Genuine Technical Question

[Fanum]

Aren't you guys referring the crankcase breather, which is presumably plumbed in to the airbox to raise the point at at which it will take in water?

The mistake they made was to not put the pipe further up in to the airbox...

Exactly.
Putting it into the bottom of the airbox may mean the breather exits higher than the crank case when the bike is upright, but drop it on the right hand side with a 12 and the airbox becomes lower than the breather, then when picked up, the water gets drawn straight into the crank case

You can't put a non return valve of any sort in, because the breather needs to work both ways, so the mod (I guess) would need to take the breather up into the centre of the airbox, and maybe incorporate an S bend of some sort, with a drain hole at the bottom of the S bend

You're right that a little water in there won't instantly damage the engine, but the design fault makes things happen very diffeently on an 11 compared to a 12......I haven't ever seen an 11 with totally emulsified engine oil, even when they take water onto the pots....we de-plug them, turn them over to squirt water (comic moments a-plenty) 20 feet across the track, then dry the plugs and start them up.....no probs at all, no emulsification therefore no water into engine oil.

With a 12 though, the second even just a cupful of water gets in the box, the engine oil turns into custard.

 

[MGJ]

Because on the 1150, the final drive has a breather on top of it.
When hot then suddenly submerged, it often lets by water.

It's easily sorted by running a pipe from the breather, along the swingarm and up to the frame, but it only takes a minute to check the oil in the FD and at most, 5 minutes to change it.

Out of 5 fords runs I've organised from the hograost, I've had to change my FD oil 4 times

The 1200 had either a 'sealed for life' FD, (which wasn't ) or later models had a breather, though they don't seem to take in water like the 11xx.

Learn smoething new every day.

 

[Toad]

With a 12 though, the second even just a cupful of water gets in the box, the engine oil turns into custard.

Yer - you live and learn

 

[Fanum]

Yer - you live and learn

It's funny actually (funny odd, not funny ha-ha)

The first broken 1200 we had on a fords ride was when I raced Clive out of a flooded ford at an East mids bash.

His engine hydrolocked and sheared the starter motor casing (On an 11xx, the starter ring gear goes rather than the starter casing), but there was no Engine oil emulsification.

Since then though, I've seen half a dozen fully emulsified oiled bikes but only one other hydrolocked 12

I have no idea why the water ended up in his cylinders rather than the crank case, which seems to be more usual

 

[Toad]

It's funny actually (funny odd, not funny ha-ha)

The first broken 1200 we had on a fords ride was when I raced Clive out of a flooded ford at an East mids bash.

His engine hydrolocked and sheared the starter motor casing (On an 11xx, the starter ring gear goes rather than the starter casing), but there was no Engine oil emulsification.

Since then though, I've seen half a dozen fully emulsified oiled bikes but only one other hydrolocked 12

I have no idea why the water ended up in his cylinders rather than the crank case, which seems to be more usual

I got both

Still, after some TLC from St. Eptoe she lived another day

 

[Toad]

Those distant days of glorious summer.........

2007 would you believe!!

 

[Wizard]

Those distant days of glorious summer.........

2007 would you believe!!

As I recall the conversation it went something like
"Don't start your engine!"
"What?"
"Don't st..... [bang]..... never mind"

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

So the hose is a crankcase breather and is connected to the crankcase through a bore within the cylinder. Very clever. On the whole this is right way to do it. It's function is to minimise engine oil getting to the atmosphere which is recycled to the engine, but there being no drain plug is a surprise to me.
It is very unfortunate that the positioning of this hose is at the lowest level of the airbox, as said above, and simply provides an avenue for contamination.

My R1150GSA has (or had) a well oiled K&N filter within its airbox but as far as I can tell did not allow any water into the engine. I would expect to see evidence of this through the oil sight glass but all can I see is black oil. I'll drop my oil and let you know whether it appears to have any water contamination.

I'll ponder this further and see if there's a viable solution.

 

[Mav]

Exactly.
Putting it into the bottom of the airbox may mean the breather exits higher than the crank case when the bike is upright, but drop it on the right hand side with a 12 and the airbox becomes lower than the breather, then when picked up, the water gets drawn straight into the crank case

You can't put a non return valve of any sort in, because the breather needs to work both ways, so the mod (I guess) would need to take the breather up into the centre of the airbox, and maybe incorporate an S bend of some sort, with a drain hole at the bottom of the S bend

You're right that a little water in there won't instantly damage the engine, but the design fault makes things happen very diffeently on an 11 compared to a 12......I haven't ever seen an 11 with totally emulsified engine oil, even when they take water onto the pots....we de-plug them, turn them over to squirt water (comic moments a-plenty) 20 feet across the track, then dry the plugs and start them up.....no probs at all, no emulsification therefore no water into engine oil.

With a 12 though, the second even just a cupful of water gets in the box, the engine oil turns into custard.

So do 1150 engines have magic breathers for the engine oil? If you get one in to deep water, surely it's going to suck in water just like the FD?

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

So do 1150 engines have magic breathers for the engine oil? If you get one in to deep water, surely it's going to suck in water just like the FD?

The 1150s crankcase breather hose is on the top of the crankcase on the RHS of the bike and is connected to the top of the airbox. The easiest path for contamination would be through the air ducts and into the throttle bodies but this would need a lot of water to rise above the lower perimeter of the air duct.

 

[Mav]

Given your obvious knowledge one has to wonder why you're here in the 12 section...

 

[davegs]

Given your obvious knowledge one has to wonder why you're here in the 12 section...

Like a lot of us he enjoys a laugh!

 

[MGJ]

Given your obvious knowledge one has to wonder why you're here in the 12 section...

Because he is 1150 owner ?

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

Given your obvious knowledge one has to wonder why you're here in the 12 section...

My intial visits were to see if there's anything to learn for a personal interest point of view, and then see if I can help. More recently I've had the opportunity to look at other bikes and may ask around here to see if anyone knows what's what or why things are as they are if I can't see it myself or find other resources.

Being unable to locate as airbox drain plug on a twincam 1200 instigated this thread.