Improved 650 front end

[Bem]

Usual disclaimer things: this is not intended as a “how to” explanation but rather a collection of photos and comments. If you are technically able you will be able to do this job. If you are not then its best left to someone else as there are one or two tricky bits.

I couldn’t resist treating myself in November to a used low mileage 650, the test ride felt to me like coming home to a BMW – the ride quality, the torque curve. The only thing wrong was that front end which under braking was diving faster than a Premier League player in the penalty box. Something had to be done as braking and handling were suffering as a result of the diving, and the ABS didn`t know which way was up or down. So after a little head scratching I recalled that I had seen cartridge fork emulators somewhere as being a possible solution so I found these people http://www.intiminators.com/ who sent me a set the very next day.

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Taking the forks out requires propping the bike up in a convenient place. Using the engine bar mounts made getting all the bits out somewhat easier.

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A little problem found on the way which made me happy to have done the job, was this rather unpleasant find – corrosion starting below the plastic fork cap obviously caused by some moisture getting past and into a dry place. Some vigorous rubbing soon sorted that out. A smear of silicone grease on reassembly should stop this happening again.

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Quick check on volume and condition of oil – looking good!

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If anything the corrosion on the other leg was worse so more vigour required

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Upon reassembly I chose to slip in some fork gaiters by Ariete (photo taken from a funny angle in the garage)

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And so the all important result – whats happened?
It has certainly improved the front end immensely, it now feels direct and connected, clearly not as good as a telelever, but far better than before. Floaty feeling over road bumps whilst maintaining direct contact when cornering. Braking effect is also greatly improved allowing late braking without falling to the ground before finally trying to bite.
Sorted?
Almost. Still wondering if I should cut the preload spacers by the 14mm of the Intiminators, or raise the forks in the clamps. Probably not going to change the springs at present as with the additional preload they seem to me to be about right.
I think I shall just ride and enjoy.

Things still to do:
Check static and loaded sag/ride heights
think about braking
consider a suitable Supermoto front brake conversion

All considered a good result for £150 all in.

And I see the Sasquash conversion has also used these units!

 

[Dean]

nice post and what a difference it makes Bem my front and rear was uprated by FTR suspension and its a different bike from the old soft suspension. The Gators give a different look

Rear = BMW F650 GS 08-09 – OHLINS – S46DR1B
and upratedOHLIN SHOCK SPRING 57/170/180

front = BMW F650 GS ST 08> YACUGAR PROG FF Springs

 

[skywalker]

Hmmm just had a look at how much these are -£170 inc VAT

You would have been better spending your brass at someone like Ron Williams at Maxton Engineering who would have been able to recommend a fork revalve etc than what those things look like. Looks very Heath Robinson. Suspension is a black art and thats reminisent of things like preload spacers for fork springs.
Suspension needs to be set up on a lot more factors than dropping two valves into a pair of forks.

Not convinced - sorry

 

[Bem]

Hmmm just had a look at how much these are -£170 inc VAT

You would have been better spending your brass at someone like Ron Williams at Maxton Engineering who would have been able to recommend a fork revalve etc than what those things look like. Looks very Heath Robinson. Suspension is a black art and thats reminisent of things like preload spacers for fork springs.
Suspension needs to be set up on a lot more factors than dropping two valves into a pair of forks.

Not convinced - sorry

Err, I did not post this to convince anybody of anything, simply a heads up to an upgrade, and no, I don`t want to get into an open discussion about how much I do or do not know about suspension compared to anyone else thanks very much.
Apologies if there any sensitive 650 owners reading this, but the forks are as crude as a crutch and as simple as something from the 60`s and almost anything done will be an improvement. I had actually written this piece in late November (but put off posting - forgot how to link photos!) primarily to highlight the corrosion on the top of the fork legs, and of course to point out that one thing always leads to another. I hope it is some use to other 650 owners in all sorts of ways.

 

[rc mad]

Hmmm just had a look at how much these are -£170 inc VAT

You would have been better spending your brass at someone like Ron Williams at Maxton Engineering who would have been able to recommend a fork revalve etc than what those things look like. Looks very Heath Robinson. Suspension is a black art and thats reminisent of things like preload spacers for fork springs.
Suspension needs to be set up on a lot more factors than dropping two valves into a pair of forks.

Not convinced - sorry

Those 650 forks are basic damper rod forks, there are no valves anywhere in the system, so what bem fitted by himself would be exactly what any suspension shop would have done, and it would have cost a damn sight more to boot! They add a compression stack into the fork btw.

Bem did you go down in oil weight or stay the same?

I ditched the forks on my Dakar for 46mm usd forks 9oem were the same type damper rod forks) I did the work myself, including the shim stacks. It's like a whole nuther bike now

Suspension isn't a black are in the slightest either

 

[skywalker]

Err, I did not post this to convince anybody of anything, simply a heads up to an upgrade, and no, I don`t want to get into an open discussion about how much I do or do not know about suspension compared to anyone else thanks very much.
Apologies if there any sensitive 650 owners reading this, but the forks are as crude as a crutch and as simple as something from the 60`s and almost anything done will be an improvement. I had actually written this piece in late November (but put off posting - forgot how to link photos!) primarily to highlight the corrosion on the top of the fork legs, and of course to point out that one thing always leads to another. I hope it is some use to other 650 owners in all sorts of ways.

Didn't mean to touch a nerve with anyone. What I'm referring to is it looks like a heavy outlay for relative little gain.
I appreciate the forks are basic- usually the damper rods can be reworked for eg welding up the orginal damper holes and remachining etc.
Different grade fork oils can be used, progresive springs etc.
I suppose it was an oppertune moment to see if the original fork caps were seized which looks like it was sorted relatively easily
Have a look here www.maxtonsuspension.co.uk and go to the products page.

 

[curiousexplorer]

giving it a try

Hi, Bem, have been considering this mod for a while now, took the plunge, ordered 2 sets, wife and I both ride 650ties, so will come back after install. Brilliant bike, but as you say, front end needs improving.
Was wondering though, how do you change fork oil when intims are installed??
Already planning for 2 week -VERY bumpy- french side of pyrenees.... can't wait ! Greets, Hans

 

[Bem]

Bem did you go down in oil weight or stay the same?

Hi, Bem, have been considering this mod for a while now, took the plunge, ordered 2 sets, wife and I both ride 650ties, so will come back after install. Brilliant bike, but as you say, front end needs improving.
Was wondering though, how do you change fork oil when intims are installed??
Already planning for 2 week -VERY bumpy- french side of pyrenees.... can't wait ! Greets, Hans

Just a quick response and update
Spacers: I decided after a weeks use to cut the preload spacers down by the 14 mm of the Intiminators (was going to be 12mm but... !) which gives a more balanced/less choppy ride allowing smooth fork action both up and down. Thats about as far as that goes for the moment.

Braking : I have changed the Brembo sintered pads for EBC and a world less speedy has been revealed - that single brake can work quite well! Still thinking about a supermoto if poss.

Oil: along with the intiminators comes a set of instructions - discarded - and a leaflet- also discarded - about recommended oil. It seems that not all equal weights are equal according to this so they do recommend four or five brands. None readily available here so made up my own Petronas mix of 2.5 and 7.5 to get something like a 4.

Oil change: as they are not fixed in the fork but rather sit below the springs and the bottom ledge/mount I assume that when I turn them upside down and pump, besides getting a boot full of oil I shall also cause the insert to exit at medium velocity. Or I may just not bother....

 

[curiousexplorer]

Installed the Intiminators

So, the snow has melted, time to get to work. Put Intiminators in in both our bikes, peace of cake really. Impressions sofar: biggest improvement is much less brake dive, so braking hard feels more secure, and hence there is less time lag between applying the brake lever and actual brake action. could be a life-saver someday. furthermore, not the night-and-day difference that others are describing, but front is definitely more stable and planted, also rebound-damping better.
All in all money well spent, perfection comes in small steps, summer here we come...

And, Bem, which type of EBC's did you put in, and are they still satisfactory?
I tried softer Brembo's a while back, and found them worse, so put the originals back in.

 

[Bem]

And, Bem, which type of EBC's did you put in, and are they still satisfactory?
I tried softer Brembo's a while back, and found them worse, so put the originals back in.

Oops, soory missed this post.

EBC FA209/2 which is the Organic series, seems to work ok in the damp, still waiting for a fully wet day to say how they work then.

 

[curiousexplorer]

thanx!

keep me posted, Bem, how they behave in the long run, in the wet, more disc wear? Seems that sintered pads give more wear than organic, so interesting issue here. Tnx in advance, hans