It’s a tall rounder .
What kind of Adventure style bike would you like Yamaha to make?
- Thread starter longdog
- Start date
Yamaha (and me) disagree.
Like having five valves per cylinder when everyone else got by perfectly well on using four?
Or making a hub centre steered front end on a model that didn't sell ?
Ok, so you wished Yamaha produced a ‘ Tall rounder ‘ .
What’s a tall rounder in your book ?
The whole MT09 range of bikes not only share an engine they are all f****** hideous to look at. Great bikes by all account but I couldn't bring myself to put one in the garage.
I know what you're saying. If it was a woman, my MT09SP would probably come under the "challenging wank" category. It is does have a "nice personality" though if you like a challenge. Since purchase, I have come to admire it's looks a lot. I don't think I could ever love the Tracer 9. The 7 is a bit better.
Perhaps pretty much all Japanese bikes look weird to oldies, Kawasaki Z900RS aside? The non retro Z900 looks like a tube of toothpaste squeezed by a maniac IMO.
Actually I was looking at an MT09SP in Tenerife last year, the latest facelift, and I did think it looked quite nice in blue so I am maybe being a bit harshI know what you're saying. If it was a woman, my MT09SP would probably come under the "challenging wank" category. It is does have a "nice personality" though if you like a challenge. Since purchase, I have come to admire it's looks a lot. I don't think I could ever love the Tracer 9. The 7 is a bit better.
Perhaps pretty much all Japanese bikes look weird to oldies, Kawasaki Z900RS aside? The non retro Z900 looks like a tube of toothpaste squeezed by a maniac IMO.
Ok, I see where you’re coming from .
A Tenere 900 World Raid would be good but probably silly money
I'm amazed they've not already made something like that.
Yamaha have quite a gap in their dual sport / adventure line to fill. All they offer are the Tenere' 700, a 125, and the antique TW200. I think there's a market for a 350-400cc single or twin dual sport and maybe make an "adventure" version with larger tank, rack, and windshield. Also an adventure bike based on the CP3 engine with a wide ratio gearbox, 19" front, 21+ liter tank, etc, seems obvious.
Larry Langford
Registered user
I would also like to see more dual sport adv bikes that don't have motocross levels of suspension, you know something like 7 to 8 inches. like the old XT 500, which was one of the great sliders. It seems that everything seems to have the taller suspension, like say for instance the R1200 G/S or even the new 450 gs. They have them sitting way taller then is needed for 99 percent of buyers, even to go fast, imo. The really ironic thing about it, it would make them far better trail bikes. Much easier to handle off road in situations where you have washouts and the like that weren't there the last time you were there, you know like surprises.
Also, again a big single that is more practical than the husky 701 or even the 500. Something built for long mileage and low maintenance, with a larger fuel tank. I don't mind the 21" up front but it does limit tire choice. And very good but medium level of suspension.
Also there seems to be a strategy by most manufacturer's to push designs into a very specialized niche with few options to modify or fit and customize. Like say the option to run full luggage has basically been removed from the bmw rs now and the it doesn't look like the G/S rear triangle will take a lot of weight, or even have a vario bag set for it. All they did was make a great hooligan bike out of it for their advertisements videos. They surely don't want it to compete with the 1300 as a solid long distance dirt capable bike that you can get luggage for ..... just opinions
I agree, unless one wants to race or ride fast over rough stuff 7-8" of good suspension is plenty. That's what the Himalayan 450 has and it gets praised for its suspension. I'd like to see more of these bikes designed from the ground up as dual sports with shorter dry sump engines and wide ratio gearing rather than bikes like T700 and KLE 500 which are adapted from street bikes with tall engines. Using tall engines requires reduced ground clearance or peg to seat room, or raise the seat height. And the CR gearing that works fine for a street bike is a problem on dual sports or adventure bikes.
Larry Langford
Registered user
Yes the Himmy ticks more boxes than most bikes do. I was thinking of it while writing the last post. It seems to be a very versatile bike for the money. The 450 version is running 40 hp, which is pretty respectable. And it doesn't sit on motocross level of suspension, making it very handy I'm sure in tight places. But for street riding the 74 hp husky would be much more adept on freeways with very fast moving traffic. But still my old xt500 only had about 30 hp stock. A K/N with a super trap did net more performance but how much is just a guess. The xt was fine with the 55 speed limit, but I'm sure it would be under powered on the modern high speed freeway or toll road. It would run 100 most of the time. Other folks also road raced them in the open superbike class at the time. With an exceptional rider they dominated. The race folks eventually made up the colorado class which consisted of big dirt bike singles lowered and wheeled for road racing. This had the desired effect to get those bikes out of open superbike, which was very embarrassing for the four pot guy's.
I myself motocrossed the XT500 quite a bit as practice on small and very tight tracks out here in the west. I was only bested a couple of times in spite of the motocrossers were 490s by that time and very fast of course. The XT just really put the power to the ground. I got passed one time near broomfield co on a small practice track. The guy was a veteran motocrosser and basically used his tires to best me. There were deep ruts that had developed on the track and he was able to get more power to the ground using those ruts and his knobies. With my trials tires I had to stay away from the ruts, just power sliding to the outside or inside of the deep ruts, but it wasn't fast enough to beat that veteran motocrosser. The TT 500 was also starting the eventual move to 4 stroke engines in motocross, in spite of lower suspension, and it was still a great slider, like the XT. I did all my riding on the xt with trials tires, common at the time. I rode the xt to the tracks with a large set of leather saddlebags that I would remove at the track and just set them down in the pit. One time found this new track to me, over on the west side of denver. I pulled up and took off my coats and the saddlebags and got ready to take it out. There was a group of 3 wheelers there and they seen me with my enduro and got exited as they thought they finally had someone to beat, lol. I didn't just beat them but just destroyed everyone there even the full on motocrossers. When I came snarling up behind the three wheelers they just pulled off track. The big four stroke motor sound is intimidating. Thing is this track was super tight and had several nasty jumps in it. The XT had no business there really, no long straight-a-way, no fast sweeper just tight motocross. I was only bested there eventually by these kids that were riding honda 200r's. they followed me a lot and learned the advanced line from me, and then were able to pass me at a particular nasty jump that I had to slow a little for .... even a 300 lb bike can be very heavy at times ... you can go fast with 7 to 8 inches of travel, even very fast. ..... I also hill climbed the bike for hours on end and did two different hill climbs officially. One at sturgis south dakota, where i was said to be the highest on the hill with a street legal tires and bike. The other was in Casper, open class against all the 430 motocrossers. I was placed 7th with a bad spot for sure, but I won the crowd response by leaps and bounds, with a long car horn salute, the only one of the day. Long story this post is way too long anyway .....
XT 1000 with some of the original XT looks but modernised.
Larry Langford
Registered user
Well I guess one could make it into a Vee twin with two 500 jugs ..... but this would increase the weight a lot ..... I think the newer fuel injection into really high compression 4-valve head would net way more power than the old carb bike with two valves. Maybe even a shift cam .... The 500 husky is very close to this already. But it is a high maintenance schedule measured in hours bike so prolly not as handy for a dual sport. Yamaha also made several newer versions of the XT with 4 valves and 600 or more cc's. But they are all on the stilts so to speak which will detract from the high speed dirt handling, especially power sliding imo. Another thing that would work better than most would think is to keep the push rods, and retain a longer stroke, like the milwaukee 8. You don't really need overhead cams on low revving long stroke motors. This would make a very small and short but powerful motor, especially with the fuel injection and high compression four valve head. Of course the shift cam might not work that well down in the block.
Another thing I would like to see is a smaller lighter version of the 1250 shift cam boxer. Like a 750 or maybe a 900. The 1250 does seem to have power to spare as the computer is always restricting the power anyway, in most cases. With modern tech this could still have very impressive performance. And not put it on stilts lol, or restrict the frame build so that there is only one niche for the bike, but one like the himmy which can be modified by the owner to be a tourer or a cafe racer whatever you want just like the old airheads. Funny my old airhead has 7 to 8 inches of travel, there it is again.
imho, they already make the perfect adv bike in the Tracer 9GT (marketed more as a sports tourer). Most adv bike owners I know rarely if ever go off road, and even those that do could do most of their fire trail or similar surfaces on a road focussed bike anyway. Ticks all the boxes for me. Gutsy triple, ample power, comfortable, well equipped, decent luggage, great riding position, sensible seat height, nimble enough for tight corners on singletrack roads (think stretches of NC500) and stable enough for spirited A road riding, relaxed enough for long motorway runs. As with just about all adv bikes owned or ridden, it would make a pleasant change for wind protection which isn't a styling afterthought as most I've ridden suffer with turbulent air flow and all of mine have had to have screen changes to help with that.
For more all round ability and some serious off road use, I'd still be looking at a middleweight twin or triple of some description fitted with suitable suspension, wheels and tyres.
For more all round ability and some serious off road use, I'd still be looking at a middleweight twin or triple of some description fitted with suitable suspension, wheels and tyres.
Xtz750 for me please.....something like this.
