Starting Issue

[yerma]

Just wondering if anyone has come across this problem before. 1200GS 07

When starting the engine is makes a putt putt noise but doesn't kick in. It's probably something very simple, but I have a mechanical phoebia.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Should also state that initial checks pass, but after making the putt putt noise the engine warning symbol comes on.

I apologise if I have posted this in the wrong section.

 

[GSmonkey]

Does the engine turn over? Is it turning over at normal speed?

 

[yerma]

Holding down the ignition just makes the putt putt noise (the interrval that it is trying to start is the usual speed), it never gets started. I've had the fuel pump controller replaced 5 months ago, with the one that the heatsink is coated, so I don't think it's that. Any idea?

 

[Owen Snell]

Holding down the ignition just makes the putt putt noise (the interrval that it is trying to start is the usual speed), it never gets started. I've had the fuel pump controller replaced 5 months ago, with the one that the heatsink is coated, so I don't think it's that. Any idea?

Reference above to GSmonkey's question: Is the engine actually turning over or are you just getting a noise from the starter?

 

[yerma]

It's just a noise coming from the starter. Engine never gets going. After about 5 attempts at starting I get the EWS! warning. Tried both sets of keys same effect.

 

[Wapping]

Christ, it's like drawing teeth.

Is this right?

Fuel in tank...... I can only hope.

Ignition (the key) is tuned to on.

Hit starter button.

Bike's engine tuns over really fast (whir whir) just like normal.

Bike then does not fire (no brumm, brummm noise) just a phut phut type noise.

If so it sounds like no fuel is getting through. I would suspect fuel pump controller failure, again.

If bike is not turning over fast (no whir, whir noise) or is very sluggish (errr,,,,errr,,,,,,,,errrr noise) or a loud, click, click, click, I would suspect a duff (flat) battery.

It might be EWS ring failure. BUT I can't remember if the bike will then simply not turn over at all. Or if it manifests itself as a complete electrical shut down, neither of which you seem to have.

You can tell if fuel is getting through.

Carefully unscrew one of the injectors. Pull it out, carefully. Turn on ignition. Push starter button. Small squirts of fuel should come out of the injector. Do not be tempted to touch the injector's end or poke something up it. If fuel is coming out (pft pft) ... put it back, carefully... and look for a spark problem. If none is coming out.... put it back and suspect fuel pump problem.....

PS The sequence of lights on the dash are quite possibly normal, for a bike that has the ignition on and the engine has not fired. Off the top of my head I cannot remember what lights stay on, following a lack of firing up (ABS, probably if fitted, battery symbol and maybe the engine symbol, too, probably yellow and EWS) ..... but maybe you do have a real warning light on..... if so it is a message of some sort.... call BuMW / AA or look in handbook.

 

[Mr K]

Battery.

 

[Wapping]

Battery.

My strong suspicion.... Chilly mornings, fog and mist, the slow tolling of the church bell...

 

[Mr K]

My strong suspicion.... Chilly mornings, fog and mist, the slow tolling of the church bell...

A less than perfect battery will result in above symptoms.
The much maligned Optimate may save OP's bacon, but a new battery may be the solution.

 

[yerma]

Ok maybe I wasn't clear. So I'll try again

The engine never gets going. It never starts. It's not that it gets going and then dies, ie fuel pump controller problem, it never catches.

The noise is purley the starter motor turning over.

Plenty of fuel in the tank. I'll check the battery level tonight. Thanks for the help anyway. If I get no further tonight I call BMW.

 

[Riktus]

Had a similar problem - although yours does seem to sound like Battery not in ideal condition. Thats where I would go first. If not then I would suspect the fuel Pump controller. (again - they can repeat fail)

Both of the above did not cure mine so dealer advised a change of Throttle Potentiometer???

To be fair this did not cure it and the dealer changed Main Fuel pump (first he had ever changed) and spark plugs both together. This cured the problem but they were not quite sure it was the fuel pump.

However as stated above before you go spending too much cash on repairs an oddessy battery will cost you approx £90 so might be a good investment as your first step!

Rik

 

[RickG]

If, after trying to resolve the confusion of putt putts and turnings over and general sarcasm, is the following statement true:

The starter motor turns the engine over at the normal speed but the engine doesn't fire/run/start.

If YES, and like you say, there is fuel in the tank, then it does suggest your FPC has gone again.

If you listen very hard when you turn on the ignition (but don't try pressing the starter) you should hear a short "whirr" as the fuel pump kicks in. If all is silent it means the FPC is dead.

 

[yerma]

I'll listen for the noise of the fuel pump before trying to start it tonight
The engine isn't turning over, only the starter motor makes any noise. Thanks for the help and advice.

 

[RickG]

Right. If the engine isn't being turned over by the starter motor it means your battery is either flat or knackered.

If it's been a while since you last rode the bike (like several weeks) it may just need charging up.

Unfortunately, dead batteries on 1200's are a relatively common problem and you may need a new one.

There are loads of threads on this forum about this and which is the best replacement should you need one.

 

[Wapping]

I'll listen for the noise of the fuel pump before trying to start it tonight
The engine isn't turning over, only the starter motor makes any noise. Thanks for the help and advice.

Now we are getting there.

The starter motor is simply spinning.

But the engine is not turning over at all.

I strongly suggest that you start with the simple thing first, before you completely flatten the battery or burn out your starter motor.

Try jump starting the bike, just as you would a car. If you can't do that easily call the AA or some similar motoring organisation, they won't mind, and will jump start it for you. Does it start and run? If so, the bike's battery was simply flat. That is easy to fix.

Get the battery charged up, using a charger. This will take a few hours at a steady charge.

Make sure the battery terminals are clean and making a good contact with the + and - leads.

Try to keep it charged by riding the bike regularly on reasonably long, uninterrupted journeys. Short hops around town will flatten it, as will prolonged cold weather or simple inactivity. Failing that, try to keep the battery charged using a charger, like an Optimate. If the bike has to be kept outside, on the the street, with no easy access to electricity, take the battery out and keep it trickle charged indoors. Or get a battery jump pack, from Halfords or Maplins, for about £30. A nuisance, but there you go.

Maybe the battery simply will not / cannot hold its charge? If so, buy a new one and keep it charged, as above. Some people say that Odyssey batteries are better at holding a charge. Try one, by all means.

Come back to us once you have tried the above. If it works, job done. But, if it doesn't we will have to think of something else.... which we will. Just start with the simple things first.

PS A failed fuel pump controller will give a similar effect. But then the starter motor will spin AND the engine will turn over.... it simply will not fire, as there is no fuel. Nothing more, nothing less. You have a spinning starter motor, but not a spinning engine.... it's not the same.

 

[TheWarlock]

I'll listen for the noise of the fuel pump before trying to start it tonight
The engine isn't turning over, only the starter motor makes any noise. Thanks for the help and advice.

Apologies if this just adds to the confusion, but I am just trying to clear things up (hopefully). When you say "the engine isn't turning over, only the starter motor", do you mean you get the normal noise associated with engaging the starter motor but the engine isn't firing (normally associated with the phutt phutt noise you are describing) or do you get a high pitched whirring of just the starter motor spinning with no engine engagement ( probably meaning starter motor/ring gear issue).

Steps back and waits for strings of unhelpful abuse

 

[Owen Snell]

If the starter is 'trying' to engage but not turning the engine over, the battery is the number 1 suspect. If it is flat then recharge it. If it is showing good voltage and / or is fully charged on an Optimate but still not starting the bike, then it is dead and needs replacing. Just because the Voltage is good or the Optimate says it is good (my Maximiser said my battery was good on the morning that it failed) does not matter.

If the starter is spinning but not turning the engine then you have a bigger problem with the starter mechanism and not the battery. From the earlier posts, this seems less likely.

 

[motorbaker]

If it is showing good voltage and / or is fully charged on an Optimate but still not starting the bike, then it is dead and needs replacing. Just because the Voltage is good or the Optimate says it is good (my Maximiser said my battery was good on the morning that it failed) does not matter.

I'll second this. See this thread: http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?t=205464

I had similar problem and needed a new battery despite reassurances from the Optimate.

MB

 

[JerryP]

Try jump starting the bike, just as you would a car. If you can't do that easily call the AA or some similar motoring organisation, they won't mind, and will jump start it for you...

It may be different with newer bikes, but my 54 plate GS will not jump start, even rolling down a massive hill at 30 mph. It will 'jump-start' if the engine is running and I switch off the ignition with the key and back on again, but not from a stationary bike with a stopped engine.

I always thought that this was to do with the starting sequence logic. System won't allow a non-running engine to start, if it's in gear, which it will always be if you try to jump start.

 

[Wapping]

It may be different with newer bikes, but my 54 plate GS will not jump start, even rolling down a massive hill at 30 mph. It will 'jump-start' if the engine is running and I switch off the ignition with the key and back on again, but not from a stationary bike with a stopped engine.

I always thought that this was to do with the starting sequence logic. System won't allow a non-running engine to start, if it's in gear, which it will always be if you try to jump start.

Jump start....

Not.... Bump start

It is very difficult to bump start many modern vehicles suffering with a very flat battery. The reason is that there is not enough juice to initiate the 'starting' electronics. Jump starting, using a slave battery, gets around that problem.

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I wonder if Yerma has moved from phut, phut to brummm, brummm yet? He's been jolly quiet.