2010 GS twin cam

[Account removed]

If the bike ticks all boxes and is all it should be.

Would you buy one next year ?

Would you wait a year ?

Or would you change to a jap bike ? if so what would it be ?

sorry mods if I should not post here

 

[theop]

would buy 3 years later for £6k, the best condition I could get.... Thats what I always do, apart from the current GS that I bought late 06 1 year ols as any early 04 bike I d seen (from a sample of 10) was looking like a pile of rust...

Since then I realised that BMW is not what it used to be and that they are only marginally better than Suzuki in the rust department and half a million miles from Honda...

Mine, at now almost 4yo has been looked after like a precious stone and still looks no better than my 125cc Vespa on 51 which I ve not washed yet - ever.

 

[wilbjr21]

Since then I realised that BMW is not what it used to be and that they are only marginally better than Suzuki in the rust department and half a million miles from Honda...

That has not been my experience.

 

[GibGSA]

If the bike ticks all boxes and is all it should be.

Would you buy one next year ?

Would you wait a year ?

Or would you change to a jap bike ? if so what would it be ?

sorry mods if I should not post here

If I were to buy a new bike I would definitely give it a year so that the manufacturer has some time to iron out all the faults.

I tend not to change bikes that often, and as mines only a year and a half old I doubt i will be looking for a replacement in the near future.

Although I love the character, styling and feel of the GSA, the reliability issues are always in the back of my mind. I pity BMW should Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki or Yamaha ever come up with a decent GSA clone or substitute.

Currently there is nothing out there which can tick all the boxes that my 08 GSA can and certainly nothing that catches my eye...........Yet!



Regards GibGSA

 

[BBB61]

Since then I realised that BMW is not what it used to be and that they are only marginally better than Suzuki in the rust department and half a million miles from Honda...

I wonder why my wife's CBF250 at 2 years old is showing more corrosion than my 4 year old GS if the finish on Honda's is as good as you say it is?

Mine, at now almost 4yo has been looked after like a precious stone and still looks no better than my 125cc Vespa on 51 which I ve not washed yet - ever.

Knowing what the finish is like on Piaggio/Vespas I find that very hard to believe.

 

[Snoopy]

would buy 3 years later for £6k, the best condition I could get.... Thats what I always do, apart from the current GS that I bought late 06 1 year ols as any early 04 bike I d seen (from a sample of 10) was looking like a pile of rust...

Since then I realised that BMW is not what it used to be and that they are only marginally better than Suzuki in the rust department and half a million miles from Honda...

Mine, at now almost 4yo has been looked after like a precious stone and still looks no better than my 125cc Vespa on 51 which I ve not washed yet - ever.

Clearly you've never owned a Suzuki. The entire frame on my old DRZ began to rust. On my old GS500 the rear swing arm rusted so badly it failed it's MOT. On my old SV650 the engine self-stripped itself of its paint, the forks pitted terribly and the rear brake brace was complete rust.

Finish on my 1200 is superb, even better than my old 1150.

 

[RickG]

Regarding the finish, I have no complaints whatsoever about the GS. Mine is normally only washed by the rain and is used all through the year including thousands of miles on salted roads. There's little corrosion apart from a bit on the front cover and a couple of the disk bobbins are turning orange. I've got a Honda too and although the paint is good, the plating on the fixings goes furry at the hint of salt. Given the conditions I subject it to, the way the bike shines up after its spring bath is remarkable.

Regarding buying a twin cam GS, it would all come down to what the darn thing was actually like - it's difficult to assess something until it's built. I've said before that I need a GS that'll be a good workhorse commuter, not a KTM/Duke super motard contender. If the 'new' bike will still do 50+ mpg, 250miles on a tankfull and prove comfortable for 2 people after 350 miles riding AND I can be convinced that BMW have made the effort and addressed the quality control and design issues that spoil what is a bl***dy excellent design, then I'd be tempted. I do fear, however, that the drive will be toward attracting more sunday riders off sportsbikes by giving them a bike that will probably be great fun but possibly less usefull than the current GS is as a means of transport.

If I didn't have to commute on a bike, I'd love to play with extra power and sharper brakes and whatever the next GS may have on offer. But at that point I'd immediately jump ship and buy something far sexier,cheaper and way more powerful like a KTM or Fazer

 

[theop]

I wonder why my wife's CBF250 at 2 years old is showing more corrosion than my 4 year old GS if the finish on Honda's is as good as you say it is?



Knowing what the finish is like on Piaggio/Vespas I find that very hard to believe.

I was comparing apples with apples wrt to Honda.. Comparing the cr@ppiest and second cheapest bike they make to a GS1200 is like comparing a Merc S class and a BMW 1 series...

If we going to talk Honda quality you need to compare the GS with a bike of the same calibre/price. Pick a Varadero, a Pan, a CB1300, a Blackbird. All four bikes are WAY better made than - dare I say - ANY Bmw at the moment. Full stop. Oh, and they are all cheaper too.... The only way really the GS wins, is that none of the Hondas can score 80% or higher on every discipline of the GS. This is the magic, and thats why it is successful. But a quality bike, it isn't folks, sorry. Not for 12k anyway.

The comment on my Vespa was hyperbolic, just to drive my point. Actually, my vespa has never been washed, so I don't actually know how rusty it is underneath. I d suspect one of these days it will break in half. It has been reliable though. 35k miles on oil, filters and plugs only.

The comment abt Suzuki, yes, I know , thats why I put it there... I owned a Bandit too. They are the most shoddy bikes this side of Korea. But, you can buy a new one every year for 3 years before you arrive at GS pricing levels.

 

[Pukmeister]

Not seen the 'exceptional' build quality on the new fireblades then ??

 

[BBB61]

I was comparing apples with apples wrt to Honda.. Comparing the cr@ppiest and second cheapest bike they make to a GS1200 is like comparing a Merc S class and a BMW 1 series...

A 250 that retails at £3500 is hardly cheap. You also stated that Honda finish was a million miles away from that of BMW. That suggested that the finish on all Hondas is better than BMW.

If we going to talk Honda quality you need to compare the GS with a bike of the same calibre/price.

Why? According to you the finish on Honda's is far better than BMW, but it seems you are back peddling and moving the goal posts.

Pick a Varadero, a Pan, a CB1300, a Blackbird. All four bikes are WAY better made than - dare I say - ANY Bmw at the moment. Full stop. Oh, and they are all cheaper too....

Can you qualify that they are way better made? Or is that just your perception? As for the prices a Pan European is £12616 according to the Honda website. Compare that to the K1300GT which is £12525 (BMW motorrad website). The Blackbird isn't even listed on the Honda website, so the closest to that is the CBR1000ABS which is £10721. The K1300S is £11345, a difference of £624 or just under 6%. Not a huge difference. Yes, the Varadero is quite a bit cheaper than the 1200GS but it's been around a lot longer and it's not as good as the GS.

The only way really the GS wins, is that none of the Hondas can score 80% or higher on every discipline of the GS. This is the magic, and thats why it is successful. But a quality bike, it isn't folks, sorry. Not for 12k anyway.

Where do you get £12k from? For a fully loaded with all the options maybe, but the list price of a standard GS is £9575. That's a long way from £12k.

The comment on my Vespa was hyperbolic, just to drive my point.

It didn't drive your point though, it made you look a bit silly.

Actually, my vespa has never been washed, so I don't actually know how rusty it is underneath. I d suspect one of these days it will break in half. It has been reliable though. 35k miles on oil, filters and plugs only.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if it broke in half knowing how well finished Vespas are

The comment abt Suzuki, yes, I know , thats why I put it there... I owned a Bandit too. They are the most shoddy bikes this side of Korea. But, you can buy a new one every year for 3 years before you arrive at GS pricing levels.

Which model would that be? One of their 125's? It wouldn't be a Bandit given they start at £4500

 

[Account removed]

Which model would that be? One of their 125's? It wouldn't be a Bandit given they start at £4500

Okay as you say bandits start at £4500 so 3x that = £13500 you could sell a badit I year old for £2000 easy so thats a total cost of £9500.
thats cheaper than a GS.

 

[GSmonkey]

Think I'd wait for the new Honda shaft drive V4 giant traille that'll be out soon if I was in the market for a new bike in the next few years. My GSA's a keeper though.

 

[Account removed]

new Honda shaft drive V4 giant traille that'll be out soon

We live in hope.

 

[Steptoe]

I'll wait for the diesel GS.

 

[Decster]

I think i'll wait for the hover bike that runs on leaves and needs no oil..........

my 35k miler 1150gs has only had plugs, oil filters..usual standard service parts....bit like a vespa

 

[team duvet]

Thoughts?

Would you lot like the 120BHP engine but with the "overdrive" gear as per 1150GS for Motorways etc???

Just my Sunday thought prior to the night of Moto GP from the US


TD

 

[theop]

A 250 that retails at £3500 is hardly cheap. You also stated that Honda finish was a million miles away from that of BMW. That suggested that the finish on all Hondas is better than BMW.



Why? According to you the finish on Honda's is far better than BMW, but it seems you are back peddling and moving the goal posts.




Can you qualify that they are way better made? Or is that just your perception? As for the prices a Pan European is £12616 according to the Honda website. Compare that to the K1300GT which is £12525 (BMW motorrad website). The Blackbird isn't even listed on the Honda website, so the closest to that is the CBR1000ABS which is £10721. The K1300S is £11345, a difference of £624 or just under 6%. Not a huge difference. Yes, the Varadero is quite a bit cheaper than the 1200GS but it's been around a lot longer and it's not as good as the GS.




Where do you get £12k from? For a fully loaded with all the options maybe, but the list price of a standard GS is £9575. That's a long way from £12k.



It didn't drive your point though, it made you look a bit silly.




I wouldn't be at all surprised if it broke in half knowing how well finished Vespas are



Which model would that be? One of their 125's? It wouldn't be a Bandit given they start at £4500

Dear Bob,

I am only saying that generally - LIKE FOR LIKE, APPLE FOR APPLE, Hondas are better made than BMW and are cheaper too. BMW fortunately for everybody do not make small bikes and mopeds like Honda, so comparing across the range would be a bit silly indeed.

b, your point on perception.... Of course its my perception, what did you think it was, some global engineering survey on intangible quality marks?

c, you pricing arguments are half right, the gaps are indeed small..ish. but you omit the fact that "on the road" bmw style is a complete fallacy. Once you add the usual extras (which BMW are famously expensive, more than anyone incl Ducati and Agusta whose bikes come fully kitted), then the gap[ between fully kitted Honda Pan, (as its actually sold for £13k) is much less than a K1300GT which at £12.5k comes without wheels ffs!!!. By the time you add up the Hondas kit on the K, you get one for 17-18k - I did it yday at Vines.... ( I actually fancy a K13GT, but not for 17k)

d, driving my point.... Yes mate, clearly I am a bit silly like most of you tossers here, why wpuld I spend any time here otherwise...?onyack

have fun , enjoy the bhw..

Your point in pricing is accepted

 

[midnitemo]

Diesel Gs ? i'm in , put me down for one

 

[BBB61]

Dear Bob,

I am only saying that generally - LIKE FOR LIKE, APPLE FOR APPLE, Hondas are better made than BMW and are cheaper too. BMW fortunately for everybody do not make small bikes and mopeds like Honda, so comparing across the range would be a bit silly indeed.

So you are saying now that Honda quality varies across the range depending on whether it's a 250 or one of the big bikes they make?

b, your point on perception.... Of course its my perception, what did you think it was, some global engineering survey on intangible quality marks?

The way you were saying suggested as such

you pricing arguments are half right, the gaps are indeed small..ish. but you omit the fact that "on the road" bmw style is a complete fallacy. Once you add the usual extras (which BMW are famously expensive, more than anyone incl Ducati and Agusta whose bikes come fully kitted), then the gap[ between fully kitted Honda Pan, (as its actually sold for £13k) is much less than a K1300GT which at £12.5k comes without wheels ffs!!!. By the time you add up the Hondas kit on the K, you get one for 17-18k - I did it yday at Vines.... ( I actually fancy a K13GT, but not for 17k)

It's not a fallacy. If a person wants to add extras to a BMW they have that choice,or they can buy the bike at the basic price. But buying a Honda you will find there are very few options for factory fitted options. As for the extra kit that you get with a Pan, what does it come with over and above the standard spec of a K1300GT? The answer is nothing! There are no standard heated grips or cruise control or heated seats. In fact the only options that appear to be available on a Pan are heated grips and a top box.

As for the fully specced K1300GT, that won't cost anywhere near the £17k figure you quote. Go to the BMW Motorrad site and look at the spec of the SE model and see what you get for the £13775. Then compare that spec with the spec of a Pan. You will see that you can't even get most of the kit on the Pan for love nor money.

The plain fact is that if you compare the spec of the standard K1300GT with that of the Pan you will see that the Pan has no advantage over the GT with regards to specification. If you compare the basic spec of most motorcycles you will find they have very little extra kit as standard with most things being optional. The usual exception to that is when a model is nearing the end of its life and they throw in a load of stuff at little or no extra cost to make it more attractive to allow them to clear the stocks before the new model comes along (2004 Triumph Sprint ST or 2006 Tiger 955 immediately spring to mind).

I think you will also find that Ducatis and MV's have very little (if anything) extra kit over and above what you get on a BMW.

It's a fact that you can buy a GS for under £10k.

Your point in pricing is accepted

It was a valid point. BMW have not increased their prices by anywhere near the same levels as the Japanese manufacturers this year. Its not that long ago that the Yamaha R1 went from £10000 to £11000 in one go.

 

[theop]

we could be talking abt this until the cows come home.... crossing Ts and dotting Is....

Fact is that - for me - the current BMW niggles and the company's customer service (generally, not UK dealer specific, I find UK dealers largely good) that has skydived the last 5 years will push me to the Japanese again when a nice enough bike that is GSy enough comes along..

Can't wait for that V4 trailee that Honda are preparing, whereas I am more indifferent to the new GS as I have no doubt that the new bike will be no better in quality terms than the current crop... Not bad, but not exceptional either...