1200 Adv fuel pump repair

At £30 and a no quibble returns policy if it isn't the right one.

What have you to lose, well apart from the time fitting it and £30 ?

Go for it, and please let everyone know if it works.

Every little bit helps 😀

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My thought too. Its expected to arrive this week. By then I might have dropped the fuel level low enough to get the pump out of the tank.

I have a non standard fuel level gauge (so fuel pump stays in low power mode), so it will be interesting to see if the new pump is good enough to empty the tank right hand side.
 
The box arrived today and it looks good quality stuff. The pump has a good weighty feel and the rubber parts are good and thick. It seems to be at least OEM quality. Time will tell when I get it fitted.
 
My throttles are balanced but it still ticks over unevenly and prone to stalling when cold. It also runs out of fuel with 2 gallons stuck in the tank right hand side. Ive just fitted the replacement pump motor from eBay. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121906385116?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

With the tank below 1/4 full, remove the bodywork including tank top cover. The job looks possible with the tank top cover in place but it's much easier with full access.

Disconnect the electrical connectors to the fuel pump and fuel gauge and unplug the fuel pipe.

The pump is retained by a large pressed steel ring nut as used on car fuel tanks. Tap it around with a large blunt screwdriver. The pump will be stuck into its sealing gasket. I used a blunt screw driver at the front LH where there is a locating lug to lever it up. DON'T dig into the gasket or you'll be buying a new one. There is also a tag that you can grab with pliers. Plumbers pipe pliers are ideal.

Once it's out, unplug the fuel gauge wiring connector and lift the pump away.

The pump wiring connector is the usual stuff use a small screwdriver to release the tag and slide the connector out. Mine was really tight.
The supplied fuel hose is seems too short but also unlikely to follow the tight bends without kinking. Thankfully, the OEM hose can be extracted from the pump outlet stub.

I was concerned to not break off the stub pipe so used a Dremel cutting disc to slice the crimped hose clip at it's folded tag. Make sure wires etc are moved out of the way as the disc can jump and the wires are thin. Uncurl the clip and throw away.

The OEM hose is quite stiff but can be eased up the stub pipe by levering the end with a flat blade screwdriver. Avoid pliers as they risk puncturing the tube.

To get the pump out of it's hanger you will need to remove the intake filter. It's held by a press on clip washer. I ended up just levering it off. The pump simply slides out.

The new pump is both longer and slightly fatter than the OEM pump. The kit has some moulded rubber parts but I could not see how they could work in the BMW system. I did not want the pump to sit deeper than standard so used the OEM pump carrier.

The pump carrier has six ribs down the inside. I used the Dremel with a burr cutter to trim them flat. A sharp narrow chisel might be easier but mine are buried at the back of garage. Trim the ribs down until the pump will slide into the holder. The top tags can't clip it in so don't trim the ribs too much. The intake screen is retained by a press on star washer supplied in the kit. Fit it AFTER the pump is in its carrier. The intake is towards the front.

At the top end spray the electrical connector with silicone and plug it in. The OEM hose can now be fitted. Slip the two supplied worm clips onto the hose before fitting to the pump.

Make sure the pump rubber mounts are connected solidly and it's good to go.

Grease the INSIDE of the sealing gasket with red rubber grease or silicone grease. Vaseline or normal grease might damage the rubber gasket so best avoided. Also grease the pump filter body. Connect the fuel gauge wiring connector and fit the pump into the fuel tank. If you don't feel the sliding resistance all the way in the gasket may have shifted. It's hard to be sure but the pump should slide in easily. The ring nut can now go on. Turn it backwards and be sure its not cross threads before hand tightening. Tap it around about 1/4 turn to fully tighten. Plug in the wires and fuel pipe and see if the engine will start.

Mine seems to run more smoothly but I'm yet to test ride. Do this before fitting the body work. A couple of sudden braking will slosh fuel about. Any leaks mean you'll need to reseat the pump.

Perceptions of the fuel pump kit -
The pump is a little heavier than the OEM pump as it should be - its a bit longer. The intake screen is well made. The worm clips are just the right size. Anything slightly big will go D shape and cause leaks.

The moulded rubber parts have no purpose that I could see, but there are no written instructions so who knows. The fuel hose is too short for direct connection but if your OEM hose is damaged you will be better to bend some 10mm copper pipe to a suitable shape and use short bits of hose to join everything up.

There is also an electrical connector which could be used in place of the OEM wires if needed.

Test ride pending this seems to be a good way to replace a weak fuel pump.
 
Ok so it's been tested.
The bike feels smoother
Low speed throttle control is better less on/off
No stalling when cold
Less stuttering at low revs
Bad news it ran out of fuel early though not as bad as the old pump.
Next job to work out the fuel strip resistance values across scale.


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The bike ran out last night - fine because I was carrying spare fuel and I needed to see if it could empty the tank. The gauge was reading 39/100.

Ive just filled the spare can and the fuel tank with well over 35 litres, so the new pump is clearly emptying it. The gauge was not reading its usual empty so presumably its got disturbed when I refitted the fuel pump.

So we have it. A bike with faulty fuel gauge that runs out of fuel sooner than it should most likely has a weak fuel pump. Replacement is easy enough with the pump motor only repair kit.
 
Bendy toy said:
The bike ran out last night - fine because I was carrying spare fuel and I needed to see if it could empty the tank. The gauge was reading 39/100.

Ive just filled the spare can and the fuel tank with well over 35 litres, so the new pump is clearly emptying it. The gauge was not reading its usual empty so presumably its got disturbed when I refitted the fuel pump.

So we have it. A bike with faulty fuel gauge that runs out of fuel sooner than it should most likely has a weak fuel pump. Replacement is easy enough with the pump motor only repair kit.
Click to expand...

All useful info. for storing on the hard drive for future reference. Thankyou :thumb2
 
Bendy toy said:
The bike ran out last night - fine because I was carrying spare fuel and I needed to see if it could empty the tank. The gauge was reading 39/100.

Ive just filled the spare can and the fuel tank with well over 35 litres, so the new pump is clearly emptying it. The gauge was not reading its usual empty so presumably its got disturbed when I refitted the fuel pump.

So we have it. A bike with faulty fuel gauge that runs out of fuel sooner than it should most likely has a weak fuel pump. Replacement is easy enough with the pump motor only repair kit.
Click to expand...

I can also confirm this, even if fitted with a float gauge - I replaced the pump unit as mine was occasionally running out with 2 gallons remaining in the tank. The replacement fuel pump fixed this.

Sorry for not sending you the spare over Bendy, have had a lot going on.
 
Bendy toy said:
The bike feels smoother
Low speed throttle control is better less on/off
Click to expand...

Is this only applicable to the GSA or would a GS benefit from a simple pump renewal? I'm not familiar with the pump setup, but is the pressure to the injectors determined by a fuel pressure regulator or just the fuel pump controller? My GS has passed 70,000 miles and £30 for a new pump seems a small cost if it helps smooth out a little lumpy running.
 
The pump is the same style as used in cars.
Used pumps cost £80 on eBay who knows what a new one costs.
The regulator limits maximum pressure at the injectors. I don't have a GS-911 to see if fuel pressure is measured but it appears the bike will run with low fuel pressure.
Low fuel pressure on the GSA leaves fuel trapped on the right side of the tank. Excess fuel flow is used to properly empty the tank. The GS has a smaller tank so It might not have the same issue. Running out of fuel at fewer miles than you'd expect is the symptom.
Don't forget to check things like ignition coils throttle balance etc.
 
Bendy toy said:
The pump is the same style as used in cars.
Used pumps cost £80 on eBay who knows what a new one costs.
The regulator limits maximum pressure at the injectors. I don't have a GS-911 to see if fuel pressure is measured but it appears the bike will run with low fuel pressure.
Low fuel pressure on the GSA leaves fuel trapped on the right side of the tank. Excess fuel flow is used to properly empty the tank. The GS has a smaller tank so It might not have the same issue. Running out of fuel at fewer miles than you'd expect is the symptom.
Don't forget to check things like ignition coils throttle balance etc.
Click to expand...

A fuel pressure regulator and a fuel pump controller are not the same. Traditionally a fuel injection system has a pumped feed from the tank to a fuel rail, plus a return back to the tank. The pressure at the injectors is maintained at a constant by the fuel pressure regulator, enabling fuelling to be controlled by opening the injectors for differing duration, determined by information to the ecu from the throttle position sensor and the rpm.
Some quick research shows that the R1200 setup is not the same in that due to environmental requirements it doesn't have a return feed to the tank - a continually recirculating fuel flow causes warming of the fuel and increased evaporation. With only a one-way feed to the injectors, a fuel pressure controller is therefore used to vary the speed of the fuel pump. This will maintain a "constant" pressure at the injectors as rpm changes.
I can only surmise that if your old pump was tired it's ability to pump consistently at lower rpm would suffer, causing lumpiness. One issue that may exist with a non-OE pump is that it's flow for a set voltage input may not be the same as the original which would mess up the fuelling across the rev range, although I imagine with time the signals from the Lambda sensors would gradually correct this within the ecu.
 
What a load of pish. R1200GSA fuel pump pumps to a fuel rail with a built pressure regulator and excess fuel is returned back to the right side off the tank and through a sucking jet venturi which syphons the fuel from the right side over to the left. Lack of or poor function of fuel pump means poor return flow, which is what operates the fuel transfer. R1200gsa has a pump controller and a pressure regulator. It is the pump controller that varies the pump speed and the bike has a return feed to the tank.
 
Kenny Rodkiss said:
What a load of pish. R1200GSA fuel pump pumps to a fuel rail with a built pressure regulator and excess fuel is returned back to the right side off the tank and through a sucking jet venturi which syphons the fuel from the right side over to the left. Lack of or poor function of fuel pump means poor return flow, which is what operates the fuel transfer. R1200gsa has a pump controller and a pressure regulator. It is the pump controller that varies the pump speed and the bike has a return feed to the tank.
Click to expand...

But not the GS.
 
More of your misinformation? This thread is about GSA. The standard GS has the same fuel rail with a 4 bar pressure regulator with a return feed to the tank. There does not appear to be a sucking jet pump on the standard GS but everything else is the same.
 
Kenny Rodkiss said:
What a load of pish. R1200GSA fuel pump pumps to a fuel rail with a built pressure regulator and excess fuel is returned back to the right side off the tank and through a sucking jet venturi which syphons the fuel from the right side over to the left. Lack of or poor function of fuel pump means poor return flow, which is what operates the fuel transfer. R1200gsa has a pump controller and a pressure regulator. It is the pump controller that varies the pump speed and the bike has a return feed to the tank.
Click to expand...

My net search threw up this info .....

Here's the actual function of the controller. It does not reduce the voltage to the pump, to extend pump life. In all BMW bikes that use a fuel rail that has no return line, the fuel rail has a pressure sensor. As the throttle is opened and closed, varying amounts of fuel are used, so a constant-speed pump would not keep the required constant fuel rail pressure.

In this system, the fuel rail pressure sensor sends a signal to the controller, which causes the controller to vary the average voltage it feeds to the pump to keep pressure constant. If the throttle is opened, more fuel is used, and in order to keep the fuel pressure constant, the controller increases the average voltage fed to the pump, which makes the pump speed up to maintain fuel pressure.
When the throttle is closed, the reverse occurs

I think I saw this information in the Bosch "bible" publication on FI and motor management systems. Anyway, to sum up, you may recall that there are two different types of inlet port injection systems......
First is the traditional electronic injection, where a positive displacement "roller cell" pump, pumps fuel into the fuel rail. The injectors take what they need, and the remainder is forced through a pressure regulator and back to the tank. The regulator is a simple mechanical one that provides a constant backpressure (about 40-45 psi usually) for the fuel rail. This type has been used since Bosch made its first electronic injection system (the D-Jetronic system originally used in the 1968 VW Squareback). It's main advantage is that it's simple! Its main disadvantage is that the fuel picks up heat as it is constantly circulated past the motor. This results in increased fuel tank temperatures and increased fuel evaporation. Recent strict EPA limits on this resulted in the so-called Non-Return system I described in my earlier comments.

As a way to solve fuel tank heating and subsequent increased evaporative emissions, the Non-Return system I described has become more common in the last few years. As I mentioned earlier, this consists of a variable speed, NON-positive displacement turbine pump, whose speed (and pressure) is electronically controlled by pressure sensor feedback in order to maintain constant fuel pressure, inder all conditions of fuel flow to the injectors.

So does the GSA work on a traditional return system, meaning the FPC does a different job?
 
The R1200 HAVE a return line. Take a look at the parts fiches or your bike. All you have done is copy and pasted misinformation from one website to another.
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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