I've Got Issues

[Robin B'stard]

Had issues with my front suspension since I bought the bike over a year ago. It's a 54 plate GS with 12 1/2 on the clock.

The front is rock solid and regularly understeers on bumpy corners. It's actually washed out on me on two occaisons; one I saved the second, well I didn't and the engine bars did what their supposed to do.
Needless to say I don't have much confidence in the front end.

Tyre pressure are as per book of words.

The shock is set on 1 the (lowest) down from 3 when I bought it and still feels hard. Rider sag on lowest setting is 29mm and on 9(highest) it is 14mm.
I weigh 71kg.

The shock markings are:
7659619
WP13.06 Y.601
2004

The spring markings are:
50-232

Is this a stock spring or made for the heaviest man in Britian?

Surely someome has come across this before.

 

[Shep]

What's the rear suspension set like? If you set it too low (the softest setting for shortarses) then the front can feel a little vague at times and the steering is less than sharp.

12500 miles? is it still on the soriginal front tyre perhaps, if the tyres are tired it can badly affect the handing (especially if you have trailwings fitted IME)

Both my budget 1200's ended up set at the softest at the front and hardest at the rear, that suited me fine. The adv ended up softest at the front and 3/4 hard at the rear.

Shep

 

[Robin B'stard]

What's the rear suspension set like? If you set it too low (the softest setting for shortarses) then the front can feel a little vague at times and the steering is less than sharp.

12500 miles? is it still on the soriginal front tyre perhaps, if the tyres are tired it can badly affect the handing (especially if you have trailwings fitted IME)

Both my budget 1200's ended up set at the softest at the front and hardest at the rear, that suited me fine. The adv ended up softest at the front and 3/4 hard at the rear.

Shep

Tourances on the front and rear.
Rear shock is set on Medium, harder than standard and I have the seat on the highest setting thanks. Ha

 

[Shep]

Tourances on the front and rear.
Rear shock is set on Medium, harder than standard and I have the seat on the highest setting thanks. Ha

I suspect the nut that holds the handlebars is at fault

 

[Tomcat]

I've got an '04 GS and my front shock preload is set at the other end of the scale - from memory its either 1 or 3 notches back from max preload. I upped the preload from std shortly after getting the bike, to cure a problem with handlebar shake at high speed (90+mph). This was recommended by the service team at Vines, and did the trick. I've got huge confidence in the handling - its never given me a scary moment in 40k miles.

 

[Robin B'stard]

I suspect the nut that holds the handlebars is at fault

That's the bit that worries me too.

 

[Robin B'stard]

I've got an '04 GS and my front shock preload is set at the other end of the scale - from memory its either 1 or 3 notches back from max preload. I upped the preload from std shortly after getting the bike, to cure a problem with handlebar shake at high speed (90+mph). This was recommended by the service team at Vines, and did the trick. I've got huge confidence in the handling - its never given me a scary moment in 40k miles.

When I crank the preload up I get virtually no movement in fork travel and only 14mm of rider sag. Never had a problem with handle bar shake just vibration through the bars on every ripple in the road surface. Is yours a WP and does it have a number on the spring. Mine says 50-232 whatever that means- if anything. I was hoping it was a spring rating that someone would recognise.

I've read thruogh most of the posts on suspension and the complaints appear to be that the suspension won't take the weight of riders, missis and laundry. Big variation from my problem.

Maybe I need to stay out of the gym and put more time in at the local.

 

[Colban]

Possible Telelever bearing problem?.
Bike on centre-stand and weigh down the rear;remove the front shock and see if the fork sliders move up and down freely.

 

[luckylucian]

IIRC the front preload (ride height adjutment only not "stiffness") should be on its lowest setting, and the rear should be set so the bikes "attitude" is correct, not so the rider's feet touch the floor. cranking up the rear will put more weight onto the front of the bike.

You have rebound damping at the rear via a slotted screw on the side of the shock, near the bottom on the side (no adjustment on the front suspension). If this is soft, try firming it up - turn toward "H"

Good luck and apologies if you have tried this already

 

[Deleted account 190920001]

puting the figures into this http://www.racingsuspensionproducts.com/spring rate.htm will tell you what spring you have. Maybe someone can then chip in what it should be standard.

 

[Pukmeister]

My 2004 bike was too hard front/too soft rear as standard, so I fitted Wilbers shocks and it transformed the bike.

If you are interested, I removed the shocks when I sold the bike recently so they will be up for sale soon once I can find the time to clean them and take pics/advertise them. I'll be asking £400 the pair (the rear has the optional hydraulic preload adjustment).

 

[Magwych]

When I crank the preload up I get virtually no movement in fork travel and only 14mm of rider sag. Never had a problem with handle bar shake just vibration through the bars on every ripple in the road surface. Is yours a WP and does it have a number on the spring. Mine says 50-232 whatever that means- if anything. I was hoping it was a spring rating that someone would recognise.

I've read thruogh most of the posts on suspension and the complaints appear to be that the suspension won't take the weight of riders, missis and laundry. Big variation from my problem.

Maybe I need to stay out of the gym and put more time in at the local.

I changed my shocks for Wilbers front and back a couple of years ago, and have just checked my old front spring to compare. Sadly, I could not find any markings. It is the later Showa unit, maybe they don't have markings on their springs

Your static sag should be around 25-33 mm, measured as the movement of the sliders in the lower fork legs. If you have no static sag there is something wrong it seems to me. Question is whether it is your forks or your shock ?

If you are competent/confident I would attempt to remove the shock to confirm there is full suspension movement. With the shock out the forks should slide easily up and down. If they do then the shock is looking suspicious.

IIRC the WP front shock can be rebuilt, but not without special tools and knowledge so not something to attempt at home. If the forks don't move, then there is your problem, what to do next I couldn't say. Not much help I know, but it does sound like there is something seriously amiss if it is losing the front end.

 

[Robin B'stard]

I changed my shocks for Wilbers front and back a couple of years ago, and have just checked my old front spring to compare. Sadly, I could not find any markings. It is the later Showa unit, maybe they don't have markings on their springs

Your static sag should be around 25-33 mm, measured as the movement of the sliders in the lower fork legs. If you have no static sag there is something wrong it seems to me. Question is whether it is your forks or your shock ?

If you are competent/confident I would attempt to remove the shock to confirm there is full suspension movement. With the shock out the forks should slide easily up and down. If they do then the shock is looking suspicious.

IIRC the WP front shock can be rebuilt, but not without special tools and knowledge so not something to attempt at home. If the forks don't move, then there is your problem, what to do next I couldn't say. Not much help I know, but it does sound like there is something seriously amiss if it is losing the front end.

I've stripped forks and rebuilt them before on my 750 vfr last year and more recently on my Africa Twin for a trip to Morocco last month, so I'm no stranger to front ends but new to telelever. My thoughts are to take the shock out of the system first and see if I have smooth movement of the forks and telelever arm. The telelever arm is on needle rollers so it's worth giving them a look and a re-grease but I'll need a ball joint tool to split the joint. That should give some indication of the movement in the forks and if there's any binding in the telelever arm.

As for loosing the front, yes it was scary the first time but I recovered with a big load of left foot, the second time I was on the floor before I new what had happened.

I've never had a bike with a front end this hard.

Thanks for your advice

 

[Robin B'stard]

Possible Telelever bearing problem?.
Bike on centre-stand and weigh down the rear;remove the front shock and see if the fork sliders move up and down freely.

Were on the same page at the moment. Will take shock out of system and see what movement I have. Reason for saying this is what movement I have is not smooth and progressive.

 

[Robin B'stard]

My 2004 bike was too hard front/too soft rear as standard, so I fitted Wilbers shocks and it transformed the bike.

If you are interested, I removed the shocks when I sold the bike recently so they will be up for sale soon once I can find the time to clean them and take pics/advertise them. I'll be asking £400 the pair (the rear has the optional hydraulic preload adjustment).

Thanks, I could be interested if I turns out to be the shock.

I'll work my way through the telelever system first to eliminate other possible cures but yes Wilbers sound good.

 

[Robin B'stard]

IIRC the front preload (ride height adjutment only not "stiffness") should be on its lowest setting, and the rear should be set so the bikes "attitude" is correct, not so the rider's feet touch the floor. cranking up the rear will put more weight onto the front of the bike.

You have rebound damping at the rear via a slotted screw on the side of the shock, near the bottom on the side (no adjustment on the front suspension). If this is soft, try firming it up - turn toward "H"

Good luck and apologies if you have tried this already

Hi. Took the bike out for 50 mile ride last night, even took it off road. Left the front on the lowest preload setting and gradually adjusted the rear preload from high to low. The rear ride became more confortable but didn't make any difference to the front or overall feel. I haven't altered the rebound damping yet as I feel the problem is at the front.
Rode the bike down every high street on my route and over every bump in the road. Going to the dentist later to have my fillings repaired. Lol.
But thanks.

P.S. Love the avitar

 

[Robin B'stard]

puting the figures into this http://www.racingsuspensionproducts.com/spring rate.htm will tell you what spring you have. Maybe someone can then chip in what it should be standard.

Thanks for the link.
Front shock has 9 coils and is 67mm diameter and wire is 10mm and marking 50-232.
converting to imperial for the website tool gives a spring rating of 6.24kg/mm.

Can anyone shed any light on what it should be as standard.

I talked to a guy who has ohlins on the GS that were supplied as standard at 5.5kg/mm for 13.5 stone rider. As he is 15+ stone he had them changed to 6.25kg/mm. But thats ohlins and mine are WP.

Just checked the rear:
6 coils 67mm diameter and 13mm wire
gives a rear spring of 13.3kg/mm

 

[shugie]

Thanks, I could be interested if I turns out to be the shock.

I'll work my way through the telelever system first to eliminate other possible cures but yes Wilbers sound good.

They are, but try changing the rear first, might sort you and that's cheaper than buying a front as well. Changing the front shock seems to make less difference.

 

[Robin B'stard]

They are, but try changing the rear first, might sort you and that's cheaper than buying a front as well. Changing the front shock seems to make less difference.

I don't have an issue with the rear. I changed the setting on a 50 mile ride last night, which improved the rear but didn't affect the front. It feels good and better since I've taken some damping off it this morning.

The general harshness of the front and the excessive chatter over anything larger than a matchstick suggests its the front. It's a bit like riding a pogo stick. I changed the back shock preload from highest to lowest and the front stays the same.
But your comments are very welcome.

Can you tell me a bit more about your shocks, how old are they, how many miles have they done and what was the original set up i.e rider weight and application/style of riding. I'm a tad under 12 stone so I don't need a big spring rate.

 

[Magwych]

... I'm no stranger to front ends but new to telelever. My thoughts are to take the shock out of the system first and see if I have smooth movement of the forks and telelever arm. The telelever arm is on needle rollers so it's worth giving them a look and a re-grease but I'll need a ball joint tool to split the joint. That should give some indication of the movement in the forks and if there's any binding in the telelever arm.

As for loosing the front, yes it was scary the first time but I recovered with a big load of left foot, the second time I was on the floor before I new what had happened.

I've never had a bike with a front end this hard.

Thanks for your advice

Check your movemnet without splitting the ball joint. If ity smooth then all is well, if it doesn't move then it will those pivots or the sliders stuck in the lowers. How weell do you know the previous owner(s). Is it possible that it has got bent sliders, that could cause some sticktion. If you sdplit teh ball joint and it is stiff, that might be cos something is out of alignment. If you plit the ball joint and it is all smoothly moving, that could be becuase something is now realigned - no conclusion could be drawn. IIWY I would take it slowly and check each item as you go. If the forks legs are stuck you might find the front shock is a sod to get out if it is stuck in a compressed state, so keep you fingers clear of a suddenly uncompressing shock.

Some members have found the bottom mounting bolt a PIA to remove, others not. I poured boiling over the surrouding telever to warm the metals and loosen any therad lock - no problems for me.

Let us know how you get on ...