Help! Problem starting bike

[joness7]

All

I'm having an unexpected problem getting my bike to start this morning. Dec 2011 R1200GS. Last ridden Thursday 23rd and when it started then I thought the battery sounded a little flat. Also started 24th to move it from garage.

1) No warning lights when turn ignition on, though petrol is a little low - 35 mile range.

2) In neutral, checked kill switch, checked clutch not fouling hand guard. Side stand up or down.

3) Pressing starter, motor turns over, but no ignition. Not coughing and almost starting, just nothing.

4) Tried with a jump battery. Engine turns over slightly faster but nothing else.

So a couple of questions about the most common problems:

a) What are the symptoms of EWS problems? Does it ever cause a problem without a dash warning? How can I diagnose without a spare one?

b) What are the symptoms of a FPC failure? How can I diagnose if this is the problem?

Many thanks in advance. Bit puzzled, bike been pretty reliable up to now.

Anyone in the Greenford/Ealing/W London area who fancies diagnosing my problem for beer tokens, please feel free to come see me!!

Thanks
Steve J

 

[Packer]

Can you smell unburnt fuel in the exhausts?

Have you tried taking out a spark plug, laying it on the head and then turning the engine over to check for sparks? Don't touch it when the engine is spinning as modern spark systems produce a mighty kick, not healthy.

 

[kyrano]

Do you know anyone who has a GS-911 diagnostic tool in your area ???

 

[TLSgazza]

Are you sure it has fuel in it, gauges are not too accurate.
Put a gallon in and try again.

 

[joness7]

UPDATE

All

Thanks for the hints and tips so far.

Took out right (as sat on bike) spark plug. Spark when turning over and small flame coming out spark plug tunnel.

Added some fuel.

Still not starting.

Any more ideas? GS-911 on order. Why didn't I get one ages ago!!

Thanks

 

[B4ndit]

Only had something like this once on my 2011 GSA. It was after being left in a hot garage for a week. I needed to turn it over whilst having the throttle someway open. Then it fired. Bit worrying at first but I guess fuel had evaporated due to the heat. Probably not the same problem at this time of the year but worth giving the throttle some ooomph as you turn it over. BTW this has happened to me on other bikes when they have been left. So its not just a BMW problem.

 

[iftikartaxis]

Won't start

When it last ran did you only run the engine a short while
Before stopping engine
If so you may have flooded the engine
Plugs out dry them off and warm them up
I use a blow lamp
Hope it helps l

 

[Packer]

All

Thanks for the hints and tips so far.

Took out right (as sat on bike) spark plug. Spark when turning over and small flame coming out spark plug tunnel.

Added some fuel.

Still not starting.

Any more ideas? GS-911 on order. Why didn't I get one ages ago!!

Thanks

If you have sparks and flames then you have fuel and the means for combustion. That means that it isn't any of the safety switches like clutch or side stand causing the problem.

+1 on cleaning and heating the plugs and trying again. If you don't have a blow lamp an electric paint stripper will do the job. Use a set of jump leads to hitch up a car battery so that there is plenty of power. Set the cold start lever on the left bar but don't use the throttle unless it fails to start and the plugs come out wet confirming that it's flooded. In that case the carburettor era wisdom was to crank with the throttle wide open. I don't know if that works with fuel injection. Let it crank for maybe 5 - 10 seconds and then check the state of the plugs. You don't want to overheat the starter as they are prone to dropping the permanent magnets.

 

[joness7]

UPDATE 2 - GS911 to the rescue - NOT

Thanks for help so far.

GS-911 arrived. Plugged it in and no fault codes shown. Did some of the injector/idle valve/fuel pump tests and they all seemed to pass, and I could hear the component under test doing its stuff.

So, now I have a diagnostic tool, what should I be looking for next? Is there anything specific in the realtime data I should monitor whilst trying to start? I got some time today so I might try the "heating the plugs" solution a couple of people mentioned.

Still really puzzled. Tube strike approaching and no bike - disaster!!

Thanks
Steve J

 

[Old Wobbly]

Take all plugs out and check gap/clean.
Turn the bike over with a closed throttle and be sure the chambers are clear of fuel
Plugs back in
Battery 100% charged
Fire it up on a closed throttle

As said above - if it ran for a short while on a cold engine then it may be flooded.

 

[duckspeed]

Simple stuff before reaching for the computer
Has it got compression
Has it got fuel
Has it got a spark ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk,

 

[B4ndit]

Has it got an after market alarm. One of these killed my last bike. Would turn over but not fire.

 

[trainman]

Thanks for help so far.

GS-911 arrived. Plugged it in and no fault codes shown. Did some of the injector/idle valve/fuel pump tests and they all seemed to pass, and I could hear the component under test doing its stuff.

So, now I have a diagnostic tool, what should I be looking for next? Is there anything specific in the realtime data I should monitor whilst trying to start? I got some time today so I might try the "heating the plugs" solution a couple of people mentioned.

Still really puzzled. Tube strike approaching and no bike - disaster!!

Thanks
Steve J

I believe, maybe wrong, that GS911 will not always show all FPC issues, I think you need to disprove this first. I assume a 2011 has one?

Does fuel pump make the whirring sound when you key on?, is the FPC an old silver type, does it look ok, including underneath where the wires are down into the tank end connection?. might even be worth doing the bypass mod - do a search on here if not sure how.

these failed so often you need to rule it out, maybe yours is newer but never rule out another FPC failure!

 

[Mistacat]

You can pull an injector and fire it with the GS911 to check for fuel.
I go with the flooded brigade if you have fuel and a spark.
Pull the plugs clean and dry them, while they are out disconnect the primary sides of the coils ( for safety), disconnect the plugs on the injectors and crank it over with the throttle wide open.

 

[joness7]

UPDATE - Fixed!!

All

Many thanks for all the suggestions.

After pulling the injectors and using the GS-911, there was a bit of fuel coming through, but not very much. I was expecting a strong squirt but only got a couple of drops.

When the bike was low on fuel (but not empty) I had moved it around a couple of times. Not something I normally do. This included bouncing it up/down curbs.

So suspecting the fuelling, I proved the fuel pump worked then worked down from the tank. It seems I had a bit of an airlock, because when I reconnected everything, it started. Couple of coughs, then back to life.

So thanks for keeping me looking at the basics!!

Rgds
Steve J

 

[Bendy toy]

Fuel is pumped from one side of the tank to the injectors. The return fuel flow (excess not injected into engine) drives a venturi jet pump to pull fuel from the other side of the tank. If there is a a poor fuel flow, the jet pump wont work efficiently. This is fine until the tank level gets low. The feed side of the tank can then run out of fuel while the other side still has fuel. Air gets sucked into the system.

Personally I would rather have two fuel taps (main and reserve) but BMW prefer the venturi system and (often wonky) fuel gauge.

 

[Tinpot]

2012 GS
Starting problem when hot. No fault found on initial inspection at dealer. Bike started when checked. Insisted there was a problem, I count not starting a problem. They kept it another day and did tests with a hot bike. Phone call yesterday saying bike was ready. New starter motor fitted under warranty. All initial indications were as if battery was shot. Have bought an odyssey battery now myself.

 

[Bendy toy]

Faulty starters are often worse when hot. Faulty batteries of course are worse when cold.