Pannier Corrosion

[purds]

I don't agree with the 'common sense' argument I'm afraid.

I like to think I'm reasonably intelligent and not particularly lacking in common sense. However, until I read this thread I had no idea that the panniers as supplied could effectively be corroded to this extent in such a short period of time. A further point is of course that there appears to be no warning of this or of any requirement to take special precautions to avoid this problem.

My 'common sense' sense would, however, suggest that it is completely forseeable that the panniers would be contaminated with water and salt from the roads and, if corrosion was therefore a real possibility, they should be protected in the same way that any other metal item is - by painting or powder coating.

 

[LiquidLAN]

Bahnstormer say sorry not covered by warranty but we will give them a polish for you. Currently awaiting the results of this. It seems that if other parts of the bike corrode prematurely it is taken seriously and dealt with under warranty but the panniers can rust to hell as soon as they are bought because they are made of unfinished aluminium. So the BIG question is ....

WHY ARE THEY MADE FROM UNFINISHED ULLUMINIUM?

The spokes on the bike are galvanised because otherwise the would rust in contact with salty roads, the rest of the bike is stainless steel or painted so presumably it doesn’t corrode but they probably didn’t anticipate salt reaching the panniers what with them being so far off the ground!

Mate, you just arent going to get anywhere with this here... its a discussion that will run and run - all that you will acheive is getting yourself more and more wound up.

wilbjr21 came up with a reasonable explaintion - but I foolishly thought that all aliminium was galvanised - I've since realised thats not the case.

 

[MikeP]

So, out of interest, how much would people be prepared to pay to have their ali panniers (TT and BMW) protected from the elements?

(I see a business opportunity here).

 

[wilbjr21]

Purds:

I'm not having a go at you or anyone else. My "common sense" bit comes from the fact that I know alumium corrodes on the surface, so it will loose it's showroom shine. Now if you weren't aware of this then it's a solely maintenance issue.

Timolgra gave a good link earlier in this thread that explains it all.

 

[LiquidLAN]

So, out of interest, how much would people be prepared to pay to have their ali panniers (TT and BMW) protected from the elements?

(I see a business opportunity here).

depends on what you are are proposing I guess... there was a posting here recently that, unless I misread it, ACF50'd your whole bike for £50 - but I could have misread it as I cant see you'll make much on that...

 

[MikeP]

depends on what you are are proposing I guess... there was a posting here recently that, unless I misread it, ACF50'd your whole bike for £50 - but I could have misread it as I cant see you'll make much on that...

See post number six in this thread and click on the big green word!

 

[LiquidLAN]

See post number six in this thread and click on the big green word!

sarcasum, a great sales technique

I figured thats what you where thinking but I was trying to give you a platform to sell the idea.

Price - I guess it depends if you are thinking of selling kits or the service - but it strikes me that you are still going to get corrosion on the edges and I guess over time you run the risk of that seeping under the covering.

As I said - someone put a link here for ACF50ing your whole bike for £50 - so what price sticky-back plasticing your panniers???

 

[camel_landy]

If you went into court with the "Fit for purpose" argument, you'd be laughed out.

What's the purpose of a pannier (be it plastic or alloy)? It's there to carry things.
Does the corrosion and loss of finish make it unfit for carrying things? Errrr.... No.

Sure, they look pretty when brand new but they're not sold on their looks.

M

 

[MikeP]

sarcasum, a great sales technique

I figured thats what you where thinking but I was trying to give you a platform to sell the idea.

Sarcasm?

I have no inclination to either provide a covering service or "kits" for others. Just that someone might consider it a possibility (given the amount of disgruntled owners that seem to exist).

but it strikes me that you are still going to get corrosion on the edges and I guess over time you run the risk of that seeping under the covering.

The edges need not be left bare. Even so, mine have done 30,000 miles in most conditions and weather, there's not enough exposed ali to actually notice any corrosion.

As for the "seeping" - none whatsoever. The material is designed for external use on vehicles. It works.

As I said - someone put a link here for ACF50ing your whole bike for £50 - so what price sticky-back plasticing your panniers???

I guess that as I can do one pannier in about an hour and a half, any "service" would have to allow for a decent hourly rate. Then of course there'd be delivery/collection of said panniers and the costs would alter according to what finish was chosen and any fancy work.

Me? I'd charge £100 per pannier/top-box. Then again, I don't really want the hassle so my price reflects that.

On the other hand, you can buy a one metre by ten metre roll of the vinyl from the supplier for £20! That's enough to cover your own panniers and make quite a few cock-ups while learning the process!

Might not be as satisfying as getting a BMW dealer to polish to polish the existing marks out but how many polishing treatments are owners expecting to get over the life of the panniers?

 

[LiquidLAN]

I'd be inclide to agree, you'd have to charge £200-£300 to do it, sounds like the most you are likely to do is two bikes a day and it also sounds like a pretty laborious job.

if you could knock out a kit for under £100, I think you might be on to a scalable winner...

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

When you buy them all shiny and new

Nip out and buy a tin of some Hammerite Smooth paint - any colour of your choice and a brush

Paint the bare alloy with it

There you go.................BMW 1200GSA Alloy Panniers with a durable corrosion resistant finish for under a £5

Can't say fairer than that

 

[JimboGSA]

Powder Coated?

Seriously has anyone any idea how much it'd be to have these etch primed, galvanised and then powder coated? Or know of anyone that would do them. The plastic bits do come off and could be riveted back on.

Just checked out the metal mules looking at over a grand, Touratech (same bare ali problem) over £800. Think the BMW ones are about £500 so if you could get them coated for under £200 its more cost effective than the others

 

[purds]

If you went into court with the "Fit for purpose" argument, you'd be laughed out.

What's the purpose of a pannier (be it plastic or alloy)? It's there to carry things.
Does the corrosion and loss of finish make it unfit for carrying things? Errrr.... No.

Sure, they look pretty when brand new but they're not sold on their looks.

M

Well you are entitled to your opinion of course but I'm sure you can see that the exact same argument could be used against a 6 month old car that corroded badly.

To quote you

'What's the purpose of a car ? It's there to transport passengers and items.
Does the corrosion and loss of finish make it unfit for this? Errrr.... No.

Sure, they look pretty when brand new but they're not sold on their looks.'

Do you really believe that would constitute a defence?

 

[illustratedman]

If you went into court with the "Fit for purpose" argument, you'd be laughed out.

What's the purpose of a pannier (be it plastic or alloy)? It's there to carry things.
Does the corrosion and loss of finish make it unfit for carrying things? Errrr.... No.

Sure, they look pretty when brand new but they're not sold on their looks.

M

+1 Landy, as for the corrosion it is still purely cosmetic, if i were spending 1k on some luggage i would sure as hell do my research on it beforehand. Found this in the motorrad brochure (These robust, all-new pannier cases with plain aluminium surfaces). I think these cases are made by tt as well.

 

[araspitfire]

Purds:

I'm not having a go at you or anyone else. My "common sense" bit comes from the fact that I know alumium corrodes on the surface, so it will loose it's showroom shine. Now if you weren't aware of this then it's a solely maintenance issue.

Timolgra gave a good link earlier in this thread that explains it all.

Not all aluminium corrodes... there are a lot of different kinds of aluminium. Aircraft are made from a high copper content aluminum that corrodes very quickly... so they coat it in pure aluminum... which is extremely corrosion resistant. Those shiny silver aircraft you see???.... Pure aluminum on the outside, exposed to the weather... And they don't get washed every day...

Many boats are made from alumium... this kind of aluminium is very corrosion resistant, and if properly protected with an bit of zinc, will not pit when immersed in seawater... for years at at time....

Anodizing (not galvanizing) is often done to keep aluminum objects looking good in the weather, and clear anodizing is possible... (if looks are the deciding factor)

BMW have no excuse not to make their motorcycle luggage capable of being driven in a normal fashion (i.e. ridden on salted roads and put away wet for a day or a week), without degrading overnight... sure if they looked like hell after a year of treating them in that fashion... But choosing a grade of alu that is not road-salt resistant, and then not coating it... That is a class-action lawsuit (rightfully IMHO) waiting to happen...

Hell Apple got sued for not making their batteries replaceable...

Al...

 

[MikeP]

Well you are entitled to your opinion of course but I'm sure you can see that the exact same argument could be used against a 6 month old car that corroded badly.

Can't see it myself. Maybe if the manufacturer said that it had an anti-corrosion treatment and it corroded, or if the corrosion rendered the car (or panniers) unusable owing to safety.

Corrosion that is simply unsightly isn't going to render a car (or panniers) "unfit for purpose."

 

[illustratedman]

Well you are entitled to your opinion of course but I'm sure you can see that the exact same argument could be used against a 6 month old car that corroded badly.

To quote you

'What's the purpose of a car ? It's there to transport passengers and items.
Does the corrosion and loss of finish make it unfit for this? Errrr.... No.

Sure, they look pretty when brand new but they're not sold on their looks.'

Do you really believe that would constitute a defence?

I understand what you are saying purds, but to use your argument/view if the said car was unpainted bare alumium i would'nt be driving it on wet salty roads because i know it would corrode, unless i did'nt care about it's appearance. If i did,i would buy one that was painted.

 

[Tim Cullis]

My panniers corroded quite badly, but also started to leak. I had them replaced by Bahnstormer under warranty, then sold them whilst they were still new and gleaming, and invested in powder-coated Metal Mule panniers.

Tim

 

[LiquidLAN]

My panniers corroded quite badly, but also started to leak. I had them replaced by Bahnstormer under warranty, then sold them whilst they were still new and gleaming, and invested in powder-coated Metal Mule panniers.

Tim

Lol... now there is a wise man

interesting point from araspitfire, though on the boat front outboard engines specifically, they are fitted with a sacrificial anode that corrodes before the engine does - I'm not going to try and explain the physics, but could you do something as simple with these panniers?

as for untreated aliminium and cars, sorry but I keep thinking about the Delorian - I'm sure the conversation would be different if you'd just bought one of those and later found out that shares in ACF50 are a good idea - that would be a long and boring job - and a Delorian covered in MikeP's plastic coating??? would that fly???

 

[purds]

Talking of the BMW GSA aluminium panniers........................

Can anyone get the little rubber lock cover thingy to actually go into the hole in the locks?

Buggered if I can