1200 Buying....

[DollyRocket]

I don't normally venture down this corridor of the forum having be ensconced in the 1150 world for the last 7 years.

However, I am *considering* replacing my 70k 1150GS for a slightly newer 1200GSA. THe only thing is, I have only heard bad things about them with breakdowns, failures etc. I have had a trawl through the forum for a buyers guide, or for things to be aware of and I was wondering if I can get it all aired in one thread...

Ideally, it would be great if there was information as to what things plague each model year, or what changes were made to help me hone in on which bike to target..

Do the final drive, oil leaks, electrical problems affect all bike years or have BMW sorted these problems out after a certain build year? I am after a GSA with the adventure big tank as I have a 100 mile a day commute, don't want electrical gimmicks, servo brakes or ABS - I want a bike that is easy to maintain and relatively easy to look after.

Let the flaming begin ....

 

[Giles]

Rasher???????? !!!!!!

 

[Big Nick]

I think from the 2008 bikes onwards, the problems seem to be a lot less.

There's loads of 08 and 09 bikes around from owners who've traded in for the 2010 twin cam model so its definately a buyers market.

Final drives have failed but I think that was more common when BMW claimed the units were sealed for life whereas now I think FD oil changes are the order of the day.

I'd look for a 1 owner 08 bike with around 6000 miles on it with panniers and look to pay as close to £8000 as possible

 

[Rasher]

I'd look for a 1 owner 08 bike with around 6000 miles on it with panniers and look to pay as close to £8000 as possible

Bloody hell, that's what I got, an '08 with full luggage and just 6,000 miles on the clock and few gimmicks (comfort pack +ABS) - paid £8500 although that was 6 months back.

So far it has managed another 2,000 miles with just a blown headlamp bulb and does not seem to be burning much oil, the FD has not yet exploded, neither has the EWS prevented it from starting or the FPC left it stuck at the side of the road.

Feeling quite smug, but expect tales of woe from 2008 owners to pop up and piss on my bonfire any time.....

 

[Ash]

Bloody hell, that's what I got, an '08 with full luggage and just 6,000 miles on the clock and few gimmicks (comfort pack +ABS) - paid £8500 although that was 6 months back.

So far it has managed another 2,000 miles with just a blown headlamp bulb and does not seem to be burning much oil, the FD has not yet exploded, neither has the EWS prevented it from starting or the FPC left it stuck at the side of the road.

Feeling quite smug, but expect tales of woe from 2008 owners to pop up and piss on my bonfire any time.....

reading your posts.
I thought you were doing a good job pissing on your own bonfire where the 1200 is concerned.

 

[Spout]

Final drives have failed but I think that was more common when BMW claimed the units were sealed for life whereas now I think FD oil changes are the order of the day.

Unfortunately regular oil changes aren't a cure (big bearing doesn't even run in the oil). Popping seal is quite common but a 10 min fix.
The problem for owners is that repairing the rear drive isn't as easy as on the 1150's. Good news is that some independants are now tooled up to do the work.

Not a reason not to buy a 1200

 

[DollyRocket]

Thanks for the info - I am contemplating have a look at a few dealers to get a bike with a warranty (depending on the price) - I just get nervous with bikes with lots of electrical gubbins (strange considering I am a sparky). Is this CANbus issue a myth? Lots of stories of people being stranded by the roadside (but it appears to be primarily the Fuel controller which seems to be a common issue).

 

[Rasher]

Many bikes now run CANBUS systems, I am not sure what the fuss is about, at the end of the day it is just a serial bus as opposed to a parralel bus, the computing world has been going down this route for a few years now, Ethernet / SAS / SATA / iSCSI etc.

I know it is not quite the same as in computing individual parralel technologies are being replaced by individual serial technologies (SAS replacing SATA) whereas with the CANBUS systems the same wires are used for multiple systems - but think of Ethernet, multiple protocol streams over the same media, we get E-mail, Video, Web Pages, voice comms etc all down the same wires.

The problems are more likely to be down to the implementation of the CANBUS system (penny pinching) than the technology itself, well designed systems using quality components should be extremely reliable.

From what I have seen on this forum it has been shite components that let the 1200GS down, but because many of these components were electrical (FPC / EWS / ABS controllers) perhaps the new fangled CANBUS system took the blame A bit like blaming your sattelite dish for the quaility of the program your watching.

 

[Wapping]

Similar to most experiences of the IT world, shite.

 

[snerkler]

The way I see it is that there's a lot of making mountains out of molehills. If you want to look for problems in bikes, cars etc etc you'll find loads of info, but you have to put it into perspective.
Firstly you're deliberately looking for info on problems so you'll find it, and secondly if someone's had a problem they're more likely to make a song and dance about it and post it on the internet somewhere, mainly on forums like this. What you don't tend to get is folk making a song and dance if their bikes are fine and dandy. Therefore info you read is always skewed.
As much as there's a lot of fuss about FD failures with the 1200's my own personal opinion is that the actual percentage of FD failures is very small. As much as I feel for those that have had such issues, I don't think some of their comments are fair when they say that BMW just don't care and just churn out bikes with poor build/dodgy parts.
If you think about this logically, of course companies care, not on an emotional level but on a business level. They rely on quality products and good feedback for future sales. Therefore it doesn't make sense that if there is a major flaw BMW don't pull out all the stops to fix it. Yes there's been a few tweeks but no major overhaul. If there was a major flaw everyone would know about it, not just folks like us that lurk on forums. The media would be all over it and sales would plummit. But in fact the opposite is true, all reviews I've ever read on the 1200, especially the GSA all say how they're built like tanks.
As with any machine there will always be issues, but I don't think the 1200GS/GSA is any worse than any other current bike. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was actually better than most.

 

[GSmonkey]

Just get anything post brake servos. Mine is a late '07 and was one of the first without I think.

The final drives, fuel pump controller, warped discs and paint finish carry the same problems from 2004 to the present day.

 

[Georgeeboi]

Ive never had any problems in the eighteen months ive owned my bike but its............................................................................a ducati.

 

[Rasher]

Therefore it doesn't make sense that if there is a major flaw BMW don't pull out all the stops to fix it.

No they don't they work out what is cheaper, Ford new a design flaw would lead to many Punto's bursting into flame during accidents due to poor fuel tank design, they also knew the way the car crumpled would jam the doors and leave people trapped and burining to death....

They then worked out the amount of deaths likely to occur (deaths per car sold) and compared the cost of fixing all the cars (recall) to the cost of paying up a million dollars to the family of everyone the flaws killed.

The compensation was cheaper - and people died, but Ford were quids in (well dollars up) and did not give a shit about the suffering of those who lost loved ones, kids who lost parents, parents who lost children etc.

Do you really think BMW give a toss if your FD fails and ruins your once in a lifetime holiday

The problem is all these companies are run by bean counters, these twonks do not understand reputation as they cannot put a number on it therefore it is irrelevant to them.

 

[cookie]

Ford new a design flaw would lead to many Punto's bursting into flame...

that would be Pinto.

i'm sure Puntos do it too, they are italian after all

 

[snerkler]

No they don't they work out what is cheaper, Ford new a design flaw would lead to many Punto's bursting into flame during accidents due to poor fuel tank design, they also knew the way the car crumpled would jam the doors and leave people trapped and burining to death....

They then worked out the amount of deaths likely to occur (deaths per car sold) and compared the cost of fixing all the cars (recall) to the cost of paying up a million dollars to the family of everyone the flaws killed.

The compensation was cheaper - and people died, but Ford were quids in (well dollars up) and did not give a shit about the suffering of those who lost loved ones, kids who lost parents, parents who lost children etc.

For real???

Do you really think BMW give a toss if your FD fails and ruins your once in a lifetime holiday

No, not at all. But if the failures were that common and people stopped buying their bikes then I think they'd give a toss. That's the point I'm making. If they have 1 unhappy customer for every 9 happy ones they may consider this to be OK (I don't think the percentage of FD failures is that high though). But if they had 5 unhappy customers for every 5 happy ones they might want to do something about it.

The problem is all these companies are run by bean counters, these twonks do not understand reputation as they cannot put a number on it therefore it is irrelevant to them.

Sure there are people who don't know what reputation is, or don't care, but if the reputation starts to fall then they'll do what they can to put it right. Take Mercedes for example. They had the rep for being well built cars, they got greedy producing shoddy work. Their reputation started going down the toilet so cut their profits back from £3b to £1b (or something like that) to bring the quality back up. So I think it's fair to say that reputation is important, although sometimes this is forgotten from time to time.

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

Do you really think BMW give a toss if your FD fails and ruins your once in a lifetime holiday

Do you think it really, really matters if your bike breaks down on holiday..................BMW Assist will send you a hire car, fix or ship your bike home

So what have you lost, you've got wheels and you can still enjoy your hols

I've ridden many times with 1200's on holiday and we've all returned home

You're more likely to have an accident on your bike on holiday, than the FD give up on you........................so stop bleating