power assistance is history!

[nemezis]

NEW Continental Teves Brakes without Power Assistance

 

[nemezis]

The great innovation with the NEW Continental Teves Brakes is:

- No power assistance on the lever (FTE before: flawed residual brakes)
- Fast valve system (FTE before: slow plunger system)

Well, both innovations was HONDA offering a long time before with the DUAL-CBS-ABS System. The NEW Continental Teves Brakes are nothing special (some journalist wrote that in the daily German newspaper DIE WELT), they just adapted their system to the state of the art braking systems from HONDA. ("BMW Motorrad’s new Integral ABS is comparable with other valve-controlled ABS systems").

"The overall principle followed by BMW Motorrad’s new Integral ABS is
relatively simple: Brake pressure generated manually by the rider via the brake
lever and the main brake piston is transferred via an open valve (the intake
valve) directly to the appropriate wheel brake."

"In the event of any deficiencies in the hydraulic pump or electrical components, the rear-wheel brake acts hydraulically as with a conventional system, overriding the integral function. This has no effect on the proper operation of the front-wheel brake, the only difference being that the ABS function is no longer operative in the event of such a deficiency."

"Malfunctions, should they occur at all, ... Should the electrical or electronic components suffer a deficiency, in turn, the control valves are moved mechanically (by springs) to their basic setting, thus always maintaining a direct hydraulic connection between the brake controls and the brake callipers, as in the case of a conventional brake system without ABS. Under such circumstances the brakes will operate as usual in terms of brake power and application, only ABS control and, where applicable, the integral function no longer being available."

 

[st247]

".... the control valves are moved mechanically (by springs) to their basic setting, ..."

So what happens if one of the springs weakens? or, god help us, snaps?

Think it's probably best if people just practice with whatever braking system their particular bike uses.

 

[Dellis]

So what happens if one of the springs weakens? or, god help us, snaps?

Think it's probably best if people just practice with whatever braking system their particular bike uses.

Then it is no worse than the current system. I personally do not like the servo system and the minimal residual braking available if the system fails. I didlike it so much I'm trading my 03 1150 in for a 12 without ABS etc.

Dave

 

[Dellis]

So what happens if one of the springs weakens? or, god help us, snaps?

Think it's probably best if people just practice with whatever braking system their particular bike uses.

Just read the link above. It is 100 times better than the current system, the electric pump only controlls the rear brake with the front brake being controlled by hydraulic pressure alone. Therefore if you get an electrical failure you only lose the linking of the brakes and the ABS but you maintain full braking power. This sounds like a major leap forward.

Dave

 

[Mouse]

Automatic Stability Control is a meaningful, additional assistance function particularly on a high-torque motorcycle and when riding under varying conditions with slippery surfaces. Indeed, ASC is the logical counterpart to ABS. Automatic Stability Control prevents the rear wheel from spinning uncontrolled when accelerating all-out and thus avoids any loss of side forces and stability which otherwise would make the rear wheel swerve out of control. Lift-off detection and intervention serves furthermore to prevent the front wheel from moving up when accelerating under full power.

Hmm, traction control and wheelie-prevention! Or if you want to spin it another way ... launch control.

An advantage in those traffic light Grands Prix against the ubiquitous Imprezza.

 

[nemezis]

Just read the link above. It is 100 times better than the current system, ... Therefore if you get an electrical failure you only lose the linking of the brakes and the ABS but you maintain full braking power. This sounds like a major leap forward.

But keep in mind that this major leap forward is offered by other manufacturers a long time before! Same with the fast and reliable valve-system.

The HONDA Dual-CBS-ABS: Intelligent linked brakes, very fast valve system!

I once tested the HONDA VFR800 Brakes and compared them to the BMW R1150GSADV brakes. This system is outsanding fast. And cycling is smoth.

nemezis

 

[st247]

Then it is no worse than the current system.

Which was my, rather badly put, point.

I personally do not like the servo system and the minimal residual braking available if the system fails. I didlike it so much I'm trading my 03 1150 in for a 12 without ABS etc.

Personal choice . I don't have a problem with the present ABS system. There are bikes that i wouldn't buy because of there braking system though. Basically anything that doesn't have an independant rear brake (Honda's CBS )

Just read the link above. It is 100 times better than the current system, the electric pump only controlls the rear brake with the front brake being controlled by hydraulic pressure alone. Therefore if you get an electrical failure you only lose the linking of the brakes and the ABS but you maintain full braking power. This sounds like a major leap forward.

Dave

Probably right, but there still remains the capacity for the system ( any system ) to fail. It may not have an electric pump, but it does have a valve system that's probably not going to be simple in it's design, and you can only have a certain number of failsafes. Even if yoou went back to two seperate hydraulic only systems there's still the chance of failure. So i personally would prefer to practice with what i've got, so that i know what's likley to happen in such an event.

 

[nemezis]

In the German mag MOTORRAD 16 current issue there is a performance test of the NEW Integral Brakes from Continental Teves on BMW R1200R.

It does seem that further developments and improvements have to be done to get a linear response from the NEW Integral Brakes. The response of the brakes was therefore only a 22 points from 30 points.

ABS cycling seems to be much smoother, which would be a vast improvement compared to the former FTE-System

 

[st247]

In the German mag MOTORRAD 16 current issue there is a performance test of the NEW Integral Brakes from Continental Teves on BMW R1200R.

It does seem that further developments and improvements have to be done to get a linear response from the NEW Integral Brakes. The response of the brakes was therefore only a 22 points from 30 points.

ABS cycling seems to be much smoother, which would be a vast improvement compared to the former FTE-System

Does that mean that removing the servo has left poor braking efficiency in it's place

 

[nemezis]

Does that mean that removing the servo has left poor braking efficiency in it's place

Nope. Braking efficiency is "not better or much worse than with the old BMW Brakes" (I translated MOTORRAD here).

Anyway there is another journalist writing about the NEW Integral Brakes from Conti in the daily newspaper DIE WELT last Saturday. He wrote that the side effects of the rear wheel lift off protection still exists. And he said that he didn't like these effects: "Not funny" are his words.

What I see is that these NEW Integral Brakes do need further improvements. And there might be an analogy with the OLD Integral Brakes that were modified all day long with the most important modification in fall 2004.