Tagging systems

[Chris G]

Chaps,

in the market for a tagging system for the bike, alphadot, datatag sort of thing, I get the feeling that all of the main ones get you 10% insurance discount, but was wondering if anyone has actually had a bike scanned or even returned by the police as a result of one of these kits being fitted??

 

[finglonga]

Chaps,

I get the feeling that all of the main ones get you 10% insurance discount,

You only get an insurance discount on one thatcham approved thing you use for security on the bike. If you have an alarm with a higher security rating than say your Datatag then its only the alarm that will earn you discount.

 

[STUBBS]

have had bikes with smartwater, alphadots and transponders fitted and as far as i know theyve never been checked

 

[MikeP]

I used to scan bikes as part of my job. They were always suspect stolen or suspected to have stolen parts on them.

Datatag was the most common. Quite a good product with good back-up from Mitsui-Yamaha who owned and recorded the register.

Problems with it from a crime & detection point of view.

Some sellers who fitted the transponders didn't hide them too well (too difficult to do or just ripping off the customer). Self-fit was usually better but by the time the bike had changed hands, the exact location of the transponders were lost. This made scanning a problem.

The scanners were very unwieldy at first, later ones are better but it can still be hit & miss, especially with the long flexy-probe.

The scanners are on loan from Datatag. There's not many out there so they are usually in the hands of specialist investigators. Patrolling officers rarely have access to them.

Alpha-dot and Data-dot. (The latter is a combination of Datatag and Alpha-dot).

These use micro-dots, each with a URN and a telephone number on them. The microdots are suspended in a clear liquid a bit like a lacquer. There are "signature" dots too that will show under ultra-violet light.

Each kit has its own Unique Number. Once purchased and applied, it has to be registered so that the URN can be searched in the event of discovery after theft etc.

The idea is that the owner paints major components with a single brush-stroke application. This should leave 5 to 7 microdots each time.

Again a piece of kit is needed to find and read the dots. It's not easy and again usually left to specialist investigators.

At one point, several major motor-manufacturers were using Alpha-dot during vehicle assembly. I'm not sure if this has increased or died a death.

Smart Water and Smart Water Instant.

An invisible liquid that contains a unique trace element. Smart Water has the drawback of requiring forensic gathering of samples for comparison. The Instant version is much better.

In practice, I have found that it isn't as durable as the manufacturers claim (bike polishers and ACF-50 users, beware).

The only crime prevention application comes as a deterrent.

These marking systems are more use to ex-post-facto investigations. I've made use of them often (where found) and it's been handy to get a conviction for those who deal in stolen parts, usually unidentifiable. Let's face it, today, most vehicle crime is geared towards the parts market and these marking systems are possibly the best way to deter it (provided people get caught of course).

If you don't need the possible insurance discount, you are just as well marking the bike yourself.

I use an ultra-violet pen. All the major components that I can get to have been marked.

Just use the last seven characters of the VIN (that's the unique part and can be searched by police via PNC).

If someone wants to steal my bike badly enough, they will. All I'm concerned about is helping the scumbags get caught.

 

[Steptoe]

I sometimes get slightly damaged parts from main dealers, that have been replaced with new parts, and some of them have datatag numbers etched on them.

I leave the number on the parts, and sell them on or use them on bike repairs. But have always wondered what happens if the bike they've come from gets stolen at a later date, and then a part i've sold from the bike before the bike was stolen, gets picked up somewhere along the line and i get the fingers pointed. ( do you understand what i'm on about).

Will i get hauled off and be put to death.


I punch my initials into all the parts on the bike.

 

[Wapping]

The number of GS's (and other bikes) I see unsecured in the City of London parking bays and around the streets, seems to indicate that owners do not care too much, either way.

 

[MikeP]

I sometimes get slightly damaged parts from main dealers, that have been replaced with new parts, and some of them have datatag numbers etched on them.

I leave the number on the parts, and sell them on or use them on bike repairs. But have always wondered what happens if the bike they've come from gets stolen at a later date, and then a part i've sold from the bike before the bike was stolen, gets picked up somewhere along the line and i get the fingers pointed. ( do you understand what i'm on about).

I think you're safe now Neil. Once the government vehicle crime reduction targets were reached, the Organised Vehicle Crime Section of NCIS was closed down.

Besides, last time I was there, I drew a goatee beard on your photo, coloured your hair ginger and changed your name to Billy Barley (or something similar).

Will i get hauled off and be put to death.

No, just have to supply a DNA sample!

 

[Chris G]

I used to scan bikes as part of my job. They were always suspect stolen or suspected to have stolen parts on them.

Datatag was the most common. Quite a good product with good back-up from Mitsui-Yamaha who owned and recorded the register.

Problems with it from a crime & detection point of view.

Some sellers who fitted the transponders didn't hide them too well (too difficult to do or just ripping off the customer). Self-fit was usually better but by the time the bike had changed hands, the exact location of the transponders were lost. This made scanning a problem.

The scanners were very unwieldy at first, later ones are better but it can still be hit & miss, especially with the long flexy-probe.

The scanners are on loan from Datatag. There's not many out there so they are usually in the hands of specialist investigators. Patrolling officers rarely have access to them.

Alpha-dot and Data-dot. (The latter is a combination of Datatag and Alpha-dot).

These use micro-dots, each with a URN and a telephone number on them. The microdots are suspended in a clear liquid a bit like a lacquer. There are "signature" dots too that will show under ultra-violet light.

Each kit has its own Unique Number. Once purchased and applied, it has to be registered so that the URN can be searched in the event of discovery after theft etc.

The idea is that the owner paints major components with a single brush-stroke application. This should leave 5 to 7 microdots each time.

Again a piece of kit is needed to find and read the dots. It's not easy and again usually left to specialist investigators.

At one point, several major motor-manufacturers were using Alpha-dot during vehicle assembly. I'm not sure if this has increased or died a death.

Smart Water and Smart Water Instant.

An invisible liquid that contains a unique trace element. Smart Water has the drawback of requiring forensic gathering of samples for comparison. The Instant version is much better.

In practice, I have found that it isn't as durable as the manufacturers claim (bike polishers and ACF-50 users, beware).

The only crime prevention application comes as a deterrent.

These marking systems are more use to ex-post-facto investigations. I've made use of them often (where found) and it's been handy to get a conviction for those who deal in stolen parts, usually unidentifiable. Let's face it, today, most vehicle crime is geared towards the parts market and these marking systems are possibly the best way to deter it (provided people get caught of course).

If you don't need the possible insurance discount, you are just as well marking the bike yourself.

I use an ultra-violet pen. All the major components that I can get to have been marked.

Just use the last seven characters of the VIN (that's the unique part and can be searched by police via PNC).

If someone wants to steal my bike badly enough, they will. All I'm concerned about is helping the scumbags get caught.

thanks for that, may go with alpha dot as it's half the price of datatag

just check with insuance co before I buy.