Nitron NTR R1 Rear Shock

[SuperTed]

Well I received a nice shiny Nitron shock and fitted it on the bike. (Actually that should be 'got it fitted'...but, anyway...)
Now I will admit that the original shock had nearly 56500 miles on it, but the difference from old to new is amazing!
All smooth progressive motion that has already improved my corner speed, and will improve it more once I've sorted the front...which is being shown up as rather 'choppy' and obviously needs sorting out - which you would have thought I'd have known
Having got completely contradictory advice from several people who seem to think of themselves as 'experts' (all of which made me feel like this: ) I spoke to two suspension firms who both said the same thing:
"As long as the springs are okay try 10w fork oil rather than the standard 7w."
Well the static sag and the springs are fine, and I have since found that HyperPro supply 10w with their springs.
The difference between how good the back is now and how the front just isn't was hi-lighted last weekend. I had my 17 year old nephew as pillion and he commented on how smooth the ride was on the back, but why was I having to fight the front?
So the fork oil is getting changed next week and I'll let you know if it helps.
SuperTed

 

[Bem]

Good news!
I have been waiting for someone to "buy and try" before I join in.
Weekly updates please!

 

[ferrol]

It went on an 650/800?

Also.....Picture please!

 

[SuperTed]

Fair Question

Yes, I should have said - I have a 2008 F800GS 'Bumblebee' (which we all know are the fastest ones).
Plus I should say that the Nitron shock is designed to drop the seat height by 30mm.
As standard the bike is just that bit too tall for me, and when I test rode it I was not keen on the handling with the 21" front wheel. I'm not saying it didn't corner with accuracy, I just didn't like the extra input needed compared to the 19" on my R1150GS.
So the 800 has got a 19" front rim with the standard front springs. Which means it handles the way I like, and I can reach the floor as a bonus.
Fork oil is being changed next Wednesday so I will be able to report back on Wednesday evening. I have to go up to Sudbury, Suffolk and back via Finchingfield and Dunmow on Wednesday so a 110 mile round trip will show if its worked.
I'll post a couple of pictures when I've figured out how too - or got some-one to show me.
SuperTed

 

[sethmopp]

For the 19" front wheel, did you fit the one off the 650 or 700 or get an aftermarket rim. The 21" wheel is what is currently putting me off considering an F800GS.

 

[SuperTed]

19" Rim

I had the wheel rebuilt with the 19" rim. It works out rather cheaper and easier than trying to fit the wheel from a 650/700. The 800 is the only one of the three with USD forks, and the 650 variant is single disc as well, so you have to sort out the axle, brakes, disc carriers, yada yada...where as just the rim is quite quick and doesn't change anything else.
I've seen several comments saying that it affects the ABS, but it doesn't. The smaller rim does not change the speed the hub spins at so the ABS ring is unaffected. (Cue lots of posts saying I'm wrong. )
It might, might, make the ABS cut in very slightly sooner, but tell me that's a bad thing.
If you want to get radical I've seen an F8GS at a BMW Club Rally that had a 17" front rim and some very grippy supersport tyres. He then had the pegs scraping on several corners on the ride out. But that's maybe going a tad to far...
Good luck with finding a bike - and making it the way You want it.
SuperTed

 

[Alan R]

I took some measurements of the outside diameter of my f800gs and r1200gs front wheels complete with their tyres. There was less than 50mm difference which I didn't think would make much difference to the abs. It's good to know that your experience bears this out. Do you have a photograph you could post of the new wheel? I am still considering the change and would be interested in where you obtained the 19" rim and where you had the wheel built - only if you wished to share.
Alan R

 

[SuperTed]

Photos and 10x Oil

Well the fork oil got changed for the 10w this morning and Yep, that made a difference.
The front has slowed down and is a whole lot less choppy. It actually feels like the internals are doing the job of controlling the spring. I'm not saying it is as good as the Nitron shock, that would mean spending a bucket load of money I don't currently have, but it is that close I'm happy to live with it until I can afford to do something with the cartridges.
As requested I have posted - sorry, I got my brother to post...a couple of photos of the shock insitu with the remote preload bolted on with the rear brake reservoir. The front wheel has the size & spec for the 19" rim, it is there but you might have to look for it, and shows the extra gap to the mudguard. I don't know exactly where the rim was done but try Hagon in London who are ace wheel builders.

 

[SuperTed]

My Bad...

So having another look at the photo of the front wheel this morning and I realised that you can't read the spec for the rim.
Sorry. So it is: J 19X2.15-36h 12/10
That's 19" diameter x 2.15" width and has 36 spoke holes. No, I don't know what the '12/10' means.
The tyre is a ContiTrailAttack2 (110/80 R 19) and they are highly recommended.
Given the corrosion in the centre of my front wheel hub (on the other side, not visible in the picture) while your wheel is being rebuilt I would recommend getting the hub stripped and powder coated. I'm planning on finding a 2nd hub, getting that done and then getting Hagon's to re-lace the front with the refurbed hub. But it wont be for a while as I've just spent all the bike money on a new rear shock.

Which is where we came in...

 

[Alan R]

So having another look at the photo of the front wheel this morning and I realised that you can't read the spec for the rim.
Sorry. So it is: J 19X2.15-36h 12/10
That's 19" diameter x 2.15" width and has 36 spoke holes. No, I don't know what the '12/10' means.
The tyre is a ContiTrailAttack2 (110/80 R 19) and they are highly recommended.
Given the corrosion in the centre of my front wheel hub (on the other side, not visible in the picture) while your wheel is being rebuilt I would recommend getting the hub stripped and powder coated. I'm planning on finding a 2nd hub, getting that done and then getting Hagon's to re-lace the front with the refurbed hub. But it wont be for a while as I've just spent all the bike money on a new rear shock.

Which is where we came in...

Thanks for all that Superted, that is really useful information and feels like the basis of a small winter project.
Alan R

 

[SuperTed]

Motorcycle Live & Hagon Products Ltd

So back from the NEC Motorcycle Live yesterday and while there I spoke to a nice man from Hagon Products about the corrosion on my front wheel hub.
He confirmed that Hagon's can sort it out for me and that I should drop in to see the wheel dept some time for them to look at it and give me a price.
Well dropping in to see them is simple as they are only two and half miles from my gaff.
As soon as I have done that I'll let you know what they say.
I'll see if I can post some before and after photos as well.
Toodle pip for now
SuperTed

 

[SuperTed]

Well I took my front wheel in to Hagon's last week and they are sorting the corrosion on the hub.
To dismantle, get the old paint off, sort the corrosion, two layers of paint, new bearings, and rebuild the chap reckoned around £130 - £150; and he'd be surprised if it was as much as £150. Plus they are going to get the rust off the ABS ring while they've got it.
I should have it back in about two and a half weeks. I'll keep you posted.

 

[Phil-H]

I had the wheel rebuilt with the 19" rim. It works out rather cheaper and easier than trying to fit the wheel from a 650/700. The 800 is the only one of the three with USD forks, and the 650 variant is single disc as well, so you have to sort out the axle, brakes, disc carriers, yada yada...where as just the rim is quite quick and doesn't change anything else.
I've seen several comments saying that it affects the ABS, but it doesn't. The smaller rim does not change the speed the hub spins at so the ABS ring is unaffected. (Cue lots of posts saying I'm wrong. )
It might, might, make the ABS cut in very slightly sooner, but tell me that's a bad thing.
If you want to get radical I've seen an F8GS at a BMW Club Rally that had a 17" front rim and some very grippy supersport tyres. He then had the pegs scraping on several corners on the ride out. But that's maybe going a tad to far...
Good luck with finding a bike - and making it the way You want it.
SuperTed

Please clarify, how does the hub of a smaller wheel not run faster than that of a larger one (when running at the same forward speed?

 

[SuperTed]

Hub versus Rim Speed

Well I'm no expert but what I have understood is:
When turning the wheel one rotation everything from tyre to hub also turns 360 degrees.
From the largest diameter, the tyre, to the rim, spokes, discs, and hub, everything goes round one rotation.
So if the tyre on the smaller wheel (19") is the same as the rim on the larger wheel (21") it should not change how fast the hub turns.
When I collect my refurbed wheel from Hagons I will ask them and post their answer.
As I said, I'm no expert - but they are.

But then I don't understand why a water-skier is traveling faster in a straight line than the boat towing them...

 

[Phil-H]

Using an online tyre sizing guide;

90/90-21 vs 110/80-19;
27.3'' dia vs 25.9''
86'' circumference vs 81.4''
736.6 revs/mile vs 777.8

 

[SuperTed]

Well like I said, I'm no expert.
I think I understand where you are coming from, but...I am not an engineer or a physicist so I actually don't care whether the 19" rim makes the hub spin faster or not; and the difference in your figures is only just 5% so a huge difference it is not.
All I can tell you from a riding point of view is that it handles that bit better; that's just my opinion I haven't done exhaustive testing; doesn't seem to effect the ABS, and helps me reach the floor.
So unless you can explain why the skier is moving faster than the boat, in simple terms, we'll leave it there.
I will post a picture of the refurbed wheel when I get it as the 'after' to go with the 'before' photo I posted last night.

 

[Bem]

To return to the starting point: How are you getting on with that shock Ted? Any updates on handling after riding in the winter storms?

 

[SuperTed]

I hope you are being ironic when you say 'winter storms', Bem, we haven't had any of them in Essex!
If we do it'll be a surprise for the bluebells that came up in December and the crocuses that have come up in the last week.
Any way - the Nitron shock: having been out to a mid-week BMW Club do on a damp & drizzly day down some fairly slimy country roads the bike is a lot more sure footed in dodgy conditions, and the grip levels are improved in the wet.
The feel of the bike is reminding me of the difference Ohlins suspension made to my 1150GS - but at half the price.
I am hoping to get the other side effect with the Nitron on the 800 that the Ohlins gave on the 1150 - improved tyre life. I was using Tourance's on the bigger GS and getting around 12-13000 miles. After the suspension change I was getting 16-17000 from a set.
I might put monthly reports on here once we are into the better weather, but it might be better to do that in a different thread.
So to sum up: the bike is more sure footed, grip levels are up, and it feels a whole lot better and smoother.
Once the front wheel is back in it I'll keep you updated as to how I get on.
SuperTed

 

[DaveC]

19" front wheel

Thanks for the info about the 19" front wheel. I've been thinking of doing exactly the same. I've priced up a new hub & bearings etc so I can swap between the two. I'll definitely give it a go now after your success

As to the speed difference, it's quite simple. The 19" wheel is smaller so every rotation it goes a shorter distance. So it has to go a bit quicker to get to where it should be or your back wheel would catch it up

 

[SuperTed]

Well That's a Big Improvement

Well having got my wheel back from Hagon's the other day the difference is amazing. For a very reasonable £138, including new bearings, the wheel now looks like this: