1200gs Gearbox weep / leak

[ianran]

Earlier Post

As previously reported, bike in at Woolaston have been told 'slight weep' from seals so theyve been replaced but no contamination on clutch.
Still not convinced about this " BMW legendary build quality" Managed 13k on a Triumph ST with only servicing costs no breakdowns and one minor recall.

WIll be riding this waiting for the next break down, not what you would expect for these costs and will definitely lose it before end of warranty... shame smashing ride ruined by lack of peace of mind

 

[Engineer]

I am not convinced it is only the seals as reported. There is a little to substantiate any particular part at fault. One thing I can assure you of is that whatever part is recognized as being faulty, it would be quarantined immediately and the fault or stock put right. There is no way a manufacturer would knowingly persist in using known suspect components.
Seals rarely are at fault, they generally leak because of poor assembly, damage or rough finish of the shaft within.
Finally the evidence of weeping, as pictured, is very similar to the clutch push rod seal failure as on 1150 types. Whether the 1200 is the same set up I do not know. Oddly enough rear main seal failure rarely ends in friction plate contamination, whereas transmission input shaft seal usually does.
I wonder if any of the affected machines have had prior transmission oil changes.

I was told that they would replace all 3 seals on my bike - I assume that this was a precaution - apparently the gearbox input shaft seal has some sort of 'felt' pad over it and this was saturated with oil. I can only go by what the dealer told me, but I agree it is possibly some kind of assembly time damage - or more worryingly a surface finish flaw on the shafts.

The problem appeared on my bike soon after the 6000 mile service at which I assume that the gearbox oil would have been checked - is it changed at 6,000 miles?


I'm sure that BMW must know exactly what the issue is - I would like to be a fly on the wall in Berlin

 

[ianm00]

I was told that they would replace all 3 seals on my bike - I assume that this was a precaution - apparently the gearbox input shaft seal has some sort of 'felt' pad over it and this was saturated with oil. I can only go by what the dealer told me, but I agree it is possibly some kind of assembly time damage - or more worryingly a surface finish flaw on the shafts.

The problem appeared on my bike soon after the 6000 mile service at which I assume that the gearbox oil would have been checked - is it changed at 6,000 miles?


I'm sure that BMW must know exactly what the issue is - I would like to be a fly on the wall in Berlin

I was told the same thing for my bike recently. All 3 seals including clutch plate and clutch pressure plate have been replaced on my GS1200 last week.

I noticed the problem with clutch slip and also oil leaking from the gearbox.
My bike has now done 15000 miles but apparently the BMW mechanic spotted this leak during the 6000 mile service and I was meant to be told to return to have this fixed! This information was not however passed onto me!

Ian

 

[Pukmeister]

Denis, to remove the starter motor proceed as follows:

Move small black drain/vent lines to one side, remove top screw on plastic starter motor cover then wrestle with cover until free of frame.

Starter motor held in place with two TORX screws requiring several extension bars and a ratcher wrench to undo from clutch housing.

Pull starter motor back to reveal clutch/flywheel and shine torch in to see if evidence of oil contamination.

All in all, takes about 10 minutes if you have a TORX socket.

Disclaimer: If you try this and bugger it up, don't blame me.

 

[Denis]

Thanks to all...

Cheers Pukmeister. I will have a go at the weekend . With regard to leaking seals it could be some environmental contamination, excess heat, excess play in what ever shaft bearings, flex in shafts under certain conditions i.e. a vast number of variables in seeking a cause for the seal failure / leak, some of which will not be sorted by either seal replacement or even by a modified seal been fitted. Hence it begs 3 questions for me A) has anybody had these black smears appear (see picture above) without an oil leak / seal failure being diagnosed? B) has anybody put up large mileage on an 1200gs without such a problem occuring? C) has anybody put up large mileage on a 1200gs after having the seals replaced without the problem re-occuring? By the way I saw a very low mileage 1150 ADV (04) with the same black smear in the exact same spot recently!!!

 

[GSmonkey]

A) Yes - the black smear is graphite grease, not engine oil.
B) Occured @ 18.5k on mine
C) For me, not yet.

 

[sjwb]

As I mentioned earlier, the 1150 was entierly due to the clutch push rod felt seal weeping - a known problem to BMW. I had mine changed by CW without question. The witness was exactly the same as the photograph at the begining of this thread.

 

[Denis]

GS monkey

Where does the graphite grease come from and at what mileage did it appear...and what mileage have you put up since the seal replacement? Cheers

 

[Denis]

SJWB

What work is required to replace the clutch push rod seal? Thanks for the reply!

 

[Engineer]

A) Yes - the black smear is graphite grease, not engine oil.
B) Occured @ 18.5k on mine
C) For me, not yet.

If it is graphite grease then mine had graphite grease along the vertical join and gearbox oil underneath. Where does the graphite grease come from? and how does it mamange to 'squeeze' through the join? Confused now!

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

Where does the graphite grease come from? and how does it mamange to 'squeeze' through the join? Confused now!

Me too now..................

Andres

 

[minkyhead]

got it back yesterday
the mechanic said it was not that common but happens on most boxer models not just the 1200
suspects the seals are moved by pressure due to overfilled gear oil levels..overfilling ..thats what he said



if you have oil as in the photo the seals gone ... gear oil has a distinct smell thre should be no oil showing on that joint as as you know its a dry clutch
shit happens still a top bike have sopken to lads on a trip earlier this year with 27 and 33k on no problems at all i think its just pot luck as with most machines

 

[GSmonkey]

I was told by the BMW mechanic at vines that the graphite grease is used in the assembly of the joint and is squeezed out over time. Whenever I cleaned the joint, it was certainly a grease rather than a light oil.

Eventually oil started leaking from joint on the underside. Initially the garage said it was overfilling of the gearbox. 6k later when it was still leaking, it was diagnosed as a bad seal and replaced.

The bike has been in the shop for three weeks having this replaced, as well as the bevel box shaft seal. I only got the bike back yesterday, so haven't really put any miles on. There is still a line of grease on the replaced seal.