GS Issues and the sales of goods act 1979

[bezzer]

Hi All,

Just a question for you guys that have had issues and are out of warranty. When BMW have come back and said they will pay half the costs etc. Has anyone gone down the route of using the sales of goods act and not fit for purpose etc (Mainly this leaking seal issue as its a bit ahem pricey). My bike is going in to get checked tommorow and it is a year and a half out of warranty. I spoke to consumer direct today and they inform me that if you didn't buy the bike on finance that you have up to 6 years to argue the toss about resonable wear and tear and that the company should pay the FULL costs. I might also ask them to change the corroded front as well and see where i get This is the route i intend to take if the seals are leaking and i get fobbed off. Has anyone else had any joy with this?. Will let you know the outcome

Cheers

Nik

 

[Sgt Bilco]

Hi All,

Just a question for you guys that have had issues and are out of warranty. When BMW have come back and said they will pay half the costs etc. Has anyone gone down the route of using the sales of goods act and not fit for purpose etc (Mainly this leaking seal issue as its a bit ahem pricey). My bike is going in to get checked tommorow and it is a year and a half out of warranty. I spoke to consumer direct today and they inform me that if you didn't buy the bike on finance that you have up to 6 years to argue the toss about resonable wear and tear and that the company should pay the FULL costs. I might also ask them to change the corroded front as well and see where i get This is the route i intend to take if the seals are leaking and i get fobbed off. Has anyone else had any joy with this?. Will let you know the outcome

Cheers

Nik

Nik

I wish you good luck with this but this will probably be a dead end. I`m sure BuMW will claim that the seals and corrosion are fair wear and tear band the best you may get is a little goodwill.

On the front engine corrosion issue, my panel was replaced just befoe the end of the warranty because my dealer said there was no way BuMW would change it after the end of the 2 years warranty even though I`ve extended the warranty to a 3rd year.

Remember BuMW have a legal department the size of a small town so they will know what they can and can`t get away with. They do however, tend to look after their customers better than a lot of other manufacturers IMHO.

Best of luck

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

If I'm right the bike's 3 1/2 years old - have to admit that even though they are recognised issues I would say that wear and tear is more than fair enough, and if you came to me quoting sales of goods act you'd be told where to go.

WBM offering to pay half the cost is, I think, very generous - how many other manufacturers would do that

Andres

 

[Professional Boxer]

I feel that Consumer Direct whilst giving you correct advice, did not give you the full correct advice.

The Sales of goods act may only be invoked if you had a direct contract with a retailer, and in this case as you are thinking of chasing BMW for costs, it had to be with an authorised agent of BMW.

The Sales of Goods Act only refers to the exact point in time when the product was sold. It also refers to any faults that were apparent at the exact point of sale.

If any fault arises in the first six months after the point of sale, it is deemed to have been faulty at the point of sale, unless the retailer can prove other wise.
e.g. If an oil seal fails after 4 months, but the retailer has documented proof there was no leak at time of sale, it is not covered by the sales of goods act.

After the 6-month period the onus changes from the Retailer to the purchaser, from which point the purchaser has to prove the fault was there a point of sale.

I think you will have a hard time proving that either the oil seal leak or corrosion was there at the time of sale.

That not withstanding, essentially the Act states that what a retailer sells must fit its description, be fit for its purpose and be of satisfactory quality.

You will have to chase your contractual partner (i.e. the dealer you purchased the bike from) for any costs you wish to recover

 

[bezzer]

If I'm right the bike's 3 1/2 years old - have to admit that even though they are recognised issues I would say that wear and tear is more than fair enough, and if you came to me quoting sales of goods act you'd be told where to go.

WBM offering to pay half the cost is, I think, very generous - how many other manufacturers would do that

Andres

Hi Yes the bike is 3 1/2 years old. I forgot to add that it has only done 11k. So i do not feel that a seal failure is general wear and tear. The front cover was just a punt but as for the seal i don't think that is right. Also the bike was bought by myself from an authorised BMW dealer.

As i say we shall see what happens its worth a try

Cheers

Nik

 

[red1]

If I'm right the bike's 3 1/2 years old - have to admit that even though they are recognised issues I would say that wear and tear is more than fair enough, and if you came to me quoting sales of goods act you'd be told where to go.

WBM offering to pay half the cost is, I think, very generous - how many other manufacturers would do that

Andres

"Very generous"?
How many other manufacturers would be in this position with a 3 1/2 year old bike?

I think we put up with a lot more than most other manufacturers products. It's time BMW started to provide a machine of a quality that reflects the price and not rely on "badge blindness" to sell product.

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

"Very generous"?
How many other manufacturers would be in this position with a 3 1/2 year old bike?

I think we put up with a lot more than most other manufacturers products. It's time BMW started to provide a machine of a quality that reflects the price and not rely on "badge blindness" to sell product.

I defo don't suffer from "badge blindness". I've had issues with my bike and had my fair share of warranty work done but nothing in life, let alone something mechanical, is perfect. There must come a point where a manufacturer has to draw the line - they give a 2 year warranty and 1 1/2 years out of that warranty they are prepared to offer half the cost, I still regard that as generous and this is partly reflected in the price you pay for a WMB

Try doing that with ANY of the other motorcycle manufacturers and see where you get with them.

If there is some sort of ''badge blindness'' then perhaps it's with those that believe the hype and marketing skills of the manufacturer. As ever, surely, it has to be caveat emptor.

Andres

edit: Feck me, I have spent nearly 4 years on this site and have so far managed not to get sucked into one of these 'discussions'............:blast

 

[Sgt Bilco]

I defo don't suffer from "badge blindness". I've had issues with my bike and had my fair share of warranty work done but nothing in life, let alone something mechanical, is perfect. There must come a point where a manufacturer has to draw the line - they give a 2 year warranty and 1 1/2 years out of that warranty they are prepared to offer half the cost, I still regard that as generous and this is partly reflected in the price you pay for a WMB

Try doing that with ANY of the other motorcycle manufacturers and see where you get with them.

If there is some sort of ''badge blindness'' then perhaps it's with those that believe the hype and marketing skills of the manufacturer. As ever, surely, it has to be caveat emptor.

Andres

edit: Feck me, I have spent nearly 4 years on this site and have so far managed not to get sucked into one of these 'discussions'............:blast

It happens to us all Andres

Red, it`s not badge blindness. Most manufacturers would tell you to feck off after the warranty has finished and not even entertain goodwill. Can you actually come up with anyone else who after 3 1/2 years would even discuss this issue? I`m struggling to but at least Nik stands half a chance of getting something out of BuMW.

 

[Trippy]

it's time BMW started to provide a machine of a quality that reflects the price and not rely on "badge blindness" to sell product.

And what does that say about people who do continue to spend £13000 on a motorbike knowing the issues they have with them.

 

[MattW]

And what does that say about people who do continue to spend £13000 on a motorbike knowing the issues they have with them.

More than a few on here choose to replace their 1200 with a new one every year. Many others seem to replace before the warranty expires.

That's an easy (if not spendy) way to cope with any "issues"

 

[bezzer]

Discussion is good

The sale of goods act is there for a reason and it states 6 years not 1 2 or 3 but 6 (where that figure came from who knows). Now we can all say "how many other manufactureres" would do what BMW do which is fair enough. My bike is 3 1/2 years old etc. I am sure all other manufacturers would take the same course. (It is also not like mine would be a 1 off either looking at this site alone) But i have owned a few bikes from new and never had to goto them for any issues luck or build quality who knows!!. I am no lawyer and don't really understand the act and the in's and outs of it. But it is there to protect the consumer to a degree i guess, I agree that the front engine cover could quite easily be wear and tear. But a seal internal to the bike that has done 11k should not fail (in my mind) but in the eyes of consumer law etc i will find out soon !!!

 

[Knobjockey]

Does the bike have full service history?

I know that the manufacturer I work for, asks the above question when we try to request goodwill. If not, the it is automatically rejected by the system.

Although, I don't know if BMW is the same....

Let us know how it goes.

 

[BBB61]

My front engine cover was replaced a year out of warranty, so it's worth asking them if they will do yours. The worst thing they can say is no.

As for other manufacturers, some won't replace dodgy parts whilst the bike is still under their warranty, let alone when the warranty has expired.

 

[bezzer]

Does the bike have full service history?

I know that the manufacturer I work for, asks the above question when we try to request goodwill. If not, the it is automatically rejected by the system.

Although, I don't know if BMW is the same....

Let us know how it goes.

Yes this is my only thing with all this that annoys me anyway. This "goodwill" bit. Surely it should be standard as the part is quite clearly not fit for purpose. It doesn't seal ?, well it does for a bit . I don't know i suppose we could speculate all day about it but the proof of the pudding and all that

 

[Knobjockey]

Yes this is my only thing with all this that annoys me anyway. This "goodwill" bit. Surely it should be standard as the part is quite clearly not fit for purpose. It doesn't seal ?, well it does for a bit . I don't know i suppose we could speculate all day about it but the proof of the pudding and all that

Never really thought of it like that. I suppose the reason they call it "Goodwill" is that the bike is warrantied against manufacturing defect for 2 years, so, after that time, regardless of anything (barring one of the extended warranties), you are reliant on the goodwill of BMW?

As has been mentioned, some manufacturers are a nightmare even when the item is in question!

I think the best route would be to remember that however frustrating it may be, whomever you see when you go in, it is not their fault, and they will try to do anything they can to help.

The dealer you are going to, is it your local? And has the bike been there before?

Good Luck

 

[bezzer]

Never really thought of it like that. I suppose the reason they call it "Goodwill" is that the bike is warrantied against manufacturing defect for 2 years, so, after that time, regardless of anything (barring one of the extended warranties), you are reliant on the goodwill of BMW?

As has been mentioned, some manufacturers are a nightmare even when the item is in question!

I think the best route would be to remember that however frustrating it may be, whomever you see when you go in, it is not their fault, and they will try to do anything they can to help.

The dealer you are going to, is it your local? And has the bike been there before?
Good Luck

Yep i totally agree. It is not the fault of the dealer and i will not be going in all guns blazing. I appreciate the fact that it is BMW so there will be no shouting on my part. But have now been steered towards section 14.2 of the consumer act. About durability etc. Law innit complicated!!!

The bike has not been there before and it was not the dealer i bought it from but some negotiation can be had between dealers etc.

 

[Knobjockey]

The only reason I asked about the dealer, was that the sale of goods act will route you to the selling dealer.

If BMW do not come back with a satisfactory response, then you would need to refer to the retailer. This would be the selling dealer.

Also, I assume bike dealers are the same as car and commercial? As they are not the same company, they are franchises, they are effectively seperate companies. All selling the same stuff, but have no further connections.

The commecial dealer I work for, has 4 depots, and goodwill between those is hard enough. Trying to get goodwill from another dealer......

 

[red1]

What you will need to remember is that your consumer rights are with the dealer and not BMW.
If you cannot get any satisfaction via the dealer (ie. if BMW reject claim and the dealer will not pay for the repairs) you will have to proceed against the dealer in a court with hopefully the backing of Trading Standards.
If you win the dealer will have to claim against BMW.