Why we need wider tyres

turnipbmw

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I guess you have always wondered, that if the co-efficient of friction is relative to friction and load why do we need wider tyres ?

Just found this in cycle World by Kevin Cameron.

There are various "laws of friction" and coulomb friction is only one of them.
It behaves as described, such that the contact area makes no difference.
But in fact, rubber's actual area of contact with any surface does not increase linearly with load, as in coulomb friction.
Rubber generates a lot of contact area with the first pound per square inch of applied load, less for the second psi and so on.
Because of this, a greater contact area and a lower specific load in psi can generate greater grip than a smaller contact area and a greater specific load.
This is why racing car tyres are now 18-20 inches wide rather than 3 inches wide as they were in 1915.
Elasticity of rubber arises from the thermal action of its long chain molecules, which are like a zillion whirling "jump-ropes". The centrifugal force of the whirling jumprope draws the ends together .
As we strech rubber, we are pulling the jumpropes out to a flatter contour.
This also explains why rubber deforms easily at first, then stiffens as strain increases.
Part of rubber friction is generated by short range intermolecular forces acting between its molecules and those of the mating surface. Another part is generated by actual mechanical interlock caused by the conformation of the soft rubber to the asperities of a rough surface.
Rubber acting on clean, fire polished glass may display friction coefficients as high as 10 while on old wet pavement it may be less than 0.3.
its really wonderful, peculiar stuff.
 
Proof of the saying 'If you can't blind them with science,baffle them with bullshit'.
 
None of this relevent to motorcycle tyres.

We have "lean" . Cars don't. On bikes thin tyres quicken the steering, wide tyres slow it down.
 
thats probaly why my R1100s feels so horrible at low speed compared to my GS.

I often wonder which would be quicker round a track.
 
None of this relevent to motorcycle tyres.

We have "lean" . Cars don't. On bikes thin tyres quicken the steering, wide tyres slow it down.

So why do we have bigger tyres then? All the articles I've read about tyres go on about using bigger tyres for a bigger contact patch, increasing the amount of force that can be exerted for acceleration, braking or cornering.

As you say, bikes lean, which then limits the size of the contact patch, and that's why cars with 4 big contact patches can beat bikes around some circuits.

I don't disagree about your arguments, they're true, but I'd like to know why you think the original article isn't relevant.
 
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This is why racing car tyres are now 18-20 inches wide rather than 3 inches wide as they were in 1915.
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I don't disagree about your arguments, they're true, but I'd like to know why you think the original article isn't relevant.

it is relevant, but as in the section of the article quited above - it's more to do with car tyres than bike tyres. And as i posted - "None of this relevent to MOTORCYCLE TYRES". Not irrelevant "per se"
 
So why do we have bigger tyres then? All the articles I've read about tyres go on about using bigger tyres for a bigger contact patch, increasing the amount of force that can be exerted for acceleration, braking or cornering.

It's widely acknowledged that some sports bikes are "over-tired" and that by going down from a 190 to a 180 section tyre, handling is improved even if your bragging rights about the size of your rubber are not :D
 
it is relevant, but as in the section of the article quited above - it's more to do with car tyres than bike tyres. And as i posted - "None of this relevent to MOTORCYCLE TYRES". Not irrelevant "per se"

Nope, still don't understand what you're getting at.

The article is basically saying why rubber doesn't conform to simplistic physics (where the amount of friction doesn't depend on the surface area) and mentions some reasons why. Today's motorbike tyres are a lot bigger than they used to be, and one of the reasons for that is the size of the contact patch, as well as for strength and springing. Making the tyre bigger increases the contact patch, increasing the force that can be exerted between the tyre and the road, so surely it is relevant. Just because the article is more obviously related to cars doesn't mean that it doesn't apply to bike tyres.

There are obviously other factors involved that mean you shouldn't put too big a tyre on, including the effect on gearing, steering, and increasing unsprung weight, which is why you don't see 300mm Avon's on GP bikes.
 


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