Vibration again.

[sproggy]

Sometimes my 2008 single cam runs super smooth, sometimes it has a rough edge to it. I should really use the GS911 to log some data and get to the bottom of it, but wouldnt know where to start.

Do you always fill up with fuel at the same place? Because differences in fuel would be my first guess for that sort of variation in vibration. I run mine on Nitro+ whenever i can but I do notice an increase in vibration if I have to use 'cheap and cheerful' regular unleaded fuel. I've stopped using Tesco fuel altogether because the bike tended to run so badly on it.

 

[Pukmeister]

Yes, but the vibes come and go with the same tank of fuel, always have done. Fuel quality isn't a variable, something else isnt quite right perhaps a coil pack or lambda. When its smooth, its beautiful on and off throttle and through the gears. Trouble is, its not that often, most of the time its a bit coarse to ride and the mirrors/screen vibrate at tickover.

Valves, TB synch are spot on, plugs are fairly new.

 

[Mistacat]

Connect your GS911 to phone or laptop.
Bluetooth or USB, I prefer USB cable to a laptop( more reliable).
Assuming you have already downloaded the GS911 software to the laptop.
Open GS911 program > R series > (Select Your model) > Engine > Real Time Values > Select All > Log to CSV > select Drive and file > Start Log.
Go for a ride and make a note of the time you set off and the time it started running rough.
On return to home stop Log.
Open the CSV file with Microsoft excel or similar and study the data at the time line the problem occurred.
The lambda control factors should read similar on 1&2 if a lambda sensor is faulty it will normally default to a reading of 1.
Check the rest of the data around the problem time, It is good to have a set of data for your bike when it is running well to check it against.
You can plot the lambda outputs to a graph in real time values. The switching points will not be identical just check that both lambda sensors are switching and the upper and lower values are similar.

 

[Mistacat]

When you check the data also look at.
the injector pulse width between cylinders.
Air temp and engine temp sensors are consistent.
Ignition angle.
Throttle position vs RPM.
Both knock sensors.
Ignition Dwell angle.
Air pressure. etc.
There is plenty of info to look at.

 

[Pukmeister]

There is plenty of info to look at.

Thanks Mistacat, that is pretty much what I thought I had to do. I shall have to give it a go its just a bit daunting for a luddite like me (ironic that I'm a commissioning engineer).

I have a Samsung android tablet with GS911 and Bluetooth so can probably capture the data wirelessly on a morning/evening commute then upload to a PC and analyse it.

 

[Bendy toy]

Fuel makes no difference on mine. Posh fuel anyway.
Last week it had Shell Nitro, Tesco 99, Esso 97 and BP 97.
It's smooth up to 70 but gets rough above.

Fingers still ache.

I'm going to make up some pill boxes from stainless. 51mm dia end plates 50mm tubes 40mm long with a spacer between.
Filled with lead shot they should be good and heavy. If the shot isn't close packed it should absorb energy better than a solid lump.
A bit of a faff but not costly.


Sent somehow.

 

[Bendy toy]

Hope u get to the bottom of this problem mate as mine vibrates too. Lovely at 70mph but vibes start about 72 or 73 and just stay there all the way up to whatever speed u like. My tyres are on the list of things to swap at some point and it has the original pattern tourances on at the moment which are quite knobbly but I will be replacing them with either the Tourance Next's or Pilot Road 3 or 4's which are obviously road biased and see if that makes any difference. I have already fitted some grip puppies which helped a bit but as this is my first GS (2008) I have nothing to compare it to. It might be completely normal
Good luck with it mate!

Sounds like my bike.

Tyres make zero difference to the painful vibes though the Conti TKC-70s were getting rough. It's now got Trail Attack 2s.

I have the grips wrapped with 3mm Sorbothane and heat shrink snooker sleeves. It helps a bit and I prefer the fatter grip.

Biggest improvement was the Rox anti vibe risers. But they are not enough.

Engine tuning/servicing has other benefits but hasn't touched what I think is mechanical vibration.

I've not checked the cam timing and engine front cover has been off so it *could* be out. Vibes have not got worse or better.
As it means another substantial spanner job I'm not too keen to check it on a hunch.

I'm pretty sure the drive shaft. I rated at speed. But what comes through footrests is coarse and lower frequency compared to handlebars.

 

[Banditsteve]

Sounds like my bike.

Tyres make zero difference to the painful vibes though the Conti TKC-70s were getting rough. It's now got Trail Attack 2s.

I have the grips wrapped with 3mm Sorbothane and heat shrink snooker sleeves. It helps a bit and I prefer the fatter grip.

Biggest improvement was the Rox anti vibe risers. But they are not enough.

Engine tuning/servicing has other benefits but hasn't touched what I think is mechanical vibration.

I've not checked the cam timing and engine front cover has been off so it *could* be out. Vibes have not got worse or better.
As it means another substantial spanner job I'm not too keen to check it on a hunch.

I'm pretty sure the drive shaft. I rated at speed. But what comes through footrests is coarse and lower frequency compared to handlebars.

Work in progress then mate. Although maybe that is just how they are? But after years of spannering cars and bikes, there is a reason for everything! It just depends how long or how much money ur willing to spend to cure it!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Bendy toy]

It's ****ing annoying.
At least the lead shot end weights won't cost much.
The local gunshop sold me a coke can of shot for £5. The end weight's end plates and tube will be £20. Only issue will be accurately cutting the 50mm tube.


Sent somehow.

 

[Mistacat]

Have you already got your 50 mm stainless tube.
I have 50 mm x 1.5 mm wall or 2" x 1/16" ( 50.8 X 1.6 mm) or 2" x 1/8" ( 50.8 X 3.2 mm) wall on the rack.
If you want 2 pieces accurately cut at 40 mm long I can part them off in the lathe.
Also I can bore the 2" to suit your bungs ?.
PM me your address if you need them and I will put them in the post.

 

[Delboy777]

Have you already got your 50 mm stainless tube.
I have 50 mm x 1.5 mm wall or 2" x 1/16" ( 50.8 X 1.6 mm) or 2" x 1/8" ( 50.8 X 3.2 mm) wall on the rack.
If you want 2 pieces accurately cut at 40 mm long I can part them off in the lathe.
Also I can bore the 2" to suit your bungs ?.
PM me your address if you need them and I will put them in the post.

Now theres an offer, Mistacat you are a gent.

 

[Bendy toy]

Have you already got your 50 mm stainless tube.
I have 50 mm x 1.5 mm wall or 2" x 1/16" ( 50.8 X 1.6 mm) or 2" x 1/8" ( 50.8 X 3.2 mm) wall on the rack.
If you want 2 pieces accurately cut at 40 mm long I can part them off in the lathe.
Also I can bore the 2" to suit your bungs ?.
PM me your address if you need them and I will put them in the post.

Wow thanks.

Let me get the measuring stick fired up and I'll ping a pm over.

Dave.

 

[younger06]

Wow thanks.

Let me get the measuring stick fired up and I'll ping a pm over.

Dave.

I will be following this very closely!!

Please keep the thread updated with results when you have some.

(I was considering amputation and bionic arms from the elbow down)

 

[Bendy toy]

Have you already got your 50 mm stainless tube.
I have 50 mm x 1.5 mm wall or 2" x 1/16" ( 50.8 X 1.6 mm) or 2" x 1/8" ( 50.8 X 3.2 mm) wall on the rack.
If you want 2 pieces accurately cut at 40 mm long I can part them off in the lathe.
Also I can bore the 2" to suit your bungs ?.
PM me your address if you need them and I will put them in the post.

Thanks for this. Really generous thanks. PM on the way.

Can you cut me 40mm lengths from the 50mm x 1.5 wall. It will give a little lip to the end plates which should look neat.

I've been trying to find a UK supplier for these pipe end plates. They are used in food quality pipework but UK suppliers seem to be hiding. Sadly M12 repair washers are not large enough. So its off to order via eBay from China.

They will need to be bored M12 but I should be OK for that on my little lathe.

The bar anchors are the next issue. How ****ing hard can it be? A: very. Everything standard is too big, too small or silly money. Ive got an idea so see how that goes.

 

[Mistacat]

Here is a start.
http://www.berkeleystainless.co.uk/products/hygienic-fittings/domed-end-caps/
http://www.pharmahygieneproducts.com/tri-clamp-blank-caps.php

 

[Bendy toy]

Thanks for these. Ive just looked again on Fleabay and the supplier I quoted has only one in stock so that's a no go.

Called Pharma Hygiene Products. Phones busy so emailed.

Two of the domed type back to back could work but they are supposed to be welded and then how to get the shot and spacer inside. Hmm. Phoned - they have none in stock and at £7 each (plus plus) I'll try other options first. They don't stock the flat disc type.

Phoning around for laser cutting options.

 

[Bendy toy]

Ive found a waterjet profiles cutter who can make discs from stainless. I'll probably be up against minimum order value but looks doable.

 

[sproggy]

Have you thought about simply casting new bar end weights out of lead rather than fabricating a complicated housing for loose lead shot? You said you thought loose lead shot would be more effective than a lead block but that seems unlikely to me. Loose shot is less dense than a solid block too - more volume, less weight.

You could even cast the lead around standard bar end weights, simply making them the 50mm diameter you've talked about. Then you've got no issues about mounting them - just bolt them straight on. And doing this you'd need only a simple, open-topped mould. You'd possibly want to drill a handful of radial holes into the standard weight to improve the lead's 'grip' on the steel weight. Then place the standard bar end upright (inner end upwards) in a simple mould and pour in molten lead around it. Leave to cool, pop out of the mould, a little bit of finishing and a coat of gloss black and bolt them straight on. Easy!

And if you don't like them, want more weight, less weight etc you just melt them down and try again.

 

[Bendy toy]

I thought of solid casting but really wanted the deadening effect of loose shot. The new ends will be full but not packed solid.

TBH I thought finding the 50mm end discs would be a great deal easier than it's turned out.

This is the principle I'm after.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_blow_hammer

 

[Mistacat]

The 4 tubes are being picked up tomorrow by Hermes.
Another option for end plates - Stainless steel dished core plugs, as in eBay item number:201525262019
Probably find a closer size & cheaper elsewhere.