scotia_steve
Registered user
Mine did until it had about 7500 miles on it, much better now and for some reason doesn't do it as much in colder weather!
vibration through the bars
- Thread starter stevie Allen
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RickG
Registered user
I know this is a common perception, indeed I would say mine has smoothed out slightly over the last 12K miles but I've yet to have anyone satisfactorily explain to my why an engine should get significantly smoother with mileage?
Assuming correct service parameters (e.g. throttle synch.), for a given engine layout / geometry the vibration developed is surely dependent on the various masses of the moving parts and how they are timed together. Discounting a few milligrams of ash or whatever on the piston crowns none of that is going to alter much regardless of mileage so how can the engine get smoother?
I rather think outside of any sloppy factory set up (rare methinks given modern technology, I stuck the vac gauges on my GS when it was a couple of days old and the synch was better than any boxer I've ever had before) that may be corrected by servicing we just get use to the shakes the more we ride.
Your question is fair but you'll just have to take on trust my value judgement on the degree of vibration. My experience with it is not unique and many other GS riders report exactly the same phenomenon. Some if not most bikes appear to show a harsh vibration through the bars in particular between 4 and 5,000 rpm. Below and above that it's not as bad. This puts it bang on motorway speeds where there's little else to do on a boring trip than consider the vibes. I do the same trip every day which includes 30 miles of motorway. Before the bike had done 15k miles the vibes were bad enough to make my fingers tingle after a trip. I do my own servicing and everything is kept spot on so that's not a variable. 3 years later the bike is smoother than my VFR with no vibration whatsoever. I'm not imagining it.
Why I've no idea. As you say it's not mechanical as the masses aren't changing but all multicylinder engines suffer from increased vibration if the carb' balance isn't spot on which implies a difference in combustion can cause an imbalance that leads to vibration. The real mystery is therefore why a run-in engine is smoother than a new one. Perhaps someone out there can tell us?
The temperture is also a real factor. If you've ever gone out on a frosty cold morning the bike feels like you've swapped the boxer for an electric motor. Conversely, if you get stuck in traffic in summer and then hit the motorway the engine will be at it's worst.
Rick, not questioning your judgement at all, indeed I did open saying I had similar experience but in the absence of a clear technical explanation I still question the objectivity of it all.
The temperature thing is easy to explain: Cold air is denser than warm air therefore on a cold day the mass of charge in the cylinder is greater. More bang for your buck as it were
mr badger
Registered user
Easy fit if you use enough, er, lubrication. Something of a 'personal' nature, if you follow my drift. Water soluble so washes out easily.
I like the extra chunkiness as I got used to Honda grips, which are noticeably bigger.
Heat takes a little longer to get through from the grips but soon settles. I think they minly help with vibes as your hand is less 'closed' IYKWIM. More relaxed grip.
Could it be that after several thousand miles, we just get used to it?
My '07 bike developed a vibration that was due to front tyre wear (Annakee). I have replaced the trail tyres with road tyres and vastly improved the bike.
RickG
Registered user
Rick, not questioning your judgement at all, indeed I did open saying I had similar experience but in the absence of a clear technical explanation I still question the objectivity of it all.
The temperature thing is easy to explain: Cold air is denser than warm air therefore on a cold day the mass of charge in the cylinder is greater. More bang for your buck as it were
We're both trying to figure out the clear technical explanation bit but all we've actually got to go on at the moment is observation and speculation. I agree the charge density is greater when it's cooler and has therefore the potential to give more power as long as the fuelling sytem can deliver the juice to match the greater mass of air, but opening the throttle a tad also gives a bigger bang and doesn't necessarily make the engine run smoother.
Don't put up with it!
'.......2) have about 15,000 to 20,000 miles on the clock. Below this milage the vibes can be as bad as you describe. After a few thou' the bike will smooth up very considerably. No substitute for this I'm afraid.....' I cannot agree - as some riders manage about 3-4.000 miles a year that would mean waiting for around 5 or 6 years! If you are getting a vibration there is something WRONG somewhere. they DON't all do it; There are various sensors in the engine management system - a plug in to the dealer's computer is quick and easy. Fiddling about with tape or bar weights is not the way to go!
Get rid of it - don't try to simply cope with it. ( I did have a difficult vibration at 70 mph on a new R65 about thirty years ago; It went back to BMW in Bracknell and although it was improved it was never cured. Yes, then it was true that they all did it!)
'.......2) have about 15,000 to 20,000 miles on the clock. Below this milage the vibes can be as bad as you describe. After a few thou' the bike will smooth up very considerably. No substitute for this I'm afraid.....' I cannot agree - as some riders manage about 3-4.000 miles a year that would mean waiting for around 5 or 6 years! If you are getting a vibration there is something WRONG somewhere. they DON't all do it; There are various sensors in the engine management system - a plug in to the dealer's computer is quick and easy. Fiddling about with tape or bar weights is not the way to go!
Get rid of it - don't try to simply cope with it. ( I did have a difficult vibration at 70 mph on a new R65 about thirty years ago; It went back to BMW in Bracknell and although it was improved it was never cured. Yes, then it was true that they all did it!)
RickG
Registered user
I profoundly agree that they shouldn't vibrate and perhaps indeed some of them don't BUT a significant number do. The issue is that none of us are as yet offering a sound reason why. Yes there there are 'various sensors in the engine management system' but in my case at least, they are the exactly the same sensors that were in the bike when it vibrated like a s*d 50,000 miles ago. I did complain about the vibes at the first service but plugging into the computer showed none of them to be at fault and the guy said some engines were tighter than other and took longer to smooth up. I have not yet seen sound evidence to support the idea that provided everything is adjusted correctly and no sensors out of spec' the cause of the vibes in low-milage engines is attributable to something other than not being fully run in. My problem is still therefore why.
Torx
I think you need a 'torx' wrench; there are a few in my tolkit but not large enough for this job; Borrow one if you can because you won't use it again probably! Don't try it with a big screwdriver ! When you tighten up it has to be to 21Nm (according to Haynes) - be careful because if you do it correctly you may inadvertently cure your vibration and won't need your magic grip puppies (- which you can then remove.)
I think you need a 'torx' wrench; there are a few in my tolkit but not large enough for this job; Borrow one if you can because you won't use it again probably! Don't try it with a big screwdriver ! When you tighten up it has to be to 21Nm (according to Haynes) - be careful because if you do it correctly you may inadvertently cure your vibration and won't need your magic grip puppies (- which you can then remove.)
Thanks Brian ,The father in law is a mechanic so will see if he has one, it can wait until I get the proper tool
thanks again guys steve
onyack
Halfords is your best bet.
You can either buy a set of torxs keys (like allen keys) or some socket heads to use with an existing socket drive.
On some of the larger sizes, you can buy a single socket, so this might be a possible answer.
I have a set of draper keys, which range from T25 to T55 - quite handy as IIRC the smaller fixing on the handguard is a 25 and the big bugger on the bar end weight is probably a 55
You can either buy a set of torxs keys (like allen keys) or some socket heads to use with an existing socket drive.
On some of the larger sizes, you can buy a single socket, so this might be a possible answer.
I have a set of draper keys, which range from T25 to T55 - quite handy as IIRC the smaller fixing on the handguard is a 25 and the big bugger on the bar end weight is probably a 55
Thanks Brian ,The father in law is a mechanic so will see if he has one, it can wait until I get the proper tool
thanks again guys steve
hi i would be interested to see how you get on,i have the same problem on my 58 gsa.what makes mine worse is,i also have a cb13 which is one of the smoothest bikes made.it like going from a roller to a tractor.
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Been following this thread as I suffered badly from vibration in my right hand on the Croatia 09 tour in July. We were doing big milages each day and I foolishly took off my warm gloves for a couple of days because of the heat, which seemed to make it worse.
Ordered the Puppies last week and fitted them at the weekend. The Torx on the end of bars is a T55. Fitting is easy and helped by the 'personal lubricant' mentioned earlier, but you don't need much .... I think I got a little carried away
I've only done around 8000 miles on my 08 bike so still a bit tight and it's in for a service this week and I'll ask for the balance to be checked, but I'm hoping it will also smooth out in time as other's have suggested. After the service I'll give the puppies a good test on a long run and see if things have improved.
Hope the Puppies work for you too Steve.
Ordered the Puppies last week and fitted them at the weekend. The Torx on the end of bars is a T55. Fitting is easy and helped by the 'personal lubricant' mentioned earlier, but you don't need much .... I think I got a little carried away
I've only done around 8000 miles on my 08 bike so still a bit tight and it's in for a service this week and I'll ask for the balance to be checked, but I'm hoping it will also smooth out in time as other's have suggested. After the service I'll give the puppies a good test on a long run and see if things have improved.
Hope the Puppies work for you too Steve.
Not got around to fitting them yet, As we are having such nice weather in the south west, Ive never been off the bike , but managed to find some time to fit some secondhand winglets to the bike ,and have also been following that thread, Personally I can feel the difference, but I think im gonna fit the adventure screen before my jaunt down to andalucia next year.
Being the tight arse I am I cut up one of my old diving drysuits and got my misses to make a pair of socks for the wilbur shocks and a pair for the front forks so it should keep the muck off them this winter
Being the tight arse I am I cut up one of my old diving drysuits and got my misses to make a pair of socks for the wilbur shocks and a pair for the front forks so it should keep the muck off them this winter
I fitted the puppies today ,and also had a tweek at the bars adjustment , will keep you posted
onyack
onyack
Well after twenty mins at slow speed in and around traffic, the same as usual , a bloody dead fingered right hand !!!ARSEI fitted the puppies today ,and also had a tweek at the bars adjustment , will keep you posted
So whats next!!!! Do I take it back and ask to get the balance checked , or go for the snakey thing inside the bars
You could try an osteopath. No; I am being serious.
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