Peak District lane closures (proposed) help req'd.

[Timpo]

Lifted from VPTRF MM site:

I've recieved this by email and thought I'd pop it up here so anyone has the opportunity to state their opposal to the potential closure of 23 of the main lanes we use in the Peaks. Its not new news, we've heard about it recently, but undoubtably, should this happen it would rip the heart out of trail riding in the Peaks for good.

The Council are claiming that the 23 routes are potentially unsustainable, but this is not true. The Council has neglected some of the lanes for over a decade and rather than sort the issue out, or work with groups who want to do this, they are intending to just close the lanes so that the problem goes away. Most of the damage is natural damage (Eg water damage) and cannot be attributed to motorbikes, but this being ignored.

This isn't a TRF thing, so son't think not being a member stops you from having a say. This is a request for ANYBODY that can spare a few minutes to send in an an objection to the proposals. Please take the time, as the more individual people that register an objection - the more the council will have to take note.


The body of the email:


We would be grateful if every member would send in either a letter or email complaining about the below proposals. Please state that there is a major shortage of legal routes and that the peak district proposals are unfair. Do NOT include any reference to the TRF as they will consider all our complaints as one.

Please also copy your complaint to Councillor Andrew Marchington, (details below) The more complaints we can send, the more time we gain to ride the lanes. Please get your friends to complain also.


Where to send your objection:

If you email, as well as a brief message stating your opposal, please include your name and address so the coucil can see this is a genuine private complaint. It doesnt matter if you live locally or not. I've not drafted a letter for anyone to use as if the same letter arrives numerous times Councils tend to ignore them. Keep it simple - it only needs to be brief enough to refer to the lanes and that you object. Thankyou.


Any compaints should also be copied to one of our rights of way officers.
They can be contacted by...

Emailing: [email protected]

Or by writing to: Rights of Way Officer, Peak District National Park Authority, Aldern House, Baslow Road, Bakewell, Derbyshire DE45 1AE.

Not forgetting to copy:

Cllr Andrew C G Marchington. 30 Warwick Avenue Golcar Huddersfield HD7 4BX
email : [email protected]



Details of the proposed closures and the stages it would be done in. Sorry that it looks a lot of info, but its the way it has been presented and because there are so many bloody lanes involved!


VEHICLES COULD BE BANNED FROM PARK'S ROADS
(http://www.motorstoday.co.uk/VEHICLES-COUL...ROADS.1153.news

MOTORBIKES and 4x4s could be banned from some of the Peak District's trails under plans to protect some of the park's unsurfaced roads.
Traffic regulation orders, which can permanently ban vehicles from certain roads, could be used as part of plans to improve 23 countryside routes that have been assessed as potentially unsustainable. Other measures could include putting up warning signs, resurfacing the roads and introducing voluntary restraint agreements with motorists.

Plans to improve eight routes will be drawn up following inspections by officials from the Peak District National Park Authority and Derbyshire County Council as well as members of the Local Access Forum sub-group. The work will be carried out with the police and Derbyshire and Staffordshire County Councils. Management plans for the other 15 routes will be drawn up after work on the first eight has been completed.

Councillor Andrew Marchington, chair of the Peak District National Park Authority's services committee, said: "We are seeking to find a permanent solution to the problems that exist on these routes and others in the national park. "By using all the powers at our disposal, and working with our partners, we aim to build a consensus on how these routes can be properly protected while still allowing lawful use of the land by all groups. By doing this we hope to solve the problems that exist rather than just move them on to another part of the national park."

The first eight routes that will be looked at will be:

· Bradley Lane, Pilsley

· Brough Lane, Brough / Shatton

· Chapelgate, Edale/Chinley

· Long Causeway, Bamford / Sheffield

· Moorlands Lane, Bonsall

· School Lane, Great Hucklow

· Shatton Lane, Brough / Shatton

· Washgates, Hartington Upper Quarter, Staffordshire

Management plans for the other 15 routes will be drawn up after work on the first eight has been completed.

Until that happens monitoring will continue on the use of these routes by 4x4s and trail bikes. Any planned work by highways authorities to improve the condition of these routes will also carry on.

The other routes on the list are:

· Bamford Clough, Bamford

· Black Harry Lane, Stoney Middleton

· Clough Wood, Birchover

· The Cop, Peak Forest

· Derby Lane, Monyash

· Hay Dale, Wheston

· Leys Lane, Little Longstone

· Minninglow Lane, Ballidon

· Monksdale Lane, Tideswell

· Nether Bretton, Eyam

· Pindale, Castleton

· Riley Lane, Eyam

· The Roych, Chinley / Chapel en le Frith

· Sough Lane, Taddington

· Upperdale, Brushfield




Thanks.

Timpo.

PS. Remember, no carbon copy emails as they will be amalgamated as one. T.

 

[SkyGod]

Some of the best lanes in the shire there Timpo, anything else that I can do then let me know mate.

 

[MrIFan]

Some of these lanes are already closed Shatton Lane-Brough is closed and at least 3 of the others have TRO's on them.
Unfortunately democracy will have very little to do with keeping any of these lanes open as the person in charge at Peak Park is very anti vehicular use and the Council can't wait for their closure to ease their budget demands!!
How do I know this? I drink regularly with the chief highways surveyor for the region and know several senior people in the Peak Park.
How can we beat the closures? I honestly don't know, but that is no reason to stop trying.
Most of the recent closures in the Peak Park have, as far as I can see. been illegal. I have looked at the legislation regarding the reclassification of routes and can see nothing in this to explain many of the recent closures. Prime example being Hope Cross, one of the finest lanes in the Park and marked as a road on OS maps for at least the last 110 years, now closed!
How do we stop this negative trend? A bloody good revolution would be a start

 

[Timpo]

Ian, I am very sure that closures driven by the Nat Parks are illegal. How the feck have these powers been given to Park Auths, so great that they can force Highways Depts, managing the Queen's highways, to extinguish vehicular use on county roads..........? I am amazed......

A while back Dr Richard Beeching extinguished railroads, look what a big mistake that has turned out to be........ but that's another thread!

Timpo.

 

[Flipfly]

I shall email ref this.

It is disgusting that they are closing these lanes, however, I must say that many of the trail riding and 4x4 fraternity don't do themselves any favours. I myself get pissed off with the speed and abuse that some people decide to use on the lanes.

The more thay close, the more people will ride illegally and start using bridle paths and footpaths.

It's a disgrace but the end is nigh peeps

 

[digga]

The more thay close, the more people will ride illegally and start using bridle paths and footpaths.

I personally know of 3 persons that were caught on a bridleway 2 weeks ago. 1 of the 3 decided he was'nt waiting about and rode off

BIG MISTAKE..

He was then reported to the Police and he appeared in Court last week...

£600 fine

The other 2 got off with a caution.

 

[timeandtide]

Strongest possible objection registered and post forwarded to mates.

My ex-wife who works for the PDNPA says they have been deluged with objections from off-roaders.

 

[MickDB1]

Jaber saw 10 quads in a train up Sandy lane - on a fookin Sunday - shitup ta eyeballs

Some want it stopping or they have no f in sence at all

We must challenge and offer advice to the offenders when we see um
I have wrote a letter
and offered to help if I can
we hope for wisdom and comon sence

No chance have we

 

[Joe Bar]

Email sent and CC'd. I can't say I'm surprised this has happened, but it still makes my blood boil

 

[Joe Bar]

For info, here's the response I received to my email objecting to the proposed closures.

Dear Mr Bar

The National Park Authority, in conjunction with Derbyshire County Council, are attempting to improve the management of recreational motor vehicle activity in a number of ways. These include better information for users (via a web-site and leaflet), improved signage, better maintenance of routes, regular liaison with user group representatives, and targeted police action against illegal activity.

In order to ensure improved management of the route network, we have carried out a detailed condition survey of the unsurfaced highway network, and prioritised 23 routes as those that need concerted improvement. A range of options will be identified to solve these problems - and I must stress that the vehicle user groups are closely involved with this process. As the magazine article says, this...'could include putting up warning signs, resurfacing the roads and introducing voluntary restraint agreements with motorists.' Only as a last resort, will legal measures be taken to restrict use of these routes.

This method of managing routes follows the Best of Byways advice, a methodology frequently quoted by vehicle users as being the best way forward.


I hope therefore that you will be reassured that we are indeed expecting that the maintenance of the route will be a priority, and any proposals to permanently close roads will only be taken after careful consideration and consultation on the available options.

Advice and full details of all the work we are doing to manage routes can be seen at www.peakdistrict.gov.uk/vehicles

If you are happy for me to keep your email contact details we can also add you to our email distribution group, which updates interested parties about developments in managing unsurfaced routes in the Peak District National Park.


Richard Pett, Rights of Way Officer

 

[Paul G (BHT)]

Please see below an email I received today:-

Dear UKGSer - We have been alerted to a post on your website about use of green lanes in the Peak District National Park. Could you please publish the following to clarify some misunderstandings and to point your readers to places where they can find out more about the work we are doing? Regards John Fern, head of communications Peak District National Park Authority.


The post is:

The Peak District National Park Authority, in conjunction with Derbyshire County Council, is seeking to improve the management of recreational motor vehicle activity in the national park in a number of ways.

These include better information for users (via a web-site and leaflets), improved signage, better maintenance of routes, regular liaison with user group representatives, and targeted police action against illegal activity. This method of managing routes follows the Best of Byways advice.

To improve management we have carried out a detailed condition survey of the unsurfaced highway network, and prioritised 23 routes as those that need concerted improvement. A range of options will be identified to solve these problems - and I must stress that the vehicle user groups are closely involved with this process. As the magazine article says this...'could include putting up warning signs, resurfacing the roads and introducing voluntary restraint agreements with motorists.' Only as a last resort, will legal measures be taken to restrict use of these routes.

I hope therefore that your readers will be reassured that we are indeed expecting that the maintenance of the route will be a priority, and any proposals to permanently close roads will only be taken after careful consideration and consultation on the available options.

Advice and full details of all the work we are doing to manage routes can be seen at www.peakdistrict.gov.uk/vehicles

An email group also exists to keep interested parties up-to-date about work to manage unsurfaced routes in the Peak District National Park. If you would like to join this please contact them by sending an email here.

Mike Rhodes, access and rights of way manager
Peak District National Park Authority

 

[Joe Bar]

Please see below an email I received today:-

Could you please publish the following to clarify some misunderstandings

Somehow, I don't think we misunderstand at all

 

[Timpo]

PDNPA writes:- "and I must stress that the vehicle user groups are closely involved with this process."


MrIfan, do you know of anyone who is on this scheme?
I'm struggling to find anyone, not that I know many green lane users......


Timpo.

 

[MrIFan]

Nope not a one. Glass and the TRF are supposedly being consulted but as a member of both I have heard nothing about any consultation?
MickDB1 is maybe a bit more closely involved so maybe he may know someone involved?

 

[MickDB1]

He up
In my letter of objection to the two suggested I did offer ( as I have in the past ) to not just object to the proposed blanket ban - but to help resolve these issues best we can in any way I could
These lanes/roads/ byways are for all - not just a few - but they are also not for destoying or buggering up or abuseing by any group or individual
They will need maintaining and looking after for our kids and the rest
We can all help by helping the beserkas see the light and go get a race licence or MX trackand even the mega 4 x4 days.
Consideration must be given. Without adding fuel to the suttumdown fire
What the fook does anyone need to use a route / lane that is in so poor condition that winches are the only way of progress. Should we really be on a super deep rutted right of way that has a tarmac road on the side of it
I like a splash as much as anyone, I like a turn of speed every now and then
I like to also walk in safety not in fear. I hate upsetting folk. I actually like stopping and chatting to visiters to our areas. I like to see folk on horses in the countyside - especiall young ladies trotting

Richard Pett replied to me - he is a rights of way officer for the peakdistrict - this was his letter

As I’ve mentioned before I think the Best of Byways approach is a pretty good method and has worked well in the lakes for example – if you have any questions or concerns don’t hesitate to contact me. I don’t know where the misinformation has come from as I thought our release made it pretty clear that we’re looking at the BoB inclusive approach, not just one.

He seems fair bloke and lets hope he is Some lanes have been shut in the lakes some have not

One big issue I have is the lack of info as to what is open at the moment
What the PD would like to be considered Sensitive and left for a while to be repaired ans what everone thought or thinks is a RoW and is now not

Yours Hopefully and a confirmed Ponytrecker on two wheels
Mick

PS I am sorry for my poor grammar and spelling

 

[Timpo]

Well, if I could suggest something to the PDNPA and it's body of user groups, however they are, why don't they use weight, width, wheels per axle type TRO's?
It's obvious that a trail bike plus rider will weigh in at about 200kg, yet we are being tied in to TROs that the level of vehicle weight is ten times that. The 4x4s are rarely in a single vehicle train, and some of the commercial operating tour companies have some huge groups, 8, 10, even 12 vehicle convoys, so a train weight of twenty tons is easily exerted.
Don't get me wrong, I have a Defender 90, lifted, winch, cage, snorkel, and all the other sh!t that we bolt to them so I'm not guessing at these figures or occurances.

The project in the Lake District was a kick in the groin for trail riding, any one saying it was a success is talking out of the hat. In fact, the closing of routes to motorised traffic puts more traffic on other areas.

Timpo.

 

[Joe Bar]

PDNPA writes:- "and I must stress that the vehicle user groups are closely involved with this process."

MrIfan, do you know of anyone who is on this scheme?
I'm struggling to find anyone, not that I know many green lane users......

Timpo.

Mr Pett in response to another email -

Thank you for taking the time to email us.

I think that most of the answers you seek are in our policy and website, however I am sure you will be aware that as officers we have to be no only fully appraised of the issues involved, but also in regular contact with other National Parks.

Our own policy is straightforward in relation to management and also our policy on TROs (http://www.peakdistrict.org/index/looking-after/vehicles/tro.htm) sets out our position in what I feel in a very clear and sensible way. We work in a good spirit of cooperation with local vehicle users, particularly the Peak and Derbyshire Vehicle User Group, a member of which is representing his views on the action plans, which will reflect all the issues of the routes in question in an open way and which will show a clearly defined process of ongoing management and a delineation of responsibilities so that all parties understand where we are going.

I have added you to our emailing list so that when we commence this service you will receive the latest information.

Regards

Richard

Richard Pett

Rights of Way Officer

Peak District National Park Authority

(01629) 816296

So it would seem they are talking to ONE person, regarding all types of vehicle rights. Usual lip service then

 

[timeandtide]

For info, here's the response I received to my email objecting to the proposed closures.

Same for me.