1200/1250 GS Watercooled Engine Tuning

[Deleted account 191119001]

Cats accumulate oxygen during the lean part of the cycle at a mixture of 14.7:1 during closed loop operation. During the rich part of the cycle they use the stored O2 to oxidize any unburned hydrocarbons. When the mixture is rich for a sustained period the stored oxygen is depleted and the cat stops oxidizing and cools down.

When a engine misfires and unburned fuel and unburned oxygen enter the cat it burns and gets extremely hot, damaging the cat.

So basically messing around with these values if you really do not know the ins and out of the bike and its ECU can be very dangerous...........

 

[Roger 04 RT]

I wouldn’t say it’s dangerous but it helps to understand how all the moving parts of fueling interact.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

I wouldn’t say it’s dangerous but it helps to understand how all the moving parts of fueling interact.

So basically Roger the best solution without calling the witch doctor to cast a spell on the bike would be AX-FIED is that your gut feeling.

 

[papasquelch]

I hear there is a company that in some circumstances can give you better fuelling with 10 to 20bhp power increases and even supplied dyno information.

Been thinking about this.... (dangerous)

We have been advised that you can clone an ECU. So it would be possible to extract this data as at the end of the day it is computer code and in its most basic form it is ones and zeros. If the file size was say 1 megabyte. and you altered the ecu code slightly to say add more fuel in certain scenarios.... the file would be virtually the same and unless compared side by side the the original it would appear invisible

I think all that happens is tweaking of the original code. Tuning companies will not confirm their methods as it would be quite easy to clone a modified ECU in my simple opinion

Dumping the entire digital content of a computer and applying md5sum will give a hash value. If the content of the computer is changed (even slightly) md5sum will give quite a different hash value. So any change is identifiable. If the md5sum hash totals of two memory dumps, say before and after something, are the same then nothing has changed.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Dumping the entire digital content of a computer and applying md5sum will give a hash value. If the content of the computer is changed (even slightly) md5sum will give quite a different hash value. So any change is identifiable. If the md5sum hash totals of two memory dumps, say before and after something, are the same then nothing has changed.

Yep that is a fact, that is how we check computer software has not been pirated and malicious code inserted.

https://emn178.github.io/online-tools/md5_checksum.html

 

[tanneman]

If you allocate a part of the disc to a software program and then use a tool specific to access that software program then you will only see that part of the disc that you interact with. If there is another software program that interacts with the 1st software program it won't be detected by the tool. You will have to decode the expected outputs and compare it with the actual outputs from the program. Or as an admin of the disc you have access to the whole disc. But how you gain access to the unused part of the disc and upload a program to interact with the 1st program I have no idea. We always set it back to the boot program, load the operating system, create the files and load the applications. There is a checksum at the end to compare that the applications has been loaded correctly.

 

[karlp]

I hate to rain on everyone’s parade but here are some reasons why I don’t ever expect ECU fuel tuning to deliver 10-20 additional horsepower to a 100 HP BMW engine:

1) Since HP is torque times RPM, peak HP is by definition in the upper band of RPM at WOT.

2) Every BMW motorcycle I’ve measured with a Wideband O2, ahead of the cat, shows WOT, high RPM fueling in the range 12.7 to 13.0:1. That is already at or near what’s called BEST POWER MIXTURE—meaning in that vicinity you don’t get more power from just more fuel, it just reduces the exhaust gas temperature and makes a dirty burn.

3) Engine designers often don’t advance the ignition timing to peak HP at WOT. They leave it less advanced than optimum HP to create a safety margin against detonation and preignition. A tuner can eat into the safety margin, but the HP increase isn’t 10-20%.

4) To add HP at WOT to an engine you have to add more fuel AND more air and then adjust timing to optimum, with a safety margin for temperature and barometric pressure and engine aging.

Below WOT for 70% of the map, a tuner can change fueling values in the map, but Closed Loop Adaptation returns the fueling to BMW’s design targets. There are some improvements that can be made with spark advance but it’s a lot of work and takes a lot of time. For that 70% of the map, if you want more fuel with connected O2 sensors you have to change the O2 sensors switching point one way or another.

As he says

Without significant engine mods - such as cam profiles, increased bore/strokeor adding a turbo you will not get significant changes will not be made.

 

[spoonz]

If anyone is interested have a look on you tube at Samcrac latest vid on a Ferrari transmission issues. ( about 1/3 through). Long story short it had shifting issues so he took both transmission ecu’s ( 1 ecu is manual mode and 1 auto) to an Ecu specialist.

That specialist used a hex comparator which highlights any differences in the code on the chipset in highlighted red text. In this case it showed several changes indicating it was from another model car. That is how anybody needing to verify if any changes to the code on a chipset has occurred can easily check. At chipset level everything is visible, in a similar way that the tools police use can view raw data on a disk even when, deleted, partitioned, formatted, passworded etc. Encryption will protect it especially if it’s high level encryption but you can still see it’s there you just can’t see it’s content without breaking the encryption.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

If anyone is interested have a look on you tube at Samcrac latest vid on a Ferrari transmission issues. ( about 1/3 through). Long story short it had shifting issues so he took both transmission ecu’s ( 1 ecu is manual mode and 1 auto) to an Ecu specialist.

That specialist used a hex comparator which highlights any differences in the code on the chipset in highlighted red text. In this case it showed several changes indicating it was from another model car. That is how anybody needing to verify if any changes to the code on a chipset has occurred can easily check. At chipset level everything is visible, in a similar way that the tools police use can view raw data on a disk even when, deleted, partitioned, formatted, passworded etc. Encryption will protect it especially if it’s high level encryption but you can still see it’s there you just can’t see it’s content without breaking the encryption.

Interesting find below, I wonder what there mygenius box actually does.

http://www.dimsport.it/en/rapidbike-akrapovic-maps/

http://www.dimsport.it/en/rapidbike/accessories/

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Well I think I now know where to put my hard earned, at least if I am not happy I ca re-sell later, and have something in my hand, the thread below helped also make my decision, I will not mention the other chapters.

https://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/446653-AF-XIED-for-a-standard-bike

For international have to go through below link

https://www.beemerboneyard.com/bmwafxied1200lc.html

 

[grant123]

You wont get the benefits of tweaking throttle maps etc but you could go down the PC5 with Dual Autotune setup for each cylinder and remove the factory O2 sensors.
The bike will be fueling correct after a few rides for your setup and you can always sell on when you are done with the kit.
Alot of people actually sell the Autotune module and sensors once they are happy with the map developed and just leave the PC5 connected

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

You wont get the benefits of tweaking throttle maps etc but you could go down the PC5 with Dual Autotune setup for each cylinder and remove the factory O2 sensors.
The bike will be fueling correct after a few rides for your setup and you can always sell on when you are done with the kit.
Alot of people actually sell the Autotune module and sensors once they are happy with the map developed and just leave the PC5 connected

Thanks looked at that and all the + and - think AF-Xied will suit my needs as really just being picky....

 

[Belco100]

Rexxer do a map for the R1200GS.

Euro4 (Bosch ECU) ones need the ECU send off as they need to be opened to blow a new map into them at the moment.

 

[spoonz]

Doesn’t the rapidbike need plumbing in like a pc3 ? I didn’t read all of their site so might have missed where it says.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Rexxer do a map for the R1200GS.

Euro4 (Bosch ECU) ones need the ECU send off as they need to be opened to blow a new map into them at the moment.

Seems similar to something we are not allowed to use the name on here........

 

[fredaroony]

Doesn’t the rapidbike need plumbing in like a pc3 ? I didn’t read all of their site so might have missed where it says.

Yep, same deal.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Doesn’t the rapidbike need plumbing in like a pc3 ? I didn’t read all of their site so might have missed where it says.

Yep seems so....

 

[Engineer]

In this thread please do not mention the sponsors name on top of the page, otherwise this thread will be removed to the sponsors own section.


So as I am looking into possibly tuning my bike in a while when my warranty runs out, can some of the guys that have actually done things to their Watercooled GS1200/1250 chime in and say technically what they think has worked for them, and why, I have seen AX-FIED that looks good, I have seen that TPS RESET seems to help, is their anything real out there that I have missed, something new maybe.....

Do you care about meeting emission regulations after your tune up? It is actually illegal to modify your machine in such a way that it no longer meets its emissions requirements

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Do you care about meeting emission regulations after your tune up? It is actually illegal to modify your machine in such a way that it no longer meets its emissions requirements

I can unplug it and go back to standard at least Will, with other cloaking methods it is not possible, unless you asked the chief wizard.

 

[Morety]

To me, who has only basic understanding of modern engine ecu tuning, what seems extremely complicated, once broken down into its component parts really is just a series of logic steps controlled by sensors. Whilst I have had 4 engines tuned using dynos to optimise the AFR and power/torque curves (doing research before hand to see what exhaust systems result in the most linear responses), I have also tuned many carburreted bikes myself, as well as whole engine rebuilds.

What has been immensely useful in this thread is the very logical breakdown of the principles behind how the ECU works (thank you Roger 04 RT for your very informative posts). As was said, the principles really are little different to carburetted bikes. More power = more air and more fuel with the ability to use that mixture efficiently and with engine life, smooth running and reliability factored in. The limit is reached by the amount of fuel that can be burnt efficiently, dictated by engine displacement, cam profiles (hence volumetric flow capacity of valve open durations), compression ratio, revolutions limits, ignition efficiency and things like exhaust design for best gas-flow and back-pressure.

BMW have obviously optimised running for their bikes for engine longevity with a sensible margin on reliability, so really (and especially looking at what the bike is) wanting significant power increases, one is better to look at an alternative bike that gives that from stock. It's often cheaper to buy a bike with more power as standard in the first place than to buy one with less power and tune it, so really where the big old GS1200 is concerned, most people recognise that and are really looking for improvements in drivability through the strangled emissions control areas where the bike is designed to run leaner and more efficiently.

I've only ridden a handful of WC GS1200 bikes, including my own and each one has felt slightly different. My current GSA is most definitely the smoothest one I've ridden (hence part of the reason I bought it) and doesn't seem to have any trouble pulling 6th from 45 to 50mph cleanly, and will pull hard all the way to the red line without any obvious significant dips. There is a very slight flat spot between 4,000 and 5,000 revs but it soon pulls through that and rockets away. I haven't noted any on-off lumpy fuelling at low revs save in dynamic mode. Then, filtering in 1st gear through traffic isn't the way to go as it can be a little jerky with the near instantaneous response but left on standard road mode and its fine. I'm unsure though of how typical my bike is of the breed as a whole, but if this does sound familiar, then I'd question really why anyone feels the need to go to the cost and trouble for really very small benefits. AF-XIED does seem a pretty good compromise to those just wanting to eliminate the 4 to 5K flat spot but for me, it pulls so quickly through that I'm not bothered personally. I may give the AF-XIED solution a go down the line but for now just enjoy riding the thing as it is. Standard.