XT ISSUES WITH ROUTES

Pablo1

Well-known member
UKGSer Subscriber
Joined
Oct 4, 2011
Messages
2,399
Reaction score
53
Location
Glasgow, scotland
In Germany at minute and if not for my mates old 660 we would have a spoiled holiday. Issues arise for 2 reasons i can establish.
Firstly, set off this morning and route preview was fine 190 miles 5hrs riding, got to the first junction and had an announcement "there are road closures on route switching to alternative" the new miles to destination changed to 395 with an eta i can only assume was 9.42 am next day.
Had to delete and re import route before it would behave.
Second issue is road closures, manual advice is to edit route to avoid road or distance, doesnt seem to work.
Settings are off route auto recalc, and faster time, phone now switched off to avoid traffic info corrupting, any other suggestions on settings.
 
Learn to view a track and a route. The track is what is plotted in Basecamp or MRA, it is the same as a line on a map and can't change. The route is the device trying to follow the track and is subject to your device settings and traffic from Garmin drive etc. Then if you display both, when the device tries to take you off route, just ignore and follow the track. Unfortunately as devices get smarter, so users have to have a greater understanding of what is happening. The 660 is a very basic sat nav.
 
Unfortunately as devices get smarter, so users have to have a greater understanding of what is happening. The 660 is a very basic sat nav.
Thats not strictly fair. The Zumo XT has known routing issues that are well documented on the Zumo forums https://www.zumouserforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=2030. I took a two day trip to Connemara Yesterday and today around 630 miles ish. Because of the known issues with RUT I had altered the imported routes to Saved rather than imported by altering the trips Hex file. Yesterday it followed the route perfectly as I hadn't deviated. Todays route included a couple of optional loops that I could use or skip depending on my timings with the journey. After I skiped the first loop it wanted me to return to a shaping point about 50 miles behind even though I had rejoined the route after the skipped points. I was on the Magenta line. A reload route sorted this. There was a small second loop that I was going to do (but I skipped the two waypoints) and carried on and it behaved as expected and continued to navigate the route. I subsequently backtracked a few miles and reloaded the route again to do the loop and it performed faultlessly. I still have all of my garmin navs (Streetpilot 2610, Zumo 340, (Zumo 390 Bought as a spare) Nav iv and the XT. I have the XT mounted on my Africa twin and the Zumo 390 on my old R1150GS. I love the clear screen and functionality of the XT but as a routing device for routes downloaded from basecamp it leaves a lot to be desired. My work arounds at the moment are use more named waypoints than I otherwise would (usually only use waypoints for stops but now use then to shape routes a bit more). Make sure I know the order these Waypoints come on the route and as a last resort restart the route if it gets in too much of a pickle. There is something fundamentally odd about the Zumo XT routing logic compared to the older units. With those I just loaded the routes and forgot about them and if i went off piste it resumed the route in a sensible way. With the Zumo XT its inconsistent I'm always thinking of contingencies and work arounds.
 
Thats not strictly fair. The Zumo XT has known routing issues that are well documented on the Zumo forums https://www.zumouserforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=2030. I took a two day trip to Connemara Yesterday and today around 630 miles ish. Because of the known issues with RUT I had altered the imported routes to Saved rather than imported by altering the trips Hex file. Yesterday it followed the route perfectly as I hadn't deviated. Todays route included a couple of optional loops that I could use or skip depending on my timings with the journey. After I skiped the first loop it wanted me to return to a shaping point about 50 miles behind even though I had rejoined the route after the skipped points. I was on the Magenta line. A reload route sorted this. There was a small second loop that I was going to do (but I skipped the two waypoints) and carried on and it behaved as expected and continued to navigate the route. I subsequently backtracked a few miles and reloaded the route again to do the loop and it performed faultlessly. I still have all of my garmin navs (Streetpilot 2610, Zumo 340, (Zumo 390 Bought as a spare) Nav iv and the XT. I have the XT mounted on my Africa twin and the Zumo 390 on my old R1150GS. I love the clear screen and functionality of the XT but as a routing device for routes downloaded from basecamp it leaves a lot to be desired. My work arounds at the moment are use more named waypoints than I otherwise would (usually only use waypoints for stops but now use then to shape routes a bit more). Make sure I know the order these Waypoints come on the route and as a last resort restart the route if it gets in too much of a pickle. There is something fundamentally odd about the Zumo XT routing logic compared to the older units. With those I just loaded the routes and forgot about them and if i went off piste it resumed the route in a sensible way. With the Zumo XT its inconsistent I'm always thinking of contingencies and work arounds.
I am a member of the zumo forums and am well aware of the RUT issue and the ways to get around the issue. But that issues has nothing to do with the device routing differently because of road closures. The RUT is to do with missing waypoints and trying to take u back. If u also have a track displayed, you can ignore the routing and get back on track. So I think it is very fair, every issue is not to do with RUT.
 
Accepted but the XT behaves in an odd an unpredictable way at times. You shouldn’t be required to display a track because you can’t trust it.
 
Accepted but the XT behaves in an odd an unpredictable way at times. You shouldn’t be required to display a track because you can’t trust it.
And then there's the "fastest" routing option which means it selects the fastest roads not the route that'll take the least time.

Having gone from the SP3 to the XT, the XT is the only Garmin sat nav that I'm wary of the routing algorithms, and is the only one many people use work arounds, like displaying a track of the route, because of its quirks.
 
Thanks for replies, i would never have bought this set up had i known the issues, all my routes have only start and finish waypoints, all rest are shaping points only, yet if i make a mistake it will request u turns forever, i then get my mate with his 660 to lead way, once stopped, i reload route again and it behaves for a while, 3 times today this happened. Very frustrating.
 
Thanks for replies, i would never have bought this set up had i known the issues, all my routes have only start and finish waypoints, all rest are shaping points only, yet if i make a mistake it will request u turns forever, i then get my mate with his 660 to lead way, once stopped, i reload route again and it behaves for a while, 3 times today this happened. Very frustrating.

I just use a map on the tank bag, for actually navigating
The Zumo XT is just for the pretty pics on the screen in front of me and the speed I am travelling
 
Thanks for replies, i would never have bought this set up had i known the issues, all my routes have only start and finish waypoints, all rest are shaping points only, yet if i make a mistake it will request u turns forever, i then get my mate with his 660 to lead way, once stopped, i reload route again and it behaves for a while, 3 times today this happened. Very frustrating.
Spend some time on the zumo forums, that will help. The answer is don’t go wrong. The way around RUT is to stop the route and start again picking next entry point. Personally never had an issue with shaping points only waypoints and have been following custom routes for a couple of years. The XT is still miles ahead of a 660, but u have to put some effort into understanding what it is going, which isn’t ideal. Hopefully Garmin will fix the RUT issue at some point, but there are work around until they do. Also it makes a difference how the route is transferred to your XT. Basecamp or if using MRA which format u choose, gpx 1.1 or 1.2 that defines, via points, waypoints and track and route.
 
Last edited:
Ok the Zumo XT has a fantastic screen. Its great at playing spotify. The weather and rain radar functions are nice. The phone conectivity is great and the roundtrip and adventurous routing functions are probably good too though I've never used them. However, as a pure gps device capable of following a route created in basecamp or even as a point to point device it is sadly lacking and a Zumo 660 is certainly capable of doing a job as a gps even though the rest of the functions are missing. Don't get me wrong i'm persisting with the thing because I'm a masochist and hopefully Garmin can get it sorted out. However, I joined the Zumo forums because after months of use I noticed it was not doing what I expected (I hadn't bothered joining previously as all my other garmin GPS devices had worked as expected). Particularly in following routes created in basecamp and routing point to point using faster time. This was particularly noticable for me as I regularly run two satnav types the Zumo XT and a Zumo 390 and 340 (basically the same unit but the 390 has a telephony funtion). One day I headed out to the Fermangh, Leitrim, Sligo Donegal border. There is a mountainous area here near Lough Melvin with lots of senic features. I didn't route to the area but created a number of waypoints that i could visit point to point until I run out of time. At the last point I visited I routed for home just outside Manorhamilton and all of my units are set to route faster time. When I got to Blacklion on the border the Nav wanted to route me through Enniskillen which being built on an Island is a traffic jam :) The nav wanted to route me through it but I decided to turn right and go through Florencecourt which i knew should take me over an Island on lough Erne near Carrybridge and out onto the main A4 road to Belfast. As I was heading towards Florencecourt the Nav told me there was a 15min delay in Enniskillen but offered no detour with the little detour button. I couldn't remember if I had to turn left or right at the end of the Florencecourt road so stopped and looked at the map :). The unit told me about the delay and continued to merrily route me towards it and continued to do so until I had crossed the Island in lough Erne (on minor roads) and then correctly directed me to the A4 and shortened the predicted arrival time by about 25 mins as the distance was shorter and the traffic was missed. Also on the return I consistently give me delay times on the route it calculated through Belfast. I live on the Eastern Burbs and dont need to go through it from that direction. The alternatives it was suggesting would have brought me into a lot of traffic. I ignored it and took more minor roads to reach home and it kept nagging me to ride into traffic. Confirming that faster time on the XT means faster roads. As an experiment I put a route from Florencecourt to home into all of the Navs at my disposal to see what way they routed. The results are interesting.

IMG_20230608_121456584_HDR.jpgIMG_20230608_121317389_HDR.jpgIMG_20230608_122429378_HDR.jpgZumo XT

Zumo 390
IMG_20230608_121307883_HDR.jpgIMG_20230608_121433878_HDR.jpgIMG_20230608_122340434_HDR.jpg

BMW Nav IV
IMG_20230609_085233608_HDR.jpgIMG_20230609_085331656_HDR.jpg

Streetpilot 2610

IMG_20230609_084234655_HDR.jpgIMG_20230609_084234655_HDR.jpg

Google Maps

Screenshot_20230609-084539.pngScreenshot_20230609-084610.png

As you can see the only unit that wants to route me through the middle of Belfast is the Zumo XT this is clearly not the fastest route to my house from that location. There are slight variations in the other garmin units but are closer to what I'd actually do. This time the Zumo did not want to route me through Enniskillen but took me considerably further south and through an additional town to get to the A4. My conclusion on the Zumo XT so far is great infotainment unit. Great Sat Nav? Not so much. In places where you go off piste and just want to get quickly to your destination your phone and google maps would be best. I can use this on the TFT screen of my africa twin and it has the added bonus of voice commands which means you dont have to stand and prod the screen. Haven't found a decent app that works on Android Auto and takes the sort of routes I like following yet though.
 
Ok the Zumo XT has a fantastic screen. Its great at playing spotify. The weather and rain radar functions are nice. The phone conectivity is great and the roundtrip and adventurous routing functions are probably good too though I've never used them. However, as a pure gps device capable of following a route created in basecamp or even as a point to point device it is sadly lacking and a Zumo 660 is certainly capable of doing a job as a gps even though the rest of the functions are missing. Don't get me wrong i'm persisting with the thing because I'm a masochist and hopefully Garmin can get it sorted out. However, I joined the Zumo forums because after months of use I noticed it was not doing what I expected (I hadn't bothered joining previously as all my other garmin GPS devices had worked as expected). Particularly in following routes created in basecamp and routing point to point using faster time. This was particularly noticable for me as I regularly run two satnav types the Zumo XT and a Zumo 390 and 340 (basically the same unit but the 390 has a telephony funtion). One day I headed out to the Fermangh, Leitrim, Sligo Donegal border. There is a mountainous area here near Lough Melvin with lots of senic features. I didn't route to the area but created a number of waypoints that i could visit point to point until I run out of time. At the last point I visited I routed for home just outside Manorhamilton and all of my units are set to route faster time. When I got to Blacklion on the border the Nav wanted to route me through Enniskillen which being built on an Island is a traffic jam :) The nav wanted to route me through it but I decided to turn right and go through Florencecourt which i knew should take me over an Island on lough Erne near Carrybridge and out onto the main A4 road to Belfast. As I was heading towards Florencecourt the Nav told me there was a 15min delay in Enniskillen but offered no detour with the little detour button. I couldn't remember if I had to turn left or right at the end of the Florencecourt road so stopped and looked at the map :). The unit told me about the delay and continued to merrily route me towards it and continued to do so until I had crossed the Island in lough Erne (on minor roads) and then correctly directed me to the A4 and shortened the predicted arrival time by about 25 mins as the distance was shorter and the traffic was missed. Also on the return I consistently give me delay times on the route it calculated through Belfast. I live on the Eastern Burbs and dont need to go through it from that direction. The alternatives it was suggesting would have brought me into a lot of traffic. I ignored it and took more minor roads to reach home and it kept nagging me to ride into traffic. Confirming that faster time on the XT means faster roads. As an experiment I put a route from Florencecourt to home into all of the Navs at my disposal to see what way they routed. The results are interesting.
As you can see the only unit that wants to route me through the middle of Belfast is the Zumo XT this is clearly not the fastest route to my house from that location. There are slight variations in the other garmin units but are closer to what I'd actually do. This time the Zumo did not want to route me through Enniskillen but took me considerably further south and through an additional town to get to the A4. My conclusion on the Zumo XT so far is great infotainment unit. Great Sat Nav? Not so much. In places where you go off piste and just want to get quickly to your destination your phone and google maps would be best. I can use this on the TFT screen of my africa twin and it has the added bonus of voice commands which means you dont have to stand and prod the screen. Haven't found a decent app that works on Android Auto and takes the sort of routes I like following yet though.

If I’m feeling lazy and just want a realistic point to point route, I use this feature https://www8.garmin.com/manuals/web...UID-2779F56A-1AEA-4DB2-8AB3-A58F15303128.html, with the slider set to position 2. This generally routes me similar to Google maps.
 
Yes I suspect thats the way its been designed as a point to point unit that you can create routes on if you like and tweek the adventurous routing slider to taste. I tried your suggestion and it routed a loop through Armagh and Portadown......which would be far from the fastest route. :) The basic fastest time to fastest roads thing needs to be sorted as does behaviour with routes imported from basecamp. I use the Sat Navs a lot becuse there are lots of interesting little roads to explore around here. However, the XT really grates due to its shortcomings as a navigation device when it could be superb. My concern would be negotiating routes close to major cities in an area I don't know well, deciding I want to go off route and go directly somewhere and it lands me in the middle of the city if its not required. Though to be fair I would check were I was going against google maps and a real map and make my own choices.
 
Speaking of adventurous routing. Does anyone remember this little gem of a screen.:)IMG_20230609_095855293_HDR (1).jpg
 
Ok the Zumo XT has a fantastic screen. Its great at playing spotify. The weather and rain radar functions are nice. The phone conectivity is great and the roundtrip and adventurous routing functions are probably good too though I've never used them. However, as a pure gps device capable of following a route created in basecamp or even as a point to point device it is sadly lacking and a Zumo 660 is certainly capable of doing a job as a gps even though the rest of the functions are missing. Don't get me wrong i'm persisting with the thing because I'm a masochist and hopefully Garmin can get it sorted out. However, I joined the Zumo forums because after months of use I noticed it was not doing what I expected (I hadn't bothered joining previously as all my other garmin GPS devices had worked as expected). Particularly in following routes created in basecamp and routing point to point using faster time. This was particularly noticable for me as I regularly run two satnav types the Zumo XT and a Zumo 390 and 340 (basically the same unit but the 390 has a telephony funtion). One day I headed out to the Fermangh, Leitrim, Sligo Donegal border. There is a mountainous area here near Lough Melvin with lots of senic features. I didn't route to the area but created a number of waypoints that i could visit point to point until I run out of time. At the last point I visited I routed for home just outside Manorhamilton and all of my units are set to route faster time. When I got to Blacklion on the border the Nav wanted to route me through Enniskillen which being built on an Island is a traffic jam :) The nav wanted to route me through it but I decided to turn right and go through Florencecourt which i knew should take me over an Island on lough Erne near Carrybridge and out onto the main A4 road to Belfast. As I was heading towards Florencecourt the Nav told me there was a 15min delay in Enniskillen but offered no detour with the little detour button. I couldn't remember if I had to turn left or right at the end of the Florencecourt road so stopped and looked at the map :). The unit told me about the delay and continued to merrily route me towards it and continued to do so until I had crossed the Island in lough Erne (on minor roads) and then correctly directed me to the A4 and shortened the predicted arrival time by about 25 mins as the distance was shorter and the traffic was missed. Also on the return I consistently give me delay times on the route it calculated through Belfast. I live on the Eastern Burbs and dont need to go through it from that direction. The alternatives it was suggesting would have brought me into a lot of traffic. I ignored it and took more minor roads to reach home and it kept nagging me to ride into traffic. Confirming that faster time on the XT means faster roads. As an experiment I put a route from Florencecourt to home into all of the Navs at my disposal to see what way they routed. The results are interesting.

View attachment 267218View attachment 267219View attachment 267220Zumo XT

Zumo 390
View attachment 267222View attachment 267223View attachment 267224

BMW Nav IV
View attachment 267229View attachment 267230

Streetpilot 2610

View attachment 267231View attachment 267232

Google Maps

View attachment 267233View attachment 267234

As you can see the only unit that wants to route me through the middle of Belfast is the Zumo XT this is clearly not the fastest route to my house from that location. There are slight variations in the other garmin units but are closer to what I'd actually do. This time the Zumo did not want to route me through Enniskillen but took me considerably further south and through an additional town to get to the A4. My conclusion on the Zumo XT so far is great infotainment unit. Great Sat Nav? Not so much. In places where you go off piste and just want to get quickly to your destination your phone and google maps would be best. I can use this on the TFT screen of my africa twin and it has the added bonus of voice commands which means you dont have to stand and prod the screen. Haven't found a decent app that works on Android Auto and takes the sort of routes I like following yet though.

Looks like the 2610 didn’t do a half bad job
 
Nope it did absolutely fine. I still have the wiring gubbins attached to the GS. I have the ability now to convert my own OSM maps. So it may yet get another outing or two. Certainly has a lot of functionality missing in later units. I used it extensively in Norway France Spain and the US. Expensive at Christmas 2004 at £500 with a 256mb CF card but used it exclusively until 2015/16 albeit with an upgrade to two 2gb cf cards. Followed routes made in mapsource and Basecamp perfectly. :)
 
I actually prefer fastest route to use fastest roads rather than the Nav VI which does fasted time and ends up taking me down roads with grass in the middle :) So each to their own, as long as you understand what it is doing plan ahead. But I do agree the foibles do need sorting out, whether they will who knows. Wonder is the XT2 uses the algorithms as the XT
 
I actually prefer fastest route to use fastest roads rather than the Nav VI which does fasted time and ends up taking me down roads with grass in the middle :) So each to their own, as long as you understand what it is doing plan ahead. But I do agree the foibles do need sorting out, whether they will who knows. Wonder is the XT2 uses the algorithms as the XT
I'd bet that the XT is similar, but with added agro.

I have a 396 and am sure it likes faster roads rather than the fastest route, so maybe it's the new Garmin standard? I have wondered if Garmin think that motorcycles use the same roads, in the same manner as an artic, and therefore a faster road would become a fastest route.
 
I think it may be something to do with the phone connection and the units (in my opinion poor) ability to route around traffic. If this worked well faster, roads I suppose makes sense. The older units I suspect when you chose faster route looked at all the road options between the start of the point to point route to the end and calculated shortest distance shortest time based on the speeds assigned by the unit to the roads avaliable. (these units obviously had no clue what the traffic was doing). It mostly worked well. And in the example above its interesting to note that google maps chose roughly the same route as the old garmins and google maps can account for traffic. The old 2610 was more flexible than current units in that before it calculated a route it give you the option of faster time, shorter distance off road!! or custom. Custom allowed you to mess with the sliders representing road types and if you wanted you could avoid minor roads altogether see photo above. As a point of interest you can adjust road type speeds in the Profiles section of Basecamp. As i say I'll persist with the XT but as regards navigation often feel its fighting me rather than helping. I hope that Garmin sort some of the issues but with a new unit coming out my hopes may be misplaced :) Im off to the Picos for 10 days in September. I'm considering wiring my Honda for the 340/390. For two reasons. The XT can be a routing faff with Basecamp routes and if I have the routes created in Basecamp loaded on both units then a degree of redundancy is built in if a unit suffers a mishap. I initially bought the XT thinking I could use Explore for creating routes instead of Basecamp and ditch Windows permanently for Linux. Alas Explore is a whole other can of worms :D
 


Back
Top Bottom