too rich fuel mixture, what to adjust,??

GARAGE HERMIT X2

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still running rich even though i've fitted pod air filter's and a straight through exhaust system, i've set the TPS using the "zero-zero" method, and adjusted the co2 pot when i had my mot,
think i read you can adjust the mixture using the TPS, is this true ?, or is it down to the co2 pot adjustment only for mixture ?,

1999 r1100gs, no cat etc, only the co2 pot fitted,
 
GARAGE HERMIT X2 said:
still running rich even though i've fitted pod air filter's and a straight through exhaust system, i've set the TPS using the "zero-zero" method, and adjusted the co2 pot when i had my mot,
think i read you can adjust the mixture using the TPS, is this true ?, or is it down to the co2 pot adjustment only for mixture ?,

1999 r1100gs, no cat etc, only the co2 pot fitted,
Click to expand...

You haven't set the TPS using the zero-zero method, you've set the throttle body stop balance. Or at least you should have.

Is this the somewhat 'interesting' bike you've created and posted about previously? If so, then you're Into guess work in order to get the mixture correct. You've changed multiple variables all at the same time and then done a zero-zero from an unknown start point. The CO pot only really affects the idle mixture (it does alter the whole mixture curve but the major effect is at idle and the first thousand revs or so - after that you're mainly on the closed loop ECU map).

What did you do with the airbox and air temp sensor when yoy fitted the pod filters? That also affects the mixture.

You can also alter the base map in the ECU (which alters the mixture) via the 'cat code' plugs (search on here) but you will have to suck it and see as to what works - you've got non standard air filters, a straight through pipe and you've messed with the throttle stops and TPS from an unknown start point. Your mods might well have altered the engines breathing beyond the limits of the fuel systems limits but without either experience and a thorough understanding of oilhead fuelling or a dyno, you're into trial and error...
 
Take a look at the colour of your spark plugs after a ride to see what the mixture is like.
 
"Shooty" pipe could mean also a bit clogged injector heads, especially on high mileage bikes. In time they get worn and start "splurring" instead of "injecting", with residual crap sucked into cylinders with vacuum between the strokes, kicked into exhaust detonated. Logically MPG efficency goes down as well. On easy touring I used to get 50+ MPG, now down to 40, no matter how easy I ride it. I've had this on me high mileage 1100 - run through a fueltank or two of injector cleaner solution every 2000-3000 miles or so, it helps temporarily (on mine it immediately removes the shooty pipe syndrome and increases MPG to near the levels I'm used to). But with 270 000+ klicks on odo I reckon I'll be looking for new injector heads and maybe also new throttle bodies sometime in the future...
 
MattW said:
You haven't set the TPS using the zero-zero method, you've set the throttle body stop balance. Or at least you should have.

Is this the somewhat 'interesting' bike you've created and posted about previously? If so, then you're Into guess work in order to get the mixture correct. You've changed multiple variables all at the same time and then done a zero-zero from an unknown start point. The CO pot only really affects the idle mixture (it does alter the whole mixture curve but the major effect is at idle and the first thousand revs or so - after that you're mainly on the closed loop ECU map).

What did you do with the airbox and air temp sensor when yoy fitted the pod filters? That also affects the mixture.

You can also alter the base map in the ECU (which alters the mixture) via the 'cat code' plugs (search on here) but you will have to suck it and see as to what works - you've got non standard air filters, a straight through pipe and you've messed with the throttle stops and TPS from an unknown start point. Your mods might well have altered the engines breathing beyond the limits of the fuel systems limits but without either experience and a thorough understanding of oilhead fuelling or a dyno, you're into trial and error...
Click to expand...


It'll never run closed loop, it ain't got a lambda sensor...
 
40MPG? Unless you're ragging it everywhere something is wrong. If it's high mileage I'd check the spray pattern from the injectors, they may be worn or just dirty. If they are OK you may need to get the bike to someone that can do a custom map for you to tak account of all the mods.

Did you do and checks on the engine such as compression before doing all the mods, basically is the mechanical part of it good?
 
Kaister said:
theres a bit more to it than that... :)
Click to expand...
I'm suggesting that the spark plugs would be a better way of judging mixture rather than the colour of the end of the exhaust. If you really want to check it use an exhaust gas analyser.
 
Checking the plug colour after you've parked it (or indeed using an analyser at tickover) isn't going to tell you much. A proper plug chop would be better but a dyno is the only way to be certain.

There's also been no answer as to what was done with the air box / air temp sensor when the pod filters were fitted?

Or why a zero-zero was done?

Or if it's on the standard cat code plug?

Etc...
 
Good Lad

Hermit Old Bean the air temp sensor is needed to tell the ecu what temp the air intake is at, if it doesn't see it or the lamda probe ( on those that have them) It goes to a default map
 
MattW said:
You haven't set the TPS using the zero-zero method, you've set the throttle body stop balance. Or at least you should have.

You've changed multiple variables all at the same time and then done a zero-zero from an unknown start point.
What did you do with the airbox and air temp sensor when yoy fitted the pod filters? That also affects the mixture.

QUOTE]

the zero-zero is the base line start point, surely,

air-temp sensor is still fitted under the p/tank,
Click to expand...
 
Tsiklonaut said:
"Shooty" pipe could mean also a bit clogged injector heads, especially on high mileage bikes. In time they get worn and start "splurring" instead of "injecting", with residual crap sucked into cylinders with vacuum between the strokes, kicked into exhaust detonated. Logically MPG efficency goes down as well. On easy touring I used to get 50+ MPG, now down to 40, no matter how easy I ride it. I've had this on me high mileage 1100 - run through a fueltank or two of injector cleaner solution every 2000-3000 miles or so, it helps temporarily (on mine it immediately removes the shooty pipe syndrome and increases MPG to near the levels I'm used to). But with 270 000+ klicks on odo I reckon I'll be looking for new injector heads and maybe also new throttle bodies sometime in the future...
Click to expand...

thank's for that, i've some injector cleaner in the garage, i'll bung some in,
 
Packer said:
40MPG? Unless you're ragging it everywhere something is wrong. If it's high mileage I'd check the spray pattern from the injectors, they may be worn or just dirty. If they are OK you may need to get the bike to someone that can do a custom map for you to tak account of all the mods.

Did you do and checks on the engine such as compression before doing all the mods, basically is the mechanical part of it good?
Click to expand...

so 40mpg is how much under the average mpg ?, for a standard 1100gs,
no compression check, but the engine seem's in fine mechanical fettle, no knock's, rattle's etc,
i do ride it quite hard, i suppose,
 
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