sawbridgeworth bmw

[Greg Masters]

well greg..its been a pleasure reading your rantings at me on here......am glad to hear you have a service manual at hand, im sure everyone on this site keeps a handy volume or two at work, dont we guys?

ill do a deal with you greg. fancy servicing my bike for me? seems you're the man and its obvious you're a mechanical guru so im more than happy to pay you as you have all the answers.

as for me, im just a jub paying punter who appears to have the support of everyone who has posted on here. ever wondered if you might be backing the wrong horse? or are you a dealership too?? let us know?

your no compromise approach is refreshing and inspires confidence that any mechanical object let loose in your workshop will be properly dealt with.

my point about the fazer was monetary which you failed to grasp: 1/3 to x 2 the money does not equal double the bike.

my bmw is now on its 40,000 th mile and despite exact service intervals and normal care, it does not seem to be holding up any better than any other 'lesser' bike. it has corroded as much as any other bike and the wire wheels smack of design complacency. imagine buying a bmw car and having rusty wheels after the first few falls of rain and then told its normal........

add to very high dealer ship costs (see comments elsewhere here) with minor things like brake pad wear and tear missed on a major service and the result is a poor experience. and im being polite.

as i told you before, i really wanted to be coaxed into loving the blue prop but people like you remind me bmw ownership can be quite a pain.

fyi, bmw carefully control who has a bike dealership. i know for a fact my local bmw car dealership wanted to provide bikes and had a lot of cash available to build separate premises etc.....bmw uk said no; oh look, a rigged market.....hence very little choice where you go to have your official service and heaven forbid a haggle over your bike price......

and no, i havent had a bad day, just feel let down

happy days

Over the last year, Sawbridge BMW have supported this Club. They offered a number of discounted places on the World of BMW Off-Road Course of which several members (me included) took advantage.

They then donated a prize for the Club's raffle at Princetown which was won and collected by a well-known baker.

But they are closed on Mondays and, I guess, don't read this bulletin board when they're off, so I feel that I'm not out of place in stating a few hard facts.

You initiated a thread under the heading sawbridge bmw which contains just one potentially valid criticism of their service viz. they did not check your brake pads at a 36k service when they should have done and they might have been worn to near the service limit. I say might because, in reality, no-one knows what state they were in. You flag that 1k miles later "both sets of brake pads are on the metal and the callipers are sticking". You raised your concerns in writing with Sawbridgeworth and you gave credit to their Service Manager for his response.

Regrettably, you chose to use your sawbridge bmw posting as a vehicle for a general rant about the marque, although, in reality, it seems to be more a case of questioning your own judgement in not buying a Fazer. Sure, I grasped the merit of your argument about relative values when I read your first posting (given your profession, perhaps you might have given that some thought before your bought your bike) which is why I commute on a 650, not my 1150.

The BMW marque isn't perfect. The vehicles have a high capital cost and, de facto, will experience a high absolute depreciation. Yes, maybe a few GS wheels are corroded (I find that washing them occassionally helps) but that's not because of 'design complacency' and it's certainly not the fault of sawbridge bmw any more than is the lack of dealers in your area. By all means have a rant at BMW - you could become the 2nd member of thesanguine's club - but to post such a rant under the name of a single dealer is plainly wrong and probably does this Club a disservice in the longer term.

Incidentally, I have no connection to Sawbridgeworth (or any other dealer come to that) other than as an occassioanl customer. I do my own servicing, so I have no-one else to blame if things go wrong. I have my own Service and Technical Booklet - they come with all new bikes. And, no, I have no wish to service your bike. After your public rant, I shouldn't think that anyone else has either!!

Happy days.

Greg

 

[BBB61]

Greg,

The fact that Sawbridgeworth have supported this club over the last year should not mean that members can't have their say (whether justified or not). I would regard it as a major issue that they didn't pick up on brake pads that were worn to that extent. Especially when their labour rate is now £50 per hour plus VAT. They are a solus BMW bike dealer with several years of experience and they should not be overlooking something like that.

Bob

 

[judge]

I have no problems with a service technician making a genuine mistake as may have happened this time, so long as when its brought to the attention on the Service Manager or Dealer Priciple they take responsibility for that mistake and take the responsibility to make good on that mistake to the customer's satisfaction.

I don't buy it when the customer name and shames without first having given the dealer an opportunity to put things right, this hasn't been the case this time.

Whilst Robeekaye67 also throws a few red herrings into his argument which I think Greg has picked up on, the facts are he remains dissatisfied with the response from Sawbridgeworth and the complaint is valid.

MikeO had a similar poor experience both in the service technician making an error and the less than acceptable response from the management.

As an aside menu driven servicing is only about maximising the efficiency of the service department and nothing to do with quality of service - it's why I use trusted independent technicians. That said a competent mechanic should concentrate on the customers bike not ticking boxes on a service sheet - do that and no one will complain about service charges.

 

[robeekay67]

greg, dont know why you bother metioning sabow is shut on a monday i'd have posted my original gripe regardless what day of the week it was.

i included the thread about other cheaper bikes to question why i accept servicing of a level which is no better than 'motorcycle city' (your example, not mine). and if you extend this pattern of thought, why do i bother purchasing a bike thats so expensive to start if the end result is the same as any other 'lesser bike'?

i did appreciate the service manager writing to me but the tone of the letter did not enamour me to this dealership. having spent large lumps of disposable income with them over the years i did expect better. and why shouldnt i? i too work in the customer business and i am fully aware who pays my wages.

im happy they have supported your club but when something is wrong, its wrong. only by highlighhting problems can we expect things ever to improve.

for a man who boasts of his ability to do all his own servicing would you not agree brakes that are on the way out would show signs if a 1000 miles later they are bare metal?. as for the caliper sticking, if they had replaced the pads, that would have become apparent.

never mind. i appreciate everyone's comments from this discussion and hope as many dealerships read this as possible.

what does surprise me is your support for a dealer error yet you go on to tell us you do all your own servicing...............

never mind.

 

[Greg Masters]

Rob(??)

My final comments on this:

Sawbridgeworth have become a dealership that it appears fashionable to have a pop at. You have had a fair old rant on a number of fronts in a thread posted under dealers with a heading of sawbridgeworth bmw.

They should have checked your brake pads. It appears that they didn't. I have already stated that they are remiss for this. I don't and wouldn't support a dealer error like this.

Pad wear rates vary tremendously according to use. This thread shows that nearly 5% of GSers who responded demolish a set of rear pads in under 4k miles, yet nearly 10% can get a set of rear pads to last over 18k miles. Sticking calipers exaserbates the wear rate. I recently discovered a sticking caliper on the rear of my car - the one stuck pad was down to the metal, the other three were nearly at new thickness. It's possible, especially with the recent onset of winter salting, that your calipers were not actually sticking and, indeed, that your pads were not unduly worn, when Sawbridgeworth saw the bike. Maybe they were. With respect, I don't think that anyone truly knows.

I'd like to see this Club work in partnership with the BMW Dealer network for our mutual benefits. Even when the dealer gets it wrong, having a public rant is not a particularly helpful or positive strategy (although I do note your prior exchange of correspondence). As judge noted, what I am most concerned about is alienating a supportive dealer with issues, pad checking excluded, that are entirely outside his sphere of influence.

Greg

 

[robeekay67]

right....lets bin dealer comments section then whose in favour?
or only write nice cosy things. and who was ranting greg? as for the service, it was conducted at the end of a very long hot summer...no road salt......please stop assuming so many facts....the only alienation you're doing is with other guys on here. thats my lot too; i'll not 'rant' another word and go in peace and pay every dealer their due respect from now on...i am not worthy!

 

[(RIP) Mark Dilloway]

Greg's final words put much of this into perspective. There are a number of people on this site like Greg, myself (and Johnnyboxer should he be listening) - who get through rear pads every 12k or so and have yet to replace the front ones at 14k (and more). It's about riding style and how much grief we give our bikes. If you know that you are riding a bike hard then it makes sense to ensure that the stopping bits (and the tyres) are kept up to spec between services and at the services ask that special attention be paid to certain items (I specifically ask for items not to be inspected/oil changed because I have already done it.

It also makes sense to know the condition of your bike before putting it into service so that you can identify what work if any has been completed. If a fault is intermittent then it makes sense to bring this to the attention of the service department because as sure as night follows day the fault will not be apparent on the day of the service.

 

[bakerlonglegs]

As an aside menu driven servicing is only about maximising the efficiency of the service department and nothing to do with quality of service - it's why I use trusted independent technicians. That said a competent mechanic should concentrate on the customers bike not ticking boxes on a service sheet - do that and no one will complain about service charges.

Judge - I agree with your comment about what the mechanic's concentration should be on BUT when you arrive at a dealer to collect your bike and they say "hello, that'll be 200 quid please" and you say "Cripes, what was done for that?" and they say "we don't know, the mechanic hasn't followed procedure and completed the paperwork, but can we still have our 200 quid" I start to worry about what ELSE he hasn't done. My point is from a CUSTOMER perspective ticking boxes is more than just an efficiency drive for the workshop manager, it's important feedback for the rider.
I will be following your suggestion and using trusted independent technicians from now on.
Andy

 

[Wreford Miles]

Greg…. Looks like you’re after a job in PR!

Things I know about Sawbridgeworth.

Parts dept will always try and help out.

Clothing guys always willing to offer a deal

Quality of service always seemed good

They’re a touch expensive

Brian takes the piss on trade-ins but at least he’s funny and predictable

tut –tut I see your bikes got ABS that will limit who we can sell it to… I’ll offer you 30 Bob

wow let me sit down… you’ve done 15,000 in three years! That will make it difficult to shift…I’ll offer 20 bob and I’ll sell you this year old example with 8000 miles on it for 50p of list.

Disappointing to here about the pads… I’d not have spotted it and that’s what I’d expect them to find…. imagine they’d missed that on the service before our trip.

The reality however is they didn’t and when I could afford to use them I was happy.

 

[judge]

To follow and and clairify my point about checklist sheets being irrelevant. I take my bike in and I say Jim can you do a short/long service (whichever is due) and I've noticed this or something's not right there, the rest I leave to the expert.

When I collect it Jim walks through the bike with me, shows me what he's done, if he's replaced something he'll show me the knackered parts and if they are 'get you home usable' then he'll pop them in a bag for me.

Should he discover something whilst servicing (which I've not pointed out) he's straight on the blower with his findings and a recommendation, almost always I'll go with his suggestion.

Never seen a service sheet from him and never want to - if I need to know what's covered (according to BMW inspections) I can look in my handbook.

Does that help clarify things?

 

[BAKERMAN]

My man checks the pads everytime he pumps up my tyres, is that not the norm ?

 

[bakerlonglegs]

Judge - yes it does!! If the service experience worked like that at Sawbridgeworth for me I would be one happy bunny and would a) sing their praises to the roof tops; b) feel that the higher rates are fully justified; and c) not worry about silly little checklists. However, seeing as the only "contact" I get with the whole process is at the service reception (and THEY don't know what happened or if any potential problems were spotted) I start to get a bit twitchy if the simple things are missing. Stupid thing is, in Sawbridgeworth's defence for once, the work probably HAS been done properly but the lack of time to finish the details and feedback to the customer gets my goat (...as you have probably spotted )
I'll shut the f**k up, 'cos this is turning into a rant... (as regards the rest of the team, I do agree with Wreford's comments... )
Andy

 

[Paul G (BHT)]

Sawbridgeworth BMW were looking at this posting this afternoon.... with no responce

 

[Greg Masters]

Sawbridgeworth BMW were looking at this posting this afternoon.... with no responce

Now I know. Big Brother lives in Shrewsbury!



Greg

 

[thesanguine]

.........BMW...................no responce

That's all I heard!!


Is that how you spell up there Paul? ;-)

 

[Keith Chapman]

Is there any link between folks who make good progress and may activate the ABS under heavy breaking approaching corners and those folk who get through pads quickly.

Just a thought that the on off effect of the ABS may have something to do with pad wear? especially the rear which has a tendency to lock up easily.

 

[BBB61]

What about the high wear rate of rear BMW pads compared to the front? When my GS was repaired after the accident a year ago, a front disc was replaced, so they put new pads in. The old ones (genuine BMW) had done 17600 miles at this point, and they were only half worn. The rears however only last me about 6-7000. My commute to work is mainly around the North Circular ( the bit that actually flows) so my use of brakes is very minimal. EBC's last 20000 in the rear, 3 times the life of genuine BMW ones. Maybe I need to strip the caliper, but everytime I have replaced the pads, the pistons have been easy to push back into the caliper.

But back to Sawbridgeworth. Wreford is spot on about the parts and clothing department. No complaints there. But the trade ins! My first trade in in 1996 on my old K1100RS was very reasonable indeed, but when I went back in 1999 with my first GS, and my first encounter with Brian, it was derisory. I regard the servicing as expensive, but I am fortunate to have the ability to do my own, so that's not a problem for me.

Bob

 

[MikeO]

Is there any link between folks who make good progress and may activate the ABS under heavy breaking approaching corners and those folk who get through pads quickly.

The riders making the best progress are hardly using their brakes at all....

Mike

 

[thesanguine]

That's the most sensible comment you've made for yonks mike!!

 

[adamski49]

Originally posted by Mike O
The riders making the best progress are hardly using their brakes at all....

I disagree Mike, the riders making the smoothest progress are hardly using their brakes at all.... the riders making the best progress are nailing it to the corners, standing it on it's nose before the corners and then winding the power on through the bends

Both methods are satisfying in their own way it just depends on what mood I'm in.

Adam

P.S. Before you ask, no, I don't get through shed loads of brake pads.