To ABS or Not ABS
- Thread starter bikerider007
- Start date
I can recall a couple of times where my ABS has kicked in when I thought I still had some grip left and the front tyre thought otherwise. Maybe this saved me from crashing, I'll honestly never know for sure, but I'm glad the brakes released and reapplied (try it, it's unnerving when it happens) and let me stop safely. 
I can also recall the time when I was off the brakes and ended up sliding up the road anyway, having reached and exceeded the limit of grip and lean in a millisecond at the exit of a wet roundabout in Australia. Spilt diesel may have been a factor, or slightly excess speed for the road and weather conditions but I'm not 100% sure. Either way the ABS couldn't have stopped my one and only crash from happening. Luckily both I and my bike were okay.
Basically I am reinforcing what has already been mentioned: ABS might help, but there are occasions where you only have yourself to blame when it goes wrong, ABS or not. I'll take ABS if its available thanks.
I can also recall the time when I was off the brakes and ended up sliding up the road anyway, having reached and exceeded the limit of grip and lean in a millisecond at the exit of a wet roundabout in Australia. Spilt diesel may have been a factor, or slightly excess speed for the road and weather conditions but I'm not 100% sure. Either way the ABS couldn't have stopped my one and only crash from happening. Luckily both I and my bike were okay.
Basically I am reinforcing what has already been mentioned: ABS might help, but there are occasions where you only have yourself to blame when it goes wrong, ABS or not. I'll take ABS if its available thanks.
stop press!!! 33000miles DOH
Just considering the same ABS question myself today (only on the little 650 though)
Fairly simple really......
1) ABS is now an almost 'standard' option for most purchasers, a used model without ABS'll be far less attractive when it comes to resale or trade-in, you are better to find a 'bargain' with ABS versus without it (as others have said, you will, of course, find one).
2) ABS is now an almost 'standard' option for most purchasers (did I say that already)......that's because it's marketable.......that's because it's designed as an added safety feature......... most GS riders in most circumstances may never use it (apparently), that debate has been well covered.
Best to find the right bike at the right price with ABS if you can
I had a loan bike, 1200GS, with ABS whilst my 1150GS was in for service.
All was well when I left the dealership but after a stop I noticed that the "Brake Failure" light was on. I did a brake test as I moved off and repeated it when it was safe to do so from a slightly higher speed. All seemed good, faulty sensor thinks I.
Later however when exploring the limits of handling and performance I was deliberately anchoring up very hard when the front wheel (ABS equipped remember) locked up.
I was quick enough releasing the brake to recover from the front end washout and stop safely. ABS is electro-mecahnical, it can fail. Secondly assumptions are the mother of all cock-ups The red light wasn't brake failure but ABS failure.
My servo ABS 1150 has been faultless and has saved me on one late dark soaking wet and muddy road when I came across a badly signed road closure. It will fail at some time though and there is the risk that without regular practise in a skid situation your reactions won't be as good.
All was well when I left the dealership but after a stop I noticed that the "Brake Failure" light was on. I did a brake test as I moved off and repeated it when it was safe to do so from a slightly higher speed. All seemed good, faulty sensor thinks I.
Later however when exploring the limits of handling and performance I was deliberately anchoring up very hard when the front wheel (ABS equipped remember) locked up.
I was quick enough releasing the brake to recover from the front end washout and stop safely. ABS is electro-mecahnical, it can fail. Secondly assumptions are the mother of all cock-ups
The red light wasn't brake failure but ABS failure.My servo ABS 1150 has been faultless and has saved me on one late dark soaking wet and muddy road when I came across a badly signed road closure. It will fail at some time though and there is the risk that without regular practise in a skid situation your reactions won't be as good.
DutchBryn
Registered user
Some Numbers. Discuss.
Mostly, so far we've been relating experiences and opinions etc.
I have taken to reading the local 'bike rags to help me further develop my (local) language skills. 'Motoplus / Motorrad', did the following test at the Hockenheim test facility.
Dry surface 100km/h:
BMW K1300S 10.6 m/s2 / 36.5m
Aprillia SL750 Shiver 10.5m/s2 / 36.6m
Suzuki GSX650F 9.9m/s2 / 38.9m
Yamaha XJ6 9.7m/s2 / 39.7m
Honda CB1000R 9.6m/s2 / 40.3m
Kawasaki 1400GTR 9.5m/s2 / 40.7m
Honda Fireblade 9.4m/s2 / 41.0m
BMW F800GS 9.3m/s2 / 41.5m
H-D Road King(!) 9.0m/s2 / 43.1m
Triumph Tiger 8.8m/s2 / 44.0m
The above are average of 3 runs.
Surprising fact: On the K1300 the test rider, having disabled the ABS, took 36.7m to stop.
Mostly, so far we've been relating experiences and opinions etc.
I have taken to reading the local 'bike rags to help me further develop my (local) language skills. 'Motoplus / Motorrad', did the following test at the Hockenheim test facility.
Dry surface 100km/h:
BMW K1300S 10.6 m/s2 / 36.5m
Aprillia SL750 Shiver 10.5m/s2 / 36.6m
Suzuki GSX650F 9.9m/s2 / 38.9m
Yamaha XJ6 9.7m/s2 / 39.7m
Honda CB1000R 9.6m/s2 / 40.3m
Kawasaki 1400GTR 9.5m/s2 / 40.7m
Honda Fireblade 9.4m/s2 / 41.0m
BMW F800GS 9.3m/s2 / 41.5m
H-D Road King(!) 9.0m/s2 / 43.1m
Triumph Tiger 8.8m/s2 / 44.0m
The above are average of 3 runs.
Surprising fact: On the K1300 the test rider, having disabled the ABS, took 36.7m to stop.
DutchBryn
Registered user
Forgive the spacings etc (
Moving on to: 'poor surface with (and without) a passenger..'
K1300S 8.8m/s2 (8.4m/s2) ....43.7m (45.8m)
F800GS 8.4m/s2 (8.0m/s2) ....45.8m (48.5m)
SL750 8.1m/s2 (8.1m/s2) ....47.6m (47.6m)
CB1000R 8.0m/s2 (7.8m/s2) ....48.3m (49.3m)
'Blade 7.9m/s2 (6.9m/s2) ....48.7m (55.6m)
Tiger 7.6m/s2 (7.3m/s2) .....51.1m(53.2m)
GSX650F 7.3m/s2 (7.2m/s2) ....52.6m(53.3m)
XJ6 7.2m/s2 (7.5m/s2) .....53.7m(51.2m)
1400GTR 7.0m/s2 (6.9m/s2) ....55.2m (56.0)
H-D 6.3m/s2 (6.0m/s2) ....61.5m (64.1m)
'Blade not meant for two. 7m difference one or two-up..
Moving on to: 'poor surface with (and without) a passenger..'
K1300S 8.8m/s2 (8.4m/s2) ....43.7m (45.8m)
F800GS 8.4m/s2 (8.0m/s2) ....45.8m (48.5m)
SL750 8.1m/s2 (8.1m/s2) ....47.6m (47.6m)
CB1000R 8.0m/s2 (7.8m/s2) ....48.3m (49.3m)
'Blade 7.9m/s2 (6.9m/s2) ....48.7m (55.6m)
Tiger 7.6m/s2 (7.3m/s2) .....51.1m(53.2m)
GSX650F 7.3m/s2 (7.2m/s2) ....52.6m(53.3m)
XJ6 7.2m/s2 (7.5m/s2) .....53.7m(51.2m)
1400GTR 7.0m/s2 (6.9m/s2) ....55.2m (56.0)
H-D 6.3m/s2 (6.0m/s2) ....61.5m (64.1m)
'Blade not meant for two. 7m difference one or two-up..
Whatever he's drinking please barman.
http://eshop.ironmonsters.it/images/product/2007_Bel-Ray_Silicone_DOT_5_Brake_Fluid_--.jpg
Cheers !
Now that looks bloody scary, a Tiger taking 20.5% longer to stop than the K13!
The bit about the Blade on a poor surface would be even more frightening if I ever had any intention of trying to wrap myself around one of them.
DutchBryn
Registered user
I'm a slooow typer. 50% to follow. The rest is more intersting.
Bear with me.
Bear with me.
Interesting perspective - when cars were fitted with long steel shafts which shot out in the event of an accident, there was a period of pretty horrific injuries which still happened, even though you'd have thought people would have realised the risk..
And for those doubters, if you have a look at any 50's (or earlier) and up to mid 60's designed cars, the steering column was non collapsible. Any head on collision had a tendency to drive the long steering shaft backwards into the driver - who anyway was moving forwards, as there were no seat belts.
Question is, on those few occasions those of us with even God like reactions get caught out, is it preferrable to be shiny side up or not? The ABS on my 1150GSA operates very occasionally, and I spend all journeys starting on gravel and mud covered Devon lanes. The time I am most grateful is on blind bends covered in slime when an unexpected car appears. Probably could catch the slide, but the odds are against catching all of them!
However, also happy riding old scrambler about with no ABS, which has been into hedges a couple of times, with no harm done.
Can argue either way - was quite happy on a 950 Adventure with no ABS, but just as happy on the GSA. Not the primary issue for me!
And for those doubters, if you have a look at any 50's (or earlier) and up to mid 60's designed cars, the steering column was non collapsible. Any head on collision had a tendency to drive the long steering shaft backwards into the driver - who anyway was moving forwards, as there were no seat belts.
Question is, on those few occasions those of us with even God like reactions get caught out, is it preferrable to be shiny side up or not? The ABS on my 1150GSA operates very occasionally, and I spend all journeys starting on gravel and mud covered Devon lanes. The time I am most grateful is on blind bends covered in slime when an unexpected car appears. Probably could catch the slide, but the odds are against catching all of them!
However, also happy riding old scrambler about with no ABS, which has been into hedges a couple of times, with no harm done.
Can argue either way - was quite happy on a 950 Adventure with no ABS, but just as happy on the GSA. Not the primary issue for me!
Wingit
Registered user
ABS? A good rider aid for the average tarmac tosser (like myself). And will probably be a plus point when re-selling.
For those that will take the bike offroad I'd go for non ABS. In fact I'd go for minimum bells and whistles as it's less stuff to break and go wrong after you've been down a few riverbeds, mud ruts etc.
For those that will take the bike offroad I'd go for non ABS. In fact I'd go for minimum bells and whistles as it's less stuff to break and go wrong after you've been down a few riverbeds, mud ruts etc.
DutchBryn
Registered user
Last from Hockenheim:
Again, 100 km/h to stop.
Wet road.
SL750 9.8m/s2....39.4m
K1300S 9.4m/s2....41.0m
'Blade 9.2m/s2....41.2m
CB1000R 9.2m/s2....41.9m
GSX650F 9.0m/s2....42.8m
800GS 8.9m/s2....43.5m
XJ6 8.9m/s2....43.5m
1400GTR 8.8m/s2....43.8m
Tiger 8.5m/s2....45.4m
H-D 7.9m/s2....49.1m
Don't know about about you folk, but 1g in the wet is something I know I couldn't acheive. Even high 8s is good(?)
And now.. Variable Grip Surface, the old bete noire of ABS systems of yore.
This is over zebra crossing type stripes. The sort that fazed-out earlier systems.
CB1000R 8.2m/s2....46.8m
SL7590 8.1m/s2....47.7m
K1300S 8.0m/s2....48.1m
XJ6 7.8m/s2....49.5m
F800GS 7.5m/s2....51.3m
GSX650F 7.5m/s2....51.4m
'Blade 7.5m/s2....51.8m
Tiger 7.3m/s2....52.6m
1400GTR 7.1m/s2....54.1m
H-D 6.2m/s2....62.1m
The Tiger and H_D systems were viewed as emergency-aids.
The others feature faster acting Valves, which resulted in data above.
The mag. did a similar test in '06. It says that the stars then would be bringing up the rear of these results.
So, when a professional rider couldn't beat the big Beemers ABS in the dry and the same bike could achieve 96% of a g in the wet.. Would you buy it?
DB.
Again, 100 km/h to stop.
Wet road.
SL750 9.8m/s2....39.4m
K1300S 9.4m/s2....41.0m
'Blade 9.2m/s2....41.2m
CB1000R 9.2m/s2....41.9m
GSX650F 9.0m/s2....42.8m
800GS 8.9m/s2....43.5m
XJ6 8.9m/s2....43.5m
1400GTR 8.8m/s2....43.8m
Tiger 8.5m/s2....45.4m
H-D 7.9m/s2....49.1m
Don't know about about you folk, but 1g in the wet is something I know I couldn't acheive. Even high 8s is good(?)
And now.. Variable Grip Surface, the old bete noire of ABS systems of yore.
This is over zebra crossing type stripes. The sort that fazed-out earlier systems.
CB1000R 8.2m/s2....46.8m
SL7590 8.1m/s2....47.7m
K1300S 8.0m/s2....48.1m
XJ6 7.8m/s2....49.5m
F800GS 7.5m/s2....51.3m
GSX650F 7.5m/s2....51.4m
'Blade 7.5m/s2....51.8m
Tiger 7.3m/s2....52.6m
1400GTR 7.1m/s2....54.1m
H-D 6.2m/s2....62.1m
The Tiger and H_D systems were viewed as emergency-aids.
The others feature faster acting Valves, which resulted in data above.
The mag. did a similar test in '06. It says that the stars then would be bringing up the rear of these results.
So, when a professional rider couldn't beat the big Beemers ABS in the dry and the same bike could achieve 96% of a g in the wet.. Would you buy it?
DB.
Cars crashed in the old days with fixed steering columns - the same as your 'spike' idea (not a very new or novel one). No seatbelts, no impact protection, crossply tyres, crap brakes etc. Seems like this should have been utopia with no accidents at all because everyone was driving perfectly at all times
If you are a human, get ABS and it may (or may not) save your life. If you are a riding god, don't bother. I have ABS.
I wonder where the standard airheads would be?
They've all been upgraded haven't they Still, wonder where my '53 servo/ABS 1150GS would be, they were regarded as good at their time.
They've all been upgraded haven't they Still, wonder where my '53 servo/ABS 1150GS would be, they were regarded as good at their time.
They don't need ABS as it presumes you can lock the wheels with the brakes
There again you might be able to lock them on ice, but then locking the brakes is probably the least of your worries.Might be able to lock the wheels if you put a scafolding pole in the spokes
Hughesy
Guest
Go with ABS or the only skid bigger will be in your joxxers. And as mutley said you can always turn it off.
Lets put the clock back 25 years and ask a similar question.
I,m thinking of buying a new bike,but it's got hydraulic disc brakes,i understand that good riders should consider that cable operated drum brakes
are fine and these new fangled disc brakes are much more complex and for those who don't really know how to ride properly.
ABS of course go for a bike with abs.
Steve
I,m thinking of buying a new bike,but it's got hydraulic disc brakes,i understand that good riders should consider that cable operated drum brakes
are fine and these new fangled disc brakes are much more complex and for those who don't really know how to ride properly.
ABS of course go for a bike with abs.
Steve
Lets put the clock back 25 years and ask a similar question.
I,m thinking of buying a new bike,but it's got hydraulic disc brakes,i understand that good riders should consider that cable operated drum brakes
are fine and these new fangled disc brakes are much more complex and for those who don't really know how to ride properly.
ABS of course go for a bike with abs.
Steve
But of course 25 years ago those first disc brakes didn't errr mmm work in the wet, they were lethal
Phil Clarke
Registered user
Seems to me if you have ABS you will use it and if you haven't you wont...
I'm not a riding god and until my latest GS neither had it or needed it. Why did I get it on this one? Because it was there.
If you can afford it get it if you can't you'll still love the bike
I'm not a riding god and until my latest GS neither had it or needed it. Why did I get it on this one? Because it was there.
If you can afford it get it if you can't you'll still love the bike
nix
Guest
Incredible how many people who don't understand what AS does, particularly those who think it's macho not to have it.
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