Yes or no. Scottish residents only please

[Devon]

In general however, you are correct: when faced with a choice between the interests of Scotland and the perceived interests of England, the London political nexus will always sacrifice Scotland. That's why I will be voting YES next week.

No amount of money could make up for the nation's sense of betrayal, however. Many Scots believed that their chance of independence had been deliberately sabotaged by the English, and the resentment this fostered played no small part in the Jacobite rebellions which were to plague the Union.


Small country BOUGHT out by larger country
Bit like a hostile merger and aquisition
The people/general populace had NO say in the matter.
NOW that it looks close enough to be of concern to "the establishment"
We are being promised control of our OWN country back. HAH
FOOLS if we are taken in again. Like when we were told there was ONLY 2 Gallons of oil in the north sea and it would be gone in short order

Excuse me After you lot fecked up big time with the Darien fiasco, England and Scotland joined to create one of the most formidable partnerships the world has ever seen. Between us we conquered a huge part of the world and shaped it and civilised it (compared to say the Spanish, French, Dutch and Germans) and most of our colonies generally for the better.

Fair enough our dogs have had their day and there are now other bigger players that dominate. I would actually welcome an independent Scotland because that would give the English the opportunity to be independent.

The problem is Scotland has no plan and it should have and it needs one. Otherwise it will feck up again.

For example, lets consider what will happen to Scotland's banks and businesses when it becomes independent and has no central bank or currency it can control?

What will happen when Scotland breaks up the UK and can't join (and immediately surrender its independence to) the well fecked EU?

What will happen to Scotland when Shetland and Orkney join with Norway or the Remaining UK and take all their oil and fisheries with them?

Anyone voting for Independence care to hazard a guess?

 

[AberdeenAngus]

Aberdeen remains a Labour stronghold, and having seen what they do on a social well-being front, I'm quite supportive of Labour in Scotland. In fact if I lived in Scotland I would vote Labour for my local Council.

But transfer yourself to national rather than local government, and England in particular, and Labour is a different beast. After what Gordon Brown did, first to my pension scheme, and then to government borrowing... I'd rather hammer nails through my scrotum than vote Labour.



I see you thought better of this post and deleted it, unfortunately not before someone else had quoted it. By all means feel free to 'ignore' me and anyone else you whose views you don't agree with, then you will only get to see the lovey messages of support (irrespective of the true views of this thread).

I have six relatives living in Aberdeen, and many close friends. Scotland is a country to which I have great affinity, so I'm sad to see it being riven by this vote.

The actions of proto Nazis such as Siol nan Gaidhea bring disrepute to the 'yes" vote, it's the brown shirts of Ernst Röhm's Sturmabteilung all over again. The independence they desire is akin to isolation, do you really want racist fascists deciding the direction of your country? Let's hope the voting booths will be protected against their thuggery. I don't want my wife's 93-year-old mother intimidated at the polls (especially as I know which way she would vote).

Tim
I only deleted it because I had reposted it as a 'Reply with quote'.
I am not putting anyone on ignore because of their viewpoint.
I am putting folk on ignore who are being a twat about the whole thing.
Would never apply to you, old boy.

 

[Lord Snooty]

Not only total rubbish but irresponsible to boot. I have neither seen nor heard tell of any evidence of any form of intimidation around the country. Siol nan ghaideal are virtually non existent and I doubt that they comprise more than a handful across the country. Certainly, a few cyber Nats have exceeded their briefs and at least one Better Together politician got a Prescotting. In other words, exactly the same level of debate as at a General Election. The difference is that large numbers who have not previously been politically engaged have become engaged by the referendum debate.

It is totally irresponsible to spread rumours of intimidation in this manner. If you have evidence for ANY such concerns then contact Police Scotland immediately rather than spread stories on the internet.

Take a look here Peter, they are quite open about their intimidation and anti-English racism.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11079296/Anti-English-racists-terrorising-the-No-campaign-in-Scotland.html

 

[Blackal]

Take a look here Peter, they are quite open about their intimidation and anti-English racism.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11079296/Anti-English-racists-terrorising-the-No-campaign-in-Scotland.html

It appears to be both camps - but your quote probably suits your agenda better................

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...in-from-supporters-of-both-sides-9704743.html

Al

 

[Blackal]

What will happen to Scotland when Shetland and Orkney join with Norway or the Remaining UK and take all their oil and fisheries with them?

Anyone voting for Independence care to hazard a guess?

Since neither The Shetland Isles or Orkney Isles are actual countries - I'm not convinced that there exists any istrument which allows them to go their own way.

Al

 

[Packer]

Since neither The Shetland Isles or Orkney Isles are actual countries - I'm not convinced that there exists any istrument which allows them to go their own way.

Al

Scotland:-

Small country BOUGHT out by larger country
Bit like a hostile merger and aquisition
The people/general populace had NO say in the matter.

Shetland:-

Part of a country gifted to another country.
Bit like a forced sale.
The people/general populace had NO say in the matter.

Would an independent Scotland deny the islanders; Shetland, Orkney, Hebrides; the same right to choose as they were given?

 

[Ronno]

Scotland:-

Small country BOUGHT out by larger country
Bit like a hostile merger and aquisition
The people/general populace had NO say in the matter.

Shetland:-

Part of a country gifted to another country.
Bit like a forced sale.
The people/general populace had NO say in the matter.

Would an independent Scotland deny the islanders; Shetland, Orkney, Hebrides; the same right to choose as they were given?

Instead of posting bollocks on here, might I suggest you do what you actually know something about and that is bottling and labelling whisky.

Specifically ours.

Thank you

 

[Posh Pete]

Take a look here Peter, they are quite open about their intimidation and anti-English racism.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11079296/Anti-English-racists-terrorising-the-No-campaign-in-Scotland.html

Oh they do exist but they are a tiny number. Doubtless some have harassed Better Together speakers. Maybe it was one of them who was charged with assault for egging Jim Murphy. They are no more representative of opinion up here than the EDL are of opinion down south.

As regards Shetland etc leaving Scotland. There's no evidence in any polls I have seen. All the outer isles have in fact done very well out of devolution (ret on ferries, abolition of tolls on the Skye Bridge etc). Why would they want to leave an independent Scotland?

 

[ianboydsnr]

Oh they do exist but they are a tiny number. Doubtless some have harassed Better Together speakers. Maybe it was one of them who was charged with assault for egging Jim Murphy. They are no more representative of opinion up here than the EDL are of opinion down south.

As regards Shetland etc leaving Scotland. There's no evidence in any polls I have seen. All the outer isles have in fact done very well out of devolution (ret on ferries, abolition of tolls on the Skye Bridge etc). Why would they want to leave an independent Scotland?

so they own the oil fields to the north presumably!

they will get little benefit from it otherwise!

 

[Lord Snooty]

It appears to be both camps - but your quote probably suits your agenda better................

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...in-from-supporters-of-both-sides-9704743.html

Al

I don't have an agenda, Peter said that he hadn't heard of any anti-no harassment I merely found a link that demonstrates that it is going on. Of course I could have spent hours finding counter arguments in order to allay your paranoia but frankly I couldn't be arsed

 

[Posh Pete]

so they own the oil fields to the north presumably!

they will get little benefit from it otherwise!

No. The oil fields are in Scotland's segment of the North Sea / NE Atlantic. They'll get the benefit of access to oil revenues and the new oil fund and, above all else, the right to vote for representatives and governments in the Scottish Parliament who will make these decisions. At the moment, the UK coalition does this. Shetland will probably vote to stay in the union but the other islands will not , I suspect. And even Shetland is not guaranteed ... http://www.shetnews.co.uk/features/...9213-how-will-shetland-vote-on-referendum-day

 

[ianboydsnr]

No. The oil fields are in Scotland's segment of the North Sea / NE Atlantic. They'll get the benefit of access to oil revenues and the new oil fund and, above all else, the right to vote for representatives and governments in the Scottish Parliament who will make these decisions. At the moment, the UK coalition does this. Shetland will probably vote to stay in the union but the other islands will not , I suspect. And even Shetland is not guaranteed ... http://www.shetnews.co.uk/features/...9213-how-will-shetland-vote-on-referendum-day

sorry I thought there were big reserves off Shetland,

http://newsnetscotland.com/index.ph...s-off-scotlands-west-coast-set-to-be-examined


sounds like it's just a different thief, who will waste it on promoting the capital!

I truly hope you get independance as a country, I for one think it would benefit Cumbria

 

[Packer]

Instead of posting bollocks on here, might I suggest you do what you actually know something about and that is bottling and labelling whisky.

Specifically ours.

Thank you

Thread hijack, Bhud has updates. I liked the whisky so much I drank it all End hijack.

 

[Ronno]

Thread hijack, Bhud has updates. I liked the whisky so much I drank it all End hijack.

This was always my fear

 

[Ian J Hartley]

In the 300 years since we formed the Union. The United Kingdom has formed an empire. The residue of that empire still exists, and there are numerouse Crown Colonies / Dependant Terratories around the planet that would look to us for assistance in times of need.

We the British people have global responsibilities, not just to these people, who are are decendants but to other nations as well, fortunately or unfortunately that is the baggage of once having an Empire.

We cannot, and would not, and should not ever walk away from these responsibilities no matter what, for to do so is a betrayal of every thing we have stood for over the years.

Now I know that those dependencies in their time of need will not find the UK government wanting. Such is our history. But I'm not so sure about what assistance if any would come from an independent Scotland, and I doubt anyone knows.

We may squabble amongst ourselves. And some of the stuff on the media and in the Forums is pretty uneddifing. But rest assured, there are alot of anxious people out there, who are depending on us to get this right.

 

[Den]

Excuse me After you lot fecked up big time with the Darien fiasco, England and Scotland joined to create one of the most formidable partnerships the world has ever seen.

And who did all they could to fuck up the Darien project? Yes ... the English! Yes it was flawed, but your government made sure it couldn't work.

 

[Devon]

And who did all they could to fuck up the Darien project? Yes ... the English! Yes it was flawed, but your government made sure it couldn't work.

Who did all they could to fuck up the Darien project? Yes the English and Spanish did their bit but why wouldn't they? They wouldn't want the Scots competing against them but the biggest contributors to the Darien fuck up were the Scottish. Much like the present plans for 'independence' which are surreal rather then real and would be a disaster on a similar scale to Darien simply because like Darien, Scotland's independence dream is so flawed, ill considered, ill provisioned and ill planned it could never work.
Hopefully in the future Scots will ignore the rabid Nats with their silly sense of grievance and allow a group of grown ups to formulate a proper plan for real independence that involves working amiably with their neighbours. Of course by the time this happens all the oil will be gone so it will be a little less easy then if that had happened now.

 

[Tim Cullis]

It seems a lot of the ill-feeling in Scotland seems to be due to Salmond stirring up a dislike of Westminster.

This is despite having Scotland having its own devolved assembly. As does Northern Ireland. As does Wales.

How do you think the English feel, though? We don't even have a devolved assembly.

Westminster is all we have, but whenever there's decisions to be made that only affect England, everybody and their mother gets to stick their nose in. This was particularly galling when Gordon Brown was in charge. I am lost to understand why Scottish, Irish and Welsh MPs should have a say in—for example—the plans for London airport? If anything this should be a decision for just London MPs, or even better, left to the London Assembly and good old Boris.

Given that Scotland represents less than 9% of the population of the UK it has done extremely well in the number of Scottish Prime Ministers leading Westminster—Balfour, Campbell-Bannerman, Ramsey McDonald, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown and David Cameron.

(Oh yes, Donald Cameron of Locheil, head of the Cameron clan, says he's proud to claim David Cameron as a member of the clan. )

 

[Packer]

Interesting that the Yes campaigners haven't really made a very big deal about oil finds around Shetland. The Clair Ridge project described by BP as a "truly giant field" will be coming on stream soon projecting 100,000 barrels a day and expected to produce until 2050.

Anxious not to make it look as though it's all about oil?

 

[Toddy]

RBS

The more the No campaign desperately peddle their scare stories, the more people discover that we can’t believe a word they say.