that I was unhappy with my 2005 bike, I was over the moon with my 2007 bike. So much so, that when it got destroyed in november 2010 while it was parked, I didn't hesitate a second and bought a secondhand 2007 model. Buying secondhand (in my view) is ok as long as there's a full service history, and all recalls have been carried out. If you buy secondhand, make sure this is the case. My secondhand 2007 has the new antenna, new brake lines, and the improved fuel pump module, because of the recalls. I don't expect anything to go wrong this time.

The problem with BMW bikes is that the customers are actually unpaid testers for BMW. Improvements are implemented throughout production. The best R1200GS will no doubt be the last one that rolls off the production line. I will not buy a BMW in the first years of production again.

I hope this helps you in your dilemma.
Cheers !

 

[FatAl]

What has the build quality and reliability been like?

I've had mine for two years and covered 8,000 miles, the speedo sensor failed in heavy rain and was replaced under warranty at first service. The replacement was sealed with silicone sealant and has been fine since. I also replaced the standard plug caps for NGKs as I had a slight misfire a few thousand miles ago in heavy rain.
I haven't heard of any major failings to the final drive unit and fuel pump senders, from what I gather about Moto Guzzis in general it's usually minor bits and pieces that need sorting in the first year of ownership and after that they are pretty well sorted. They are as user friendly as a BMW twin. Now my bike is out of warranty I have serviced it myself, it was as easy as doing my old 1150.
I've used the bike over the winter months, I washed it after every trip and the finish is holding up well, certainly no corrosion like I had to the engine cover and fork legs on my GS1150.
My pal in Edinburgh uses his Stelvio all year round, it sits out on the road outside his flat uncovered 24/7, 18 months and 6000 miles later no problems other than a couple of slightly corroded bolts.
The only things I wish were better are the heated grips as you cannot adjust the heat setting unless you are stationary, and the fuel tank could do with another couple of litres to take the range up from 180 miles to around 200mls, but I certainly don't need the extra large capacity of the GS adventure.
The bike is big and heavy, I have no intention of going 'off road' with it, I tried that with my 1150 which I found far too heavy so I bought a Yamaha serrow for trail riding. I have fitted a Quill silencer for it, the sound is deep and growly, and according to the Dyno at Quill the bike is putting out a few more bhp and has made the engine pull better.
The Stelvio is far from being perfect but it is a great machine to ride with bags of character(similar in a way to a Harley), I swapped my 1150 for it only because I fancied a change after six years and had always fancied a Guzzi, my GS was a fantastic bike, it was totally reliable, and my Stelvio is proving to be it's equal.

 

[FatAl]

Aren't Stelvios the ones that are failing their first MOT's because they all have European headlights

I don't know, please tell me more as this is the first I've heard

 

[TeaPig]

I don't know, please tell me more as this is the first I've heard

If it truely has a European headlamp (of which I have no idea, just the above
scaremongering to go on) then it will fail as the dip pattern is wrong. However, a decent MOT tester will usually bung a lump of gaffer tape on the headlamp in the right place so as to block the offending part of the beam in order to allow it to pass the test. As far as I know, all headlamps are marked on the glass with the DIN number or whatever standard which includes a little arrow indicating the direction of dip so you should be able to tell if you have a Euro or UK spec' headlamp.

 

[Rasher]

All you have done since you came here is worry and wonder "what if this breaks, what if that breaks?" If you are that paranoid why not sell the GS and get something else! Life is too short, just get on it and ride the bloody thing!

My point was that breaking down does matter to many people, regardless of if BMW will come and fix it for free, my example was a Holiday as many people do go on holiday on their bikes and a breakdown could easily ruin it.

Other people may use the bike for work and perhaps a breakdown could cost then a days salary, unless your BMW dealer is kind enough to pay you for the days work, perhaps they would pay for another two weeks of work at a later date and for all the Hotels so you can go on your holiday again a bit later, I am sure they would also clear the extra time off with your boss or line up alternative employment if your boss said no

It seems so many people here love to make excuses for any failings of BMW and seem to put them on some sort of pedestal and if anyone is upset about experiencing problems, or concerned about some of the reliability issues then it is them that are at fault as BMW are obviously perfect.

Must go, I have a bike to ride and contrary to popular belief I do ride it, often out of my own postcode and even to foreign lands.

 

[BBB61]

My point was that breaking down does matter to many people, regardless of if BMW will come and fix it for free, my example was a Holiday as many people do go on holiday on their bikes and a breakdown could easily ruin it.

Other people may use the bike for work and perhaps a breakdown could cost then a days salary, unless your BMW dealer is kind enough to pay you for the days work, perhaps they would pay for another two weeks of work at a later date and for all the Hotels so you can go on your holiday again a bit later, I am sure they would also clear the extra time off with your boss or line up alternative employment if your boss said no

It seems so many people here love to make excuses for any failings of BMW and seem to put them on some sort of pedestal and if anyone is upset about experiencing problems, or concerned about some of the reliability issues then it is them that are at fault as BMW are obviously perfect.

Must go, I have a bike to ride and contrary to popular belief I do ride it, often out of my own postcode and even to foreign lands.

The fact is breakdowns can happen to anyone on any bike. I did a tour last July with MCi tours and one of the participants had their ABS unit fail on their 1300 Pan Euro. Another had the alternator fail on his Blackbird.

The trouble is ever since you have joined this forum your attitude is "woe is BMW, my bike is going to ruin my holiday". The fact is that while some have had problems with their bikes there are a hell of a lot of people who haven't. But people don't tend to post to say their bike is running well.

As Skywalker said, you are full of doom and gloom. By all means when you have problems then come back and let us know, but the constant "what if" has become tedious in the extreme.

 

[ianboydsnr]

The fact is breakdowns can happen to anyone on any bike. I did a tour last July with MCi tours and one of the participants had their ABS unit fail on their 1300 Pan Euro. Another had the alternator fail on his Blackbird.

The trouble is ever since you have joined this forum your attitude is "woe is BMW, my bike is going to ruin my holiday". The fact is that while some have had problems with their bikes there are a hell of a lot of people who haven't. But people don't tend to post to say their bike is running well.

As Skywalker said, you are full of doom and gloom. By all means when you have problems then come back and let us know, but the constant "what if" has become tedious in the extreme.

2 years ago I went to the south of france with a few mates, there were a couple of beemers a fazer and a VFR800, the VFR broke down several times, it had regulator and battery problems, it overheated going up a pass, oh how we laughed at the little Honda,

the owner has traded in for a nice K1200s