Surely that should have been back to normal temp during the 12 mile journey due to the airflow it'll get
Thats bloody hot
Big pile of dogshit
- Thread starter Pukmeister
- Start date
Thats bloody hot
I was wondering this as well as all the Noco starter packs I've checked on their website say they're for vehicles equipped with lead acid batteries only. A quick check around the web shows a few articles saying it's not a good idea to jump start a lithium battery as there's potential (ho-ho!) to damage the battery..
As the starter is solidly bolted to the engine block which could reach 80+C then wouldn't the starter stay well above ambient?
Good point
Easy_Rider
Registered user
Is there anywhere on the 1200/1250 that a smaller 12v Li-on battery could be fitted and then run them in parallel ( + to + & - to -) which will still be 12 volts. where you can flick a switch to add the second battery. Could be a good way to start a 1200/1250 with a Li-on battery fitted. just a thought......
No need
As I found out via Pukmeister, Motobatt do a hybrid battery that is lithium and AGM. (£170)
Powersport | Lithium Hybrid AGM Motorcycle Batteries | Motobatt
www.motobatt.us
They have something like 500 cranking amps over twice that of the OEM
Easy_Rider
Registered user
No need
As I found out via Pukmeister, Motobatt do a hybrid battery that is lithium and AGM. (£170)
Powersport | Lithium Hybrid AGM Motorcycle Batteries | Motobatt
They have something like 500 cranking amps over twice that of the OEM
£157.50 from M&P on Ebay.
Does it need a special charger?
Feck me thats more CCA that my 3.0 Scooby battery has
If you read their promotional bumph, it states all the advantages of lead acid such as steady state current drain, ability to trickle charge with a standard charger, delivers power when ambient temps are low. It also has the advantages of lithium for huge current draw when starting big bore/long stroke twins. Both the battery terminals are a copper bus each end for bolting on accessories, a smart design.Does it need a special charger?
Feck me thats more CCA that my 3.0 Scooby battery has
Motorworks sell them for £144.
If I didn't already have an AGM on order I'd be tempted.
I was just comparing it to the Yuasa battery (HP version) I just fitted and its even
14mm lower!!
And 2.3KG lighter!!
despite having almost double the CCA
To all those that have experienced hot start problems; do your bikes always crank over perfectly well on the first start of the day?
I can’t believe this issue is always due to batteries being depleted so much after just one cranking episode that any further start attempts are compromised, unless there is an unusually high percentage of feeble or tired batteries out there all of which are fitted to GS’s.
Even a regular battery in average condition should be able to perform a handful of start attempts even without the benefit of being charged for a few miles afterwards once ridden.
I reckon it’s a starting system with many borderline components all suffering from the ‘Swiss cheese effect’..
I can’t believe this issue is always due to batteries being depleted so much after just one cranking episode that any further start attempts are compromised, unless there is an unusually high percentage of feeble or tired batteries out there all of which are fitted to GS’s.
Even a regular battery in average condition should be able to perform a handful of start attempts even without the benefit of being charged for a few miles afterwards once ridden.
I reckon it’s a starting system with many borderline components all suffering from the ‘Swiss cheese effect’..
No, mine started having problems when only ~ 15 months old. Flat battery, can't cold start. and stupid warnings about the SOS, and other random electrical issues.
Everyone blamed the tracker "they run down the battery sir", well, not according to Datatool they don't.
In the end, I had a new alternator fitted. It was better. I noticed it only had a problem in the winter - two observations, if the weather's crap, I have the heated grips on, and I only ride to and from work - about 5 miles each way.
I gave up the unequal struggle, fitted a socket and use a trickle charger when I leave it in the garage over the weekend. I have had a few warm start issues (at the petrol station on the way home, for example) since, but in general it doesn't fail to start when I'm going to work. I have also fitted a new battery - Tayna, the 240Ah one. Still have issues, but rarely.
I say warm start because it is not a 10-15 mile ride which would get everything up to steady working temperature.
I conclude that the charging system is marginal, and it was simply not making up for the energy used to start, particularly with the extra load from the grips.
Additionally, the battery is too small.
Maybe there are bad/high resistance connections which I have not yet found, which might be making charging and starting less effective than they should be.
And maybe the starter motor and decompressor thing don't work reliably together when the motor is hot.
Mostly it's ok, but it is a ballache when it isn't.
Unfortunately to get any results, ie new starter/ relay / battery, you need to breakdown and have another call out
if you jump it with your Noco, how will you show the dealer you have a problem?
Well, I rode to J&S in Waterlooville after work, the bike got up to 90 degrees. Came out after fifteen minutes shopping, starter motor felt warm rather than hot,bike fired straight up at 12.4v, had a proper blast cross-country to home, gave it a five minute rest, starter was scorching to the touch, bugger fired straight up again, once again at 12.4v
There’s no consistency in the damn thing, it seems to do it on a whim.
I’ve already spoke to the dealers, it’s being checked for hot starting faults when next serviced in June.
If I can find a definitive cause in the meantime I will let folks know as it would seem to be an issue to many.
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There’s no consistency in the damn thing, it seems to do it on a whim.
I’ve already spoke to the dealers, it’s being checked for hot starting faults when next serviced in June.
If I can find a definitive cause in the meantime I will let folks know as it would seem to be an issue to many.
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I would say not,
On my hexhead which exhibited the same problem, i replaced the battery and ran additional cables to the starter to give it as much chance as possible
It made no difference, one maybe two attempts at a start (when hot) and the battery was depleted ( new GS unit)
When i replaced the starter motor, + new cables, it never failed to hot start, i put a Mottobat on as well and it was amazing
On the LC, touch wood my failing to start was anything but battery lol
It failed to start due to not being run in lock down, but a new Mottobat sorted that, and then an oddysey a couple of years later
The TC got a Mottobat, and then a Noco lithium, which was swapped out over winter i may put it back in for the summer
Yes, i don`t think it`s any one particular fault but a combination of minor ones which when aligned in the right (wrong) conditions show a a non-start or sluggish starter operation.
High capacity batteries and jumpstart packs may help but may be disguising the root cause rather than fixing the underlying problem.
Whatever it may be you can bet your life that it is due to BMW cost-cutting and/or a reduction in quality somewhere along the way...
My 2021 1250 always starts first-time in an instant on a cold start and it has never had a battery tender connected (sometimes the bike is not used for a week or three), although it has displayed the sluggish cranking on a few occasions after the engine has stopped unexpectedly/stalling after it`s been running for just a minute or so.
I have had great success in modifying the starter motor on a particular Honda bike which was well known to give very similar sluggish cranking performance on a particular model. I`d love to get my hands on a spare 1250 starter to see if the problem is relatable.
Easy_Rider
Registered user
What i have found with my RT, (new battery fitted by mein January) is on a warm start it sometime does not kick the first time, But the second time it does start. As said this is with a new battery. So how long will it take for the battery not to be up to the full job. The battery i replaced was only 2 years old fitted by BMW Coteworld at its service in September 22
Maybe the system is not upto the full job with all the tech the bike has and extra lights and cameras fitted var a Hex-Can
Maybe the system is not upto the full job with all the tech the bike has and extra lights and cameras fitted var a Hex-Can
On the Advirider thread I mention, on about page 40 (yes, a mere 41 pages so far !), a guy stripped down his starter motor and did tests to find the input terminal to the brushes was grounding out to the casing intermittently (due to the design using an o ring as an insulator).
It’s worth a read.
There is a newer starter motor with an -01 suffix to its part number. I wonder what the difference is ? Buying one fixed his issues.
I have a used -01 version starter motor coming this week from eBay just in case my dealer can’t fix my bike under warranty.
From the Advrider thread, post #793 :
"I've removed the starter, that was a fiddly task
Starter taking 300 amps free spinning!
The stud going into the brush housing was slightly shorting out to the body. It only has a small rubber o ring and sine plastic spacer inside.
Got a new starter off eBay, the bike started straight away, no issues. I had already convinced myself it's starter or maybe compression.
I was ready to look at the decompression valve next, but looks like the starter was my issue."
I suspect that many of us have a similar issue.
I’m puzzled by “slightly shorting”.
It either is or it isn’t making contact.
If it is, it can be making a bad (or high resistance) contact or a good (no or very low resistance) contact.
If it isn’t, then the resistance is very high (megohms for example) but this could be compromised by eg a drop of water causing a track to ground. This could discharge the battery, but slowly, I guess.
You only have to touch a battery to earth with a spanner to see what a starter battery can deliver if it is shorted. Wear safety glasses.
Even a not-very-high resistance contact in the connections between battery and starter motor will seriously deplete the starter power, but the battery voltage will not be abnormal.
It either is or it isn’t making contact.
If it is, it can be making a bad (or high resistance) contact or a good (no or very low resistance) contact.
If it isn’t, then the resistance is very high (megohms for example) but this could be compromised by eg a drop of water causing a track to ground. This could discharge the battery, but slowly, I guess.
You only have to touch a battery to earth with a spanner to see what a starter battery can deliver if it is shorted. Wear safety glasses.
Even a not-very-high resistance contact in the connections between battery and starter motor will seriously deplete the starter power, but the battery voltage will not be abnormal.
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