Does 3-layer gear get sticky?

[Doberman]

I am after a new suit and it seems that there are two ways of doing this.

1. Get a 3-layer design and use the layers as needed.
2. Get a Gore Tex Pro Shell suit and only have one layer to remove.

I have seen the waterproof layers and they look quite plasticy. I was wondering how would a jacket feel if you remove the thermal layer and leave only the waterproof membrane in place?

Does it get ''sticky''?

 

[brassmonkey001]

I am after a new suit and it seems that there are two ways of doing this.

1. Get a 3-layer design and use the layers as needed.
2. Get a Gore Tex Pro Shell suit and only have one layer to remove.

I have seen the waterproof layers and they look quite plasticy. I was wondering how would a jacket feel if you remove the thermal layer and leave only the waterproof membrane in place?

Does it get ''sticky''?

GoreTex Pro Shell. I can't understand why anyone would opt for their outer layer getting soaked when you can have water bouncing off the outside of your kit instead.

 

[Popell]

GoreTex Pro Shell. I can't understand why anyone would opt for their outer layer getting soaked when you can have water bouncing off the outside of your kit instead.

Ditto

Incomprehensible as you say, thats why I prefer my rather drab Streetguard II to the more usual twat jacket.


That and I could only afford the SG 'cos it was a bargain

 

[Mutley]

GoreTex Pro Shell. I can't understand why anyone would opt for their outer layer getting soaked when you can have water bouncing off the outside of your kit instead.

Because good quality breathable membranes are prone to being clogged with road grime so they don't breath. They are also not very abrasion resistant. Consequently an outer shell that protects the inner and is hard wearing etc. is a pratcical solution.

If you don't want the outer shell to be absorbent (which is the main issue, not that it gets wet) then you can easily proof it with a nikwax wash in solution.

As for avoiding getting sticky: you have to wear a wickable base layer. You'll hear of lots of people who complain that their T Shirt is soaking after riding in the rain. This is because they are riding round in a mobile sauna and the T Shirt is wet through sweat, rather than leakage.

I thank you

 

[GS TRV]

I just avoid going out in the rain

 

[Simon_h]

can't be arsed to find the spidi thread where we discussed this recently, but the layer system works very well except for having to dry a wet through outer jacket.

 

[Mutley]

the layer system works very well except for having to dry a wet through outer jacket.

If you don't want the outer shell to be absorbent (which is the main issue, not that it gets wet) then you can easily proof it with a nikwax wash in solution.

 

[Simon_h]

if you do serious miles on a daily basis, nikwax'ing a fabric won't keep it waterproof for long.

 

[thauma]

layering systems definitely work.

However I can't understand the 'inner waterproof membrane' approach. If the day starts out nice and dry, and then changes, am I really supposed to strip off trousers and jacket at the side of the road in order to put in the waterproof layer? I know they're waterproof, but seem a bit of a faff.

I had an HG PSX type suit for years (gortex inner but as a single item) worked well, but now it's gone. But it was warm and not breathable (well not really). Lighter than leathers, but the leathers have stretch breathable panels…….
Always a compromise - but one that can be cured by an oversuit.

 

[Mutley]

if you do serious miles on a daily basis, nikwax'ing a fabric won't keep it waterproof for long.

Have you tried it then or is that just a guess? I do mine about once a year

 

[Mutley]

layering systems definitely work.

However I can't understand the 'inner waterproof membrane' approach. If the day starts out nice and dry, and then changes, am I really supposed to strip off trousers and jacket at the side of the road in order to put in the waterproof layer? I know they're waterproof, but seem a bit of a faff.

Putting the liner in a jacket doesn't seem that big a deal to me

As my knee armour almost overlaps my boots, plus the weather protection of the pot and the GSA tank I rarely have the lining in my trousers anyway. If it really starts to chuck it down then the nearest stopping point is never too much of a faff

 

[Simon_h]

Have you tried it then or is that just a guess? I do mine about once a year

yes, I've done it twice. Didn't last long enough to warrant the effort of removing all the armour and airbag stuff (spidi jacket). I find that if its heavy enough rain to seep through the outer layer, you tend to know if its on its way and put the waterproof liner in before you set off....so its not something I'm really that bothered about.

 

[Grey Beard]

It's always going to be some sort of compromise with breathable jackets. Goretex, e-Vent, etc. need a temperature difference of something like 17 deg C, between the inside and outside of the membrane to breath effectively. Hence they tend to be less breathable in the summer, but fine in the winter.

The outer shell of my XCR Gore-Tex North Face Mountain Jacket needs to be re-proofed regularly, otherwise it 'wets out' and then inhibits the breathe ability of the Gore-Tex membrane below it.

I can understand the earlier post, which states that the oil and grime off the road will clog up the XCR type Gore-Tex systems rapidly.

My own textile suit has a removable Gore-Tex liner, but this is combined with a thermal liner, so isn't the best idea for summer! A Gore-Tex XCR type textile suit was more expensive than I was prepared to pay at the time .

I am tempted to get a cheapish semi-sacrificial Hi-Viz Gore-Tex bomber jacket from the Internet (OneStopCopShop or similar) to wear with my suit when it is warm and raining when there is reduced visibility due to road spray. The bomber jacket will be much easier to wash than the full textile suit with it's armour, etc.

I have a one piece rain suit, but as this is not breathable, wearing it on a long ride may be uncomfortable.

Grey Beard

 

[thauma]

Putting the liner in a jacket doesn't seem that big a deal to me

As my knee armour almost overlaps my boots, plus the weather protection of the pot and the GSA tank I rarely have the lining in my trousers anyway. If it really starts to chuck it down then the nearest stopping point is never too much of a faff

I agree - putting in a jacket liner is not really any different to an overjacket. So from that perspective I can see the advantages.

It's the trousers that concern me. It's probably just me, but it always seems to be the crotch that ends up collecting water when it rains (yes it is rain and not incontinence ) so taking off boots, trousers, putting in liner and getting kitted up again just seems like a big hassle. So for me it has to be overtrousers, or ride with the liner in (which wouldn't be cool).

I guess the type of weather also affects what you want to wear. If it looks like rain, I guess you start with the liners already in place, so no issue. in England the weather doesn't seem to turn without a bit of warning, so again I guess that is the chance to sort the kit out. Although Switzerland, Wales and Scotland can have some dramatic and quick changes in the weather, and when it rains it does rain in rivers.

Maybe I need sealskinz underwear

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

I tend towards getting too hot in bike gear so brathability of kit has always been a big deal for me.

After pissing about with different kit over the years I now have something that works perfectly, for me

• MkII Tawt Suit.
  
• Inner Gortex layer.
  
• Thin Merrino wool layers.
  
• 'Stich heated fleece.
  
• 2nd hand army Gortex over jacket that fits easily into the Twat suits bum bag.

Combinations of the above do me for trail ridding, days in the sadle at stoopid cold (-15'C) and stoopid hot and humid.

The over jacket is great in very cold conditions where it acts as a wind stopper or in monsoon like conditions where it stops the jacket getting wet. in normal rain I've never found the jacket getting wet being a problem

Oh, and in answer to the OP's original question, I've never got sweaty in that kit, even with inner and outer Gortex layers on at the same time

Andres

 

[John Armstrong]

I'm tending to use the breathable non-waterproof jacket and trousers and use a cheap rain suit over the top, as it can be a bit of a faff getting the liners in at the side of the road

Only downside that I've found is that the rain suit is bigger than the liners, probably due to it needing to be more structural than the liners

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

I'm tending to use the breathable non-waterproof jacket and trousers and use a cheap rain suit over the top, as it can be a bit of a faff getting the liners in at the side of the road
...............

Do you not find that the kit gets sweaty as it's now no longer breathable?

Andres

 

[Doberman]

I like the theory of the outer shell protecting the breathable membrane. Doesn't the outer shell get dirty, clogged, etc?

In other words, there is no way to keep the jacket breathable, unless you wash it often, right? (Regardless if it's GTX Pro Shell, multi layer, etc).

 

[John Armstrong]

Do you not find that the kit gets sweaty as it's now no longer breathable?

Andres

"Breathable" needs the inside to be wetter and warmer than the outside AFAIK. If it's raining then one bit of that is missing, plus, as I'm not running a marathon in the kit, then I'm not going to be sweating too much and so the breathable bit isn't an issue.

Just like using goretex in boots, how breathable is leather etc but the good bit is the waterproofness of the goretex

I tend to use wicking t-shirts and undies and layers as needed.

 

[OscarIndia]

I am after a new suit and it seems that there are two ways of doing this.

1. Get a 3-layer design and use the layers as needed.
2. Get a Gore Tex Pro Shell suit and only have one layer to remove.

I have seen the waterproof layers and they look quite plasticy. I was wondering how would a jacket feel if you remove the thermal layer and leave only the waterproof membrane in place?

Does it get ''sticky''?

Only one I ever owned did just that, like peeling an orange every time I took it off.
If you have the money, Pro-Shell I suspect is the answer.
That said, I'm looking at the new Spidi 3-layer but mostly out of curiosity - will take some persuading to buy one.