achived fuel pump controller replies

[P Pod]

Now incorporated in 2008 figures

When did it happen? Bank holiday Monday 25th Aug :-(
Where were you? Doing a v good national speed limit ;-( along A47 in Leics
rider name Paula Ross
bike details (model and year) R1200 06 plate, 24k miles.
remedy RAC to dealer then new controller fitted
How many days work/holiday did you lose? all afternoon on Monday then late to work Tuesday as had to org second part of relay to BMW.

Were there any incidental costs? £90 to replace and massive massive annoyance on my part! Only had bike serviced last week plus 2 new tyres. Need this extra cost and inconvenience like a hole in the head - majorly annoyed that BMW don't see it as a design fault...

Edit (29 Aug): quick update - picked up my bike this morning - and no charge. So hats off to Wollaston for that one. Very much appreciated indeed

 

[Tim Cullis]

Incorporated in 2008

When: May 2008
Where: A90 north of Dundee
Rider: Ian Slorach
Bike: 06 1200RT, 8000 miles
Remedy: flat bed to Aberdeen, without bike for two weeks due to no FPCs available

 

[Tim Cullis]

Incorporated in 2008 figures

When: Apr 2008
Rider: Bill Bradford
Remedy: recovered by AA, bike out of warranty so £80 bill.

 

[GSYank]

Fuel Pump Controller Failure

When: Aug 18, 2008
Where: Cayucos, California, USA
Bike: 2007 1200GS, 8700 miles
Symptoms: Riding along the highway at 65 mph for about 10 miles, all of the sudden the engine dies. Electrics still on, as I coast in gear to the shoulder it bump starts itself. I turn around to head back home, it dies 6 times. I start it and go a little further each time. I made it 2 blocks from home and pushed it the rest of the way.

Roadside Assistance couldn't find a tow truck willing to tow it to the dealer (150 miles) for the $500 coverage amount. Dealer came and picked it up (great guys they are). 2 days in the shop. Confirmed controller failure. No charge - Warranty. $45 bus ticket to go get my bike back.

Hi GSYank
I'm keeping the list as failures that have happened to UK owners as it has more impact statistically, but many thanks for reporting the failure as it shows it's a worldwide issue.
Tim

 

[snoopy]

+ ChrisKelleys failed last week.

 

[Mr K]

+ ChrisKelleys failed last week.

Snitch!!

 

[Tim Cullis]

Back in July we had 105 recorded failures in total and I expressed concern that for the whole of 2008 we might see 65 failures.

Well so far we have 186 failures in total and 88 failures in the first eight months of 2008. And given that UKGSer 'penetration' of the UK market is only a percentage of the owners, these figures are only the tip of the iceberg.

My initial response from BMW was not at all positive, however I have pointed senior BMW UK personnel to this thread and I am hopeful of a meaningful discussion.

Tim

 

[Tim Cullis]

Tim, feel free to delete this once you've seen, but it might be of relevance:

http://www.vosa.gov.uk/vosa/apps/re...DDA35C0000D4C8802570450037D9C0&freeText=Blank

Reference : RM/2005/016
Manufacturer Ref :
Make: BMW MOTORCYCLES
Model : R1200GS(K25)
Launch Date : 04/02/2005
Numbers Involved : 668
Build Start Date :
Build End Date :
Recall Details
Concern : ENGINE MAY CUT OUT
Description : It is possible for water to ingress into the cavity underneath the fuel pump electronics and corrode the electrical contacts of the fuel pump. This will lead to sporadic failure of the fuel pump and cause the engine to cut out and possibly back in.
Remedial Action : Recall the machines that are likely to be affected and where necessary fit a new O ring seal under the body of the fuel pump body. Additionally, if necessary, replace the fuel pump unit.
Vehicle Id : ZN000000000025000 to ZN000000000031286
ZL0000000000225000 to ZL000000000029999

Yes, that was a long time ago and I was aware of it. However it's interesting that VOSA issued the recall as they normally only get involved when safety is involved.

We've said all along that sudden engine cutouts could be disasterous for the rider, indeed several of the failures documented above could have resulted in a fatal accident. Whilst the current crop of failures might not be identical to the 2005 recall, the safety impact certainly is, and involving VOSA might very well be the 'Plan B' approach should BMW decline to discuss the matter. 'Plan C' is the nuclear option.

A well-connected user of this site has been briefing me on the VOSA code of practice and how to invoke their participation

... nowhere does it say it has to be a certain percentage of failed units it simply says "common to a number of units" and clarifies this with "it will be a matter of VOSA/supplier judgement to decide whether the number of units affected is sufficient to justify invoking the Code. A fixed numerical limit cannot be specified as the decision will take account of the degree of seriousness of any possible hazard involved."

So the number of bikes unaffected is irrelevant.

They also have power to get info from BMW, "VOSA may wish to seek information from a supplier about safety defects that have been brought to their attention. In these cases, the supplier will pass all relevant information available, and cooperate with VOSA in establishing whether a defect is present."

Tim

 

[Merlin999]

Well done Tim , I for one applaud your efforts....!

Equally, well done for continued action under fire!

BMW have been rather cynical with regard to design/manufacturing faults on their products.

Top Man!

 

[Blade31]

Hi

I've got a 2008 R1200GS Adventure and on a trip to Greece this year my bike cut out several times on the way. If i was in traffic and pulled the clutch in to coast to a set of traffic lights it would just stop dead. Do you think this could be an intermitent fault with the pump?

Neil

Neil,

I don't think so. My RT did it when new 2 or 3 times and so has my GSA. Whether a software update or running in cured it, I don't know but it just stopped happening and the RT was fine for a further 20k+ miles and the GSA hasn't done it for a while now (but it only has 3k on it).

It only happens with low speed riding and seems more prone in hot conditions.

Can't be completely certain but very unlikely to be the fpc.

Hi Paul, it was hot at the time, 30oC +, Looks like i've got this FPC to look forward to then!!

Cheers
Neil

£76 to you... I am just up the road in Leek

They do fail intermittently at first, just before they die for good!

They take 10 mins to fit....

 

[Owen Snell]

Failure Summary

How does this break down Tim? Are the failures random or age based? Do the new controllers fail as well? Would be really interesting to see model year of bike and age when failed as a table.

Keep up the good work

Feel free to use the data above to compile a table

Tim

After I posted I thought this would be the obvious reply. So, ignoring non GS and failures without a model year given (apart from in 04 when I assumed bikes 04 as well).

2004 Bikes

2004: 7
2005: 7
2006: 10
2007: 7
2008: 5

2005 Bikes

2005: 2
2006: 6
2007: 14
2008: 17

2006 Bikes

2006: 0
2007: 5
2008: 22

2007 Bikes

2007: 5
2008: 21

2008 Bikes

2008: 2

 

[Fran1008]

Hi There, It happened on August 16th 2008 in Navarra, Spain. Road between LESAKA AND VERA DE BIDASOA.

Bike a 2007 1200 GSA (2.500 miles...) Bike managed to start all the times... It stopped for 3 times in 12 miles and a forth time in the last 50 miles on my way home in SAN SEBASTIAN. I finally got home...

Took the bike to dealer, stoped just after starting on my way there. They changed the raley and also the EWS (i hope it does not fail...)

Best Regards
Fran

Hi Fran
I'm keeping the list as failures that have happened to UK owners as it has more impact statistically, but many thanks for reporting the failure as it shows it's a worldwide issue.
Tim

 

[CliveS]

In Oz also

Hi
I met another GS rider on the weekend and he was telling me the story about his bike not starting on two occassions. Took it to BMW dealer, twice and eventually they replaced the fuel pump regulator (Controller?) His bike is a October 07 model Milage unknown. Hope this helps

Hi Clive
I'm keeping the list as failures that have happened to UK owners as it has more impact statistically, but many thanks for reporting the failure as it shows it's a worldwide issue.
Tim

 

[bezdik]

R1200GSA 2007

Bike had around 3000km on the clock. Parked it for half an hour after a long ride and it wouldnt start up again. Sent to the dealer(under warranty) and waited two weeks for the fuel pump controller cuz it was out of stock.

Thanks for the information. I won't include your incident in the figures as I am concentrating on UK owner failures, however it shows this is a worldwide issue.

Tim

 

[vmaxoutlaw]

- When did it happen? Sept 6, 2008
- Where were you? Phoenix Arizona on the freeway in traffic
- rider name Jerry Ferguson
- bike details (model and year) 2007 GSA
- remedy It's at the dealer waiting for the controller, which they say is backordered
- How many days work/holiday did you lose? None, fortunately
- Were there any incidental costs? $10 in fuel to take the bike in for repair

Just bought my 07 GSA 3 weeks ago with 2600 miles on the clock. A week after riding it 1700 miles home from purchase the bike started cutting out on the way to a local BMW dealer to meet the folks there, as luck would have it. They couldn't look at it that day (had to ride it back home 20 miles and it died 4 more times on the way in busy freeway traffic) and asked me to make an appt. to bring it back in. They ended up diagnosing the feul pump controller as the culprit and it's been sitting at the dealer for the last week (as I write this) waiting for the part which they say is back ordered. After having reliability issues with my K1200RS it seems that this GS is headed down the same road.

Jerry, I won't include your incident in the figures as I am tracking failures in the British Isles and widening it will screw the statistics, but thank you for reporting the failure. It looks like the shortage of parts is a worldwide issue. Tim

 

[AdamA]

2.15 recovery back to home, having to listen to inane recovery driver sleepduno

The single most annoying thing about being recovered.

 

[POG]

The single most annoying thing about being recovered.

Tell me about it ( no, in fact, please don't )

My brain is still throbbing

 

[AdamA]

Tell me about it ( no, in fact, please don't )

I once had a non English speaking Chinese fella collect me who kept offering me the strangest looking food stuff all the way from Aylesbury to Lowestoft. That was almost as bad as being bored by them.

 

[Westy]

looking to get another GSA in the next couple of months (mine was trouble free for the 18.5K miles I had it) any idea if the new bikes are now 'sorted' or are there stil problems with bikes coming of the production line ?

 

[Tim Cullis]

BMW suggests there are multiple problems behind the number of FPC failures, "not all the failures are of the same nature, unfortunately however, they do involve the same component."

BMW has gone through six or so iterations of the product without finding a permanent solution, does this latest version finally address all the problems? Your guess is as good as mine, only time will tell.

However I think you can assume showroom stock bikes at the moment don't have the latest version of the fuel pump controller

Tim