spoons
Registered user
@NitroMax we are in almost identical situations right now. Are you also doing this with a glass of wine?
JohnGS1100 Tuning Chip
- Thread starter uncle dick
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NitroMax
Registered user
Nope, coffee and a cigar 
It works fine your CO-POT? Gives correct results (ohm)?
Let us know please what are the better results for your bike (by the chip)
Let us know please what are the better results for your bike (by the chip)
NitroMax
Registered user
It works fine your CO-POT? Gives correct results (ohm)?
Let us know please what are the better results for your bike (by the chip)
Not sure about what to do with the CCP as you said to remove it. Did you mean I have to leave it out now ?
Results of me measuring the CO pot are a couple of post above this one. Not sure which value to set it to ? A value somewhere inbetween ?
Yes inbetween. The co-pot work by these setings of CCP on R850-1100 :
1. No CCP. Gives rich fuel, recommended by large air intake tubes.
2. CCP little brown (30, 87a), standard fuel, recommend by stock air intakes tubes.
Try both
1. No CCP. Gives rich fuel, recommended by large air intake tubes.
2. CCP little brown (30, 87a), standard fuel, recommend by stock air intakes tubes.
Try both
Roger 04 RT
Registered user
Okay, tried several values. turning the screw changes the settings all at the same time, least affecting value 1 & 3
Suggested by John:
1&3: 0.983
1&2: 205
2&3: 792
Setting value 1&2 as suggested by John gives:
1&3: 1027
1&2: 205 (duh
2&3: 825
Setting value 2&3 as suggested by John gives:
1&3: 1029
1&2: 240
2&3: 792 ( remember
Setting the values as suggested by John's friend:
1&3: 1.03K
1&2: 203.7
2&3: 834
results in
Setting 1&2 as suggested :
1&3: 1028
1&2: 203 ( right
2&3: 829
Seting 2&3 as suggested;
1&3: 1028
1&2: 196
2&3: 834 ( of course )
Should I try to get somewhere inbetween on one of the given values ( starting with John's values ) ?
The resistance between 1&3 should always be the same.
I wouldn't spend a lot of time fine tuning the co pot. The differences in settings that you're describing make a small change in the fueling at idle. Ideally you would set it for an idle AFR of 14:1, which is where the boxer engine idles pretty well.
The co pot affects light load afr, but by the time you're going 55-60 mph, there is no effect.
John made the best suggestion earlier. Set the co pot so your bike idles best if you can't measure afr or co.
If you're interested the chart below shows how rich a stock r1100 is at idle with to coding plug and no co pot (11.8:1). When you install the co pot, it lets you lean the idle mixture to a target of 14:1, as I mentioned earlier.
NitroMax
Registered user
Thanks for the advice guys !
@ Roger: it took a lot of turning the screw to get the 1&3 value to change and then the other values were waaaaaaay off.
At least I now know the CO pot is working ( and again I've learned something
), I'll bolt everything back up and try the bike again.
All this just to get the last bit of irregularity out of the idle. From idle up the bike feels much smoother and it reacts crispier
I can have the CO measured at a friends garage, but that machine works on %% ?
@ Roger: it took a lot of turning the screw to get the 1&3 value to change and then the other values were waaaaaaay off.
At least I now know the CO pot is working ( and again I've learned something
), I'll bolt everything back up and try the bike again.All this just to get the last bit of irregularity out of the idle. From idle up the bike feels much smoother and it reacts crispier
I can have the CO measured at a friends garage, but that machine works on %% ?
You can adjust the CO-POT by this mashine.
Here is a table, CO-LAMBDA-AFR :
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7b6GlMSZji5RkszSUxsNmhYNkE/view?usp=sharing
NitroMax
Registered user
I don't have a Lambda ? But according to Roger's 14:1 I should have a CO of 1 % ?
Just back from 2 testrides ( sunny but cold, love it ),
CO-pot adjusted to:
1&3: 1030 ( was on 1027 before I started it all )
1&2: 205
2&3: 830
but when warm the idle did not go back below 1600 revs so I turned the screw back out untill it was at 1100 revs and went back out again.
It remains at 1100 revs and I think the irregularity has gone. The -very light- KFR/surge it had developed during all this fiddling has gone too
I'll take the CO-pot off again to see what the values are now ( for other readers and future reverence ) but first I'll take it out for a longer trip as long as the sun is shining
Just back from 2 testrides ( sunny but cold, love it ),
CO-pot adjusted to:
1&3: 1030 ( was on 1027 before I started it all )
1&2: 205
2&3: 830
but when warm the idle did not go back below 1600 revs so I turned the screw back out untill it was at 1100 revs and went back out again.
It remains at 1100 revs and I think the irregularity has gone. The -very light- KFR/surge it had developed during all this fiddling has gone too
I'll take the CO-pot off again to see what the values are now ( for other readers and future reverence
) but first I'll take it out for a longer trip as long as the sun is shining
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7b6GlMSZji5RkszSUxsNmhYNkE&authuser=0
The pdf file, has the corresponding conversion from CO to lambda or AFR (no needed to have lambda sensor on your bike).
You can also adjust the CO-POT on your bike by your friend's mashine.
For example you can adjust the CO-POT (on bike and by machine) to CO= 1.8% (3.000-4.000 rpms). THE AFR will be (as you see at pdf file) for CO=1.8% ==> AFR=13,81:1.
That is a good AFR at middle revs of rpm, give the best torque by good consumption..
Take a look at this :
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7b6GlMSZji5WmJsUEQ5MVNqdnM&authuser=0
Roger 04 RT
Registered user
John, Not a good idea to do it at 3000-4000, as it will result in too rich at idle.I don't have a Lambda ? But according to Roger's 14:1 I should have a CO of 1 % ?
Just back from 2 testrides ( sunny but cold, love it ),
CO-pot adjusted to:
1&3: 1030 ( was on 1027 before I started it all )
1&2: 205
2&3: 830
but when warm the idle did not go back below 1600 revs so I turned the screw back out untill it was at 1100 revs and went back out again.
It remains at 1100 revs and I think the irregularity has gone. The -very light- KFR/surge it had developed during all this fiddling has gone too
I'll take the CO-pot off again to see what the values are now ( for other readers and future reverence
Nitro,
Make sure the engine is fully warmed up before you start.
Since you can measure CO at the tailpipe, and using the table that John linked for you, I would recommend getting the CO to 2% then using the BBS to bring the idle to 1100, then double check the CO. This will be the correct RPM with an AFR around 13.8:1. Your bike should be very happy.
Using the CO pot to adjust idle isn't a good idea. If you bring the idle down that way you have made the afr too lean.
Yes you rigth Roger but, that is for stock chip.
NitroMax has a mod chip.. I make at mod chip little lean incection table (than stock) of fuell at 3000-4000, little richer (about 8%) at 800-1.900 and much richer at high 5.100-8.000+ (variable from 8-15%). So by adjust the CO-POT at 1.8 % CO (13,8:1), the AFR will be correct (and very little richer) at all revs of rpms.
As i said i like to adjust the CO-POT by a practical way, like carburetors..
On bike, start engine. By keeping the throttles position at 3.500 rpms, adjust the CO-POT (very easy and slowly by a screwdriver) until the rpms goes little up to to 3.550-3.600..
That means that AFR is the best for power by a stantard position of throttles at middle revs (most driveability), i think that the AFR sould be 14,2:1 and this AFR at middle is for the best for max torque by the better consumption.
Anyway i hope not confuse, and just help
NitroMax has a mod chip.. I make at mod chip little lean incection table (than stock) of fuell at 3000-4000, little richer (about 8%) at 800-1.900 and much richer at high 5.100-8.000+ (variable from 8-15%). So by adjust the CO-POT at 1.8 % CO (13,8:1), the AFR will be correct (and very little richer) at all revs of rpms.
As i said i like to adjust the CO-POT by a practical way, like carburetors..
On bike, start engine. By keeping the throttles position at 3.500 rpms, adjust the CO-POT (very easy and slowly by a screwdriver) until the rpms goes little up to to 3.550-3.600..
That means that AFR is the best for power by a stantard position of throttles at middle revs (most driveability), i think that the AFR sould be 14,2:1 and this AFR at middle is for the best for max torque by the better consumption.
Anyway i hope not confuse, and just help
Take a look what happen at AFR at R1100 :
Stock chip - CCP little brown (30,87a) - no lambda on bike - stock adjustment TPS (0,366V) -
CO-POT (as BMW said) - 1 & 3 - 0,983K ohms 1 & 2 - 205 ohms 2 & £ - 792 ohms..:
Stock chip - CCP little brown (30,87a) - no lambda on bike - stock adjustment TPS (0,366V) -
CO-POT (as BMW said) - 1 & 3 - 0,983K ohms 1 & 2 - 205 ohms 2 & £ - 792 ohms..:
Roger 04 RT
Registered user
Yes you rigth Roger but, that is for stock chip.
NitroMax has a mod chip.. I make at mod chip little lean incection table (than stock) of fuell at 3000-4000, little richer (about 8%) at 800-1.900 and much richer at high 5.100-8.000+ (variable from 8-15%). So by adjust the CO-POT at 1.8 % CO (13,8:1), the AFR will be correct (and very little richer) at all revs of rpms.
As i said i like to adjust the CO-POT by a practical way, like carburetors..
On bike, start engine. By keeping the throttles position at 3.500 rpms, adjust the CO-POT (very easy and slowly by a screwdriver) until the rpms goes little up to to 3.550-3.600..
That means that AFR is the best for power by a stantard position of throttles at middle revs (most driveability), i think that the AFR sould be 14,2:1 and this AFR at middle is for the best for max torque by the better consumption.
Anyway i hope not confuse, and just help
I understand what you're saying, but in neutral at 3500 rpm there is very little additional Engine Load, the engine is just spinning faster. I think you'll find a good result and a good idle by CO adjustment at idle.
This little position of throttles is enough for adjust the CO-POT. I was make that to many R1100 .
The AFR is the same at position 20-60% of throttles and the surge problem is at little opening position, so this way is a good solution for R1100 no cat.
.The AFR is the same at position 20-60% of throttles and the surge problem is at little opening position, so this way is a good solution for R1100 no cat.
Also i make consumption measurements to R1100 cat (lambda) VS R1000 no lambda.
The max consumption *(by stage 5 chip) for R1100 (lambda) is 330 Km per 20 litres and for R1100 (no lambda) is 280 Km per 20 litres (by stock adjust CO-POT) and 340 Km/20 lit. by adjust the CO-POT by practical way.
The max consumption *(by stage 5 chip) for R1100 (lambda) is 330 Km per 20 litres and for R1100 (no lambda) is 280 Km per 20 litres (by stock adjust CO-POT) and 340 Km/20 lit. by adjust the CO-POT by practical way.
NitroMax
Registered user
Okay, back from a nice short trip I read your comments and decided to take the CO-pot off again to measure the values and guess what, they were "a bit" off .
Measuring
1&3: 1028
1&2: 65
2&3: 967
So I set it back to the previous setting (1030/205/830 ) and adjusted the BBS to lower idle. Didn't take note of all the changes I made so I can't remember how many turns they were out.
Now they are on left 2 1/4 and right 2 3/4, so they do need a bit more adjusting with the carbtune but the engine needed cooling down
Couldn't use the CO machine, earliest will probably be next saturday, I'm too busy all evenings this week
Measuring
1&3: 1028
1&2: 65
2&3: 967
So I set it back to the previous setting (1030/205/830 ) and adjusted the BBS to lower idle. Didn't take note of all the changes I made so I can't remember how many turns they were out.
Now they are on left 2 1/4 and right 2 3/4, so they do need a bit more adjusting with the carbtune but the engine needed cooling down
Couldn't use the CO machine, earliest will probably be next saturday, I'm too busy all evenings this week
spoons
Registered user
Has anyone who had been using a John-chip on a lambda bike noticed the motto nic adaptation that was hinted at earlier in the thread?
I have reinstalled the lambda on my 99 r1100gs, standard filter, remus exhaust, 30-87-87a bike as the copot is present but missing the cable to the loom.
Is the motto nic adaptation a reality?
I have reinstalled the lambda on my 99 r1100gs, standard filter, remus exhaust, 30-87-87a bike as the copot is present but missing the cable to the loom.
Is the motto nic adaptation a reality?
spoons
Registered user
Also, my COpot is missing the cable from COpot to motronic or main wiring loom. It is present on my bike but not plugged in. Any idea of part number for this item?
Spoons, dude you need to check out the part fiches on max BMW or real own. Do the digging yourself. Only you know what's Connected to what because you have the bike in front of you.
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