Kenwood TK-3201 & 3301 - can frequencies be changed?

[trebor]

My IAM group use the Kenwood TK-3201 and 3301 licence free PMR446 radios for our observed rides and group rideouts.

However, we want to improve our range and are considering getting radios of higher power and using external aerials, so we are looking into getting a BR Simple UK Licence from Ofcom.
The trouble is we don't want to loose the investment we have already made in the PMR446 radios and intend to phase the higher wattage radios in. Now the frequencies the PMR446 radios use are all in the region of 446MHz (hence the name, PMR446 ) and the frequencies we're hoping to use are around 449MHz.
Does anyone know whether, with the correct programming lead and software, the frequencies of the TK-3201 and 3301 radios can be adjusted upwards to 449MHz?

Cheers

Bob

 

[russ996duke]

try

http://www.transmission1.co.uk/forum/index.php?sid=1e3cf91a33e32d91b8e2252decbf9e90

seem to be a lot of tekies/nerds on there......

 

[trebor]

Cheers Russ, I'll check it out.

Bob

 

[gipsymagpie]

Ta da

Manual

Page 12 - enjoy. I am having to do it so Icom F25SR can work with it.

Next time, trust in the google.....

 

[AberdeenAngus]

Flog em and use the money to get some VHF units.
Considerably better range for the same power.
Plenty of vhf frequencies you can use if you have a licence.

 

[trebor]

Manual

Page 12 - enjoy. I am having to do it so Icom F25SR can work with it.

Next time, trust in the google.....

Thanks for that but, unfortunately, the manual only tells you how to assign the frequencies in the existing programmed table to particular channel positions on the channel switch. All the frequencies in the existing table are all 446MHz ones and I want to use some 449MHz frequencies, so I need to know if I can change the frequencies in the table.

Believe me, I have already searched for the answer using google and other search facilities

Bob

 

[SilverFish]

If it helps, the software for the Wouxon radios (as resold by Intaride) gave you the ability to program them to frequencies higher or lower than 446Mhz, but whether or not they actually worked I cannot say for sure.

Of course, I've not seen the Kenwood software for over five years and cant remember if it every had or has this option, or if the TK-3301 or 3201 will support it.

Cheers

Mike

 

[gipsymagpie]

Thanks for that but, unfortunately, the manual only tells you how to assign the frequencies in the existing programmed table to particular channel positions on the channel switch. All the frequencies in the existing table are all 446MHz ones and I want to use some 449MHz frequencies, so I need to know if I can change the frequencies in the table.

Believe me, I have already searched for the answer using google and other search facilities

Bob

Sorry, I should have read the whole post. RTFQ as my teacher used to say. I reckon you would be better to flog the pmr and get a bulk buy discount on the licence ones.

 

[skipper]

Even with the programming software (KPG-90D for the 3201, KPG-121DE for the TK3301) you can only pick from the list of 8 available frequencies:

446.00625 MHz
446.01875 MHz
446.03125 MHz
446.04375 MHz
446.05625 MHz
446.06875 MHz
446.08125 MHz
446.09375 MHz

and 38 QT/DQT codes.

Then you can't add an antenna, but I guess you wanted to leave these and slowly migrate.

You could buy some business radios and programme these to 446Mhz and then when all updated change to 449MHZ but that's breaking the law on a few counts and Ofcom fines can be heavy if you are caught.

No good being a good citizen and riding correctly and then being a naughty boy elsewhere. Amateur radio enthusiasts have also passed exams.

Remember programming software in the wrong hands can be dangerous and it can be so easy to get a frequency wrong and end up on an emergency service channel.

This was copied from the member (and very good) on the bikersoracle forum and also the supplier of a UHF (445Mhz +/- 20 ) antenna setup.

The TK3x01 range is compliant to the UK PMR446 spec and is internally limited to half watt, it has a non removable antenna (the main reasons that most users suffer problems) and the PMR446 frequencies available to use are limited but have a number of the QT channels to provide some “separation” of channel usage. There is a little more to it but these are also the reasons you do not need to get an Ofcom broadcasting licence to operate such PMR446 sets. Anything that isn’t truly PMR446 compliant has to have a licence to be legal and then you get allocated one or more channels away from the PMR 446 frequencies.
Having said that I do know of one guy who got out his soldering iron and pulled his 3201 set apart, taken off the fixed antenna, obtained and fitted an aerial socket onto the PCB so that he can fit one of the remote antenna kits. He will get a bit more radiated power but at half watt max he may lose some down the coax and it’s still an illegal set up.

So if you want to stay legal and keep the 3x01 then there is nothing you can do except try to keep the antenna as upright as possible. Not easy under the seat. One of my buddies has it in his top box which is always on his GS1200. His Mrs keeps hers kinda upright in a chunky tank bag she has. I used to use a TK3101, the previous generation of PMR446 radio and luckily I could lodge it under the seat of my VFR and the rubber antenna could poke straight up through a small hole in the rear fairing. Problem was my wife’s radio was under the seat of her Hornet and almost horizontal next to the sub-frame so they were OK for a couple hundred yards and then the sound turned to mush.

Alternatives? Pretty much anything takes you off the legal straight and narrow and there are a myriad of choices on ways to go.
Those that do stray mostly obtain a different radio that can push out a bit more power. It may be new or used, UK or foreign (mostly far east in origin), is frequency programmable and has a detachable antenna.

I think you need to consider about how you want to go on from here. There are lots of posts on alternative sets in the Antenna thread on Bikers Oracle central/ Group Buys and a dedicated communication forum on ukGSer.com if you want to consider cranking up the power.

I read in the thread that VHF is recommened however has anyone come up trumps with a good antenna for VHF on a motorbike ?

So in the long and the short sell what you have and start again......

A good article appeared on this forum by mr magicfingers

A licence mentioned in the opening thread "A simple UK light licence" will cost £75 and lasts 5 years, willl allow 3 frequencies in the UHF band (449.3125MHz 449.4000MHz 449.4750MHz) and another 12 spread accross the VHF spectrum.


Skipper

 

[trebor]

Thanks for the info Skipper. I was afraid that it wasn't going to be possible to change the frequencies, if not then the idea is a non-flyer

Then you can't add an antenna, but I guess you wanted to leave these and slowly migrate.

You can if you modify them but this would take them outwith of the licence free T&Cs, which isn't a problem if you have a Simple licence and are using only the frequencies the licence covers.

Amateur radio enthusiasts have also passed exams.

Yeh, I know, though I'm not a ham, I have a Marine Radio General Cert. from 30 odd years ago (anyone for morse at 30 words a minute?).

remember programming software in the wrong hands can be dangerous and it can be so easy to get a frequency wrong and end up on an emergency service channel.

No worries there, my day job nowadays is a Telecoms Engineer, I'm more familiar with Motorola radios and their programming software though, I've never had anything to do with Kenwoods until recently. At work I have a nice new £30,000 radio test set that I can test for correct operation

I read in the thread that VHF is recommened however has anyone come up trumps with a good antenna for VHF on a motorbike ?

I know Wiz, on Bikers Oracle, is using VHF radios for the leader and TEC to keep in touch when taking out their official tours, not sure what antenna he's using though.

Again, thanks for the info.
Unfortunately changing all the radios isn't really an option, it would be too expensive, and being a charity we have to keep costs in mind. There must be a way to change the frequencies in that damned table, I'll have to do a bit more digging and find out how the table is stored, there may be a way of hacking it. I should think the radio will tune up to 449Mhz.

Bob