BMW motorrad connected app and navigation

[mw3230]

Wapping has summed up the issues very well.

I can add a little to the debate in that I've been without my XT for four weeks whilst it was with Garmin for repair. In the mean time I've been using MRA Navigation on my Iphone 13 Pro with a Quadlock anti vibration handlebar mount. It has worked very well both on day ride outs and a week long tour. Indeed, i have wondered if I had the opportunity to accept a refund instead of the replacement XT they have just sent me, what would I do. I would have given it serious consideration ... £320 to spend on something else?, however as with the dedicated satnav, using the the app is not a perfect solution

As well as the 'putting all of your eggs in one basket' situation, a significant drawback with the Iphone option is not being able to operate the screen with gloves on, even if only to zoom in and out which is sometimes very helpful. This proved to be frustrating at times although I accept that as an issue it can be easily overcome (depending on the road) by stopping. Additionally, on a few occasions for some unknown reason my phone opened the camera changing the view from that of the Navigation app to the camera view and again, annoyingly, I was obliged to stop to correct this.. That said, overall the MRA Navigation app is very good and looks to become even better with the roll out of Next

All in all, I am happy to have my satnav back knowing that in the event of it failing I have a very good reserve system with me

 

[BobT]

All I said was that I don’t believe the connected app adds anything the Nav5/6 doesn’t already do perfectly well and that the Ducati system is more than one generation ahead of BMW.

Both of those are views I hold to - and I have yet to hear or see anything that would lead any rational person to a contradictory opinion.

Now I see what your problem is, the first sentence above tells it all. You don't understand that the connected app with the connected cradle replaces what the old nav 5 and 6 used to do. And it does it with an up to date much faster processor, your phone, with little cost when you look at the price of the old technology separate GPS units.
Your phone probably has a much better multi channel GPS chip inside it which can lock onto 20 plus satellites and also those of the various counties, Glonass, Galileo, and the 5 or 6 other systems.

 

[PitaNaanRoti]

Wapping has summed up the issues very well.

I can add a little to the debate in that I've been without my XT for four weeks whilst it was with Garmin for repair. In the mean time I've been using MRA Navigation on my Iphone 13 Pro with a Quadlock anti vibration handlebar mount. It has worked very well both on day ride outs and a week long tour. Indeed, i have wondered if I had the opportunity to accept a refund instead of the replacement XT they have just sent me, what would I do. I would have given it serious consideration ... £320 to spend on something else?, however as with the dedicated satnav, using the the app is not a perfect solution

As well as the 'putting all of your eggs in one basket' situation, a significant drawback with the Iphone option is not being able to operate the screen with gloves on, even if only to zoom in and out which is sometimes very helpful. This proved to be frustrating at times although I accept that as an issue it can be easily overcome (depending on the road) by stopping. Additionally, on a few occasions for some unknown reason my phone opened the camera changing the view from that of the Navigation app to the camera view and again, annoyingly, I was obliged to stop to correct this.. That said, overall the MRA Navigation app is very good and looks to become even better with the roll out of Next

All in all, I am happy to have my satnav back knowing that in the event of it failing I have a very good reserve system with me

You’re using MRA though NOT the Connected App.
Comparing fish and apples.
Oh - change your gloves. I’ve 6-7 pairs that all work with a phone screen.

 

[mw3230]

You’re using MRA though NOT the Connected App.
Comparing fish and apples.
Oh - change your gloves. I’ve 6-7 pairs that all work with a phone screen.

I believe that my comment was relevant given the point made by Wapping regarding the use of dedicated satnavs or phone based systems ... and yes, changing gloves is an option

 

[Wapping]

If only to show how poor the TFT screen is on the GS bikes, this is the screen on Yamaha’s Taycan, which is compatible with Garmin.

 

[Wapping]

Correction Niken GT.

If Yamaha and others can display a reliable GPS map easily, why not BMW?

Create your bespoke route in MyRoute, then send it from your phone via the Garmin link to the screen. It seems ridiculously easy.

 

[BobT]

When did Yamaha bring that TFT out? I'll bet it was much later than BMW brought out the TFT, even a year in electronics makes a huge difference.
I'll rush out and sell my BMW to buy a shit quality Yamaha so that I can ride around looking at the nice screen.

 

[richardbd]

If only to show how poor the TFT screen is on the GS bikes, this is the screen on Yamaha’s Taycan, which is compatible with Garmin.

View attachment 265966

The integrated nav screen on the Multistrada is similar to this but MUCH bigger and a lot clearer. Not Garmin compatible though…

 

[richardbd]

Now I see what your problem is, the first sentence above tells it all. You don't understand that the connected app with the connected cradle replaces what the old nav 5 and 6 used to do. And it does it with an up to date much faster processor, your phone, with little cost when you look at the price of the old technology separate GPS units.
Your phone probably has a much better multi channel GPS chip inside it which can lock onto 20 plus satellites and also those of the various counties, Glonass, Galileo, and the 5 or 6 other systems.

So, let’s try to agree on the second part of the first sentence. The Ducati system IS light years ahead of the current BMW system. I accept that might be just because it is newer.

As to the first part, we will just have to disagree. I completely understand what the connected cradle and app are supposed to do - I’ve set it up and used it. The difference between us is that I don’t see a benefit.

In 15 years of riding with GPS, I have yet to find myself anywhere on the planet where the accuracy of the GPS unit or the speed of its processor have caused me either a problem or a moment’s thought. I have however on more than one occasion been glad that I wasn’t relying on a single device for navigation and/or communication.

When I’m a long way from home I prefer to know I have fail-safe navigation capability (Nav5/6 with phone as a fall back - and yes, I do use and rate Quadlock) and fail-safe comms capability (phone with iPad and inReach as fall-backs). Putting all the eggs into the one phone basket doesn’t appeal to me at all - especially if the phone has to be in full view in a non-secure mount/cradle.

In the car, I use my phone for A to B navigation most of the time. I’m not against the phone navigation tech at all, I just don’t like its vulnerability on the bike. For the odd trip to Tesco, maybe. For long distance travel, definitely not.

Oh - and back to the Ducati’s superiority. Because the phone connects to the bike by Wi-Fi, there is no need for it to be anywhere visible - you can keep it in your pocket. Mind you, not connecting it to the bike does chew the phone battery quickly, so it’s not perfect. Doesn’t matter to me though - I use my Nav5/6 on the Multistrada too

 

[BobT]

In 15 years of riding with GPS, I have yet to find myself anywhere on the planet where the accuracy of the GPS unit or the speed of its processor have caused me either a problem or a moment’s thought. I have however on more than one occasion been glad that I wasn’t relying on a single device for navigation and/or communication.

In that 15 years of riding with GPS, did you ever find that you needed the offroad capability of a GS? Did you ever find that you need all the power that a GS has? Did you ever need the top speed capability that the bike has? Probably not. Perhaps you should look at a Royal Enfield.

 

[richardbd]

In that 15 years of riding with GPS, did you ever find that you needed the offroad capability of a GS? Did you ever find that you need all the power that a GS has? Did you ever need the top speed capability that the bike has? Probably not. Perhaps you should look at a Royal Enfield.

 

[Wapping]

Whilst bikes do evolve, later editions and models being (usually) an improvement on the past, the current GS TFT screen, lags behind the opposition, due to its inability to display a proper, clear coloured map of a GPS route. The very basic ‘arrow’ directions are crude in comparison with the offerings from other manufacturers.

Whether the rest of the bike is better or worse than other models in the BMW range or in comparison with other manufacturer’ bikes, is (as usual) open to debate and some bias (even prejudice) of course. Is my Himalayan ‘better’ than the 1200 and 850 GSA‘s I owned? On some measures yes. It is most certainly much cheaper. it is easier to work on and parts are very much cheaper. Does it have less power? Most definitely. Does it have a TFT screen at all? No. Will it carry a GPS device or phone (if that is the preferred method of navigation) or both? Yes. When out for the day along the D roads of France with a group of mates, will it arrive at the hotel at the near enough the same time as all the rest? Yes.

Is it ‘better; than my 2022 1600? Well, it’s certainly very different, that’s for certain. As neither a GPS device, nor the BMW phone based Connected app functioned at all on my brand new (very expensive) 1600 - due to a TFT screen that leaked EMF’s - then the answer is most definitely yes. Will it go down some goat track better and probably safer than my 1600? Yes. Will it blitz from London to Marseille, in absolute comfort, two up with luggage? No. Will it go, two up, with luggage from London to Marseille? Yes.

 

[Wapping]

In that 15 years of riding with GPS, did you ever find that you needed the offroad capability of a GS? Did you ever find that you need all the power that a GS has? Did you ever need the top speed capability that the bike has? Probably not. Perhaps you should look at a Royal Enfield.

That makes no sense whatsoever, I’m afraid.

 

[Morety]

Personally, I think this is one of those endless circular debates with no right or wrong answer as we each have our preferences.

Many riders don't have the TFT screen so for us mere mortals, the old Nav V/VI units are more than capable of getting us to where we're going and can be programmed with way points leaving our dash free for checking speed and range etc. For those who have TFT's you have options but I would never totally rely on any electronic device and always carry a back up map folded away for route planning and as a back up means of navigation. Old habits die hard. My phone screen isn't any bigger than my dash or nav VI screen and despite modern satellite connectivity benefits of phone chipsets, I've never felt out done using a stand alone GPS and have never got stranded or lost using one nor do I feel left out in any way by what's on offer with the connected app (which I also have).

Each to their own. I like riding with a clutter free screen and my attention is on the road ahead and what's around me. The problem with most TFT screens is they present a host of data which is nice to have but not strictly necessary. They've become over complicated, over cluttered and we're becoming increasingly over-reliant on them. I do think that there's a separate debate to be had about the inmpact on rider safety of having all of this data to distract a rider and hold similar views on phone connectivity and music when riding but that's just my own take. I'm happy with my old hat LCD screen and analogue dial, and using a stand alone Navi unit. Nothing more needed or wanted and am happy with my lot. I don't see it as a topic that needs to raise divisive responses nor one-upmanship.

 

[Wapping]

I think you are confusing is the amount of data and items that can be made available on a TFT screen and what is usually seen at any one time.

Take my 1600 as an example. Rather like your Navigator devices, it has a number of screens you can scroll through, each displaying a number of different functions or information. Do I need to scroll through them on the move? Very rarely. If I do, there is very easy shortcuts and / or I can pre-programme four shortcut buttons, the pushing of any one of which will take me to the screen or function I want to use. For the majority of the time on my bike, the screen shows nothing more than the rev counter, the speed and a very simple route. That is all it shows, all on one screen and it’s all there in front of me.

I might argue that your bike has more ‘going on’ than mine. I would also argued that your Navigator, just as many screens. I certainly know that, as I run my XT on my 1600 as well as the BMW Connected app on the TFT screen, I am more often poking at the XT with my finger, than I am using the integrated whirlywheel to control the map on the TFT screen.

Modern TFT screens are (or at least should be) very good. Do I like using a phone, very capable as it is, as my only tool? No. Do I like my TFT screen, running the BMW Connected app and running my XT (running the same route)? Yes.

 

[Morety]

I'm not really confusing anything. It sounds as if we're both really saying the same thing as you don't play with your TFT once set up the way you have it but others may depending on what they want to be accessed. On the go, I find using the wheel control and Navigator all I need to alter. I don't poke screens nor change the main LCD panel. I can get exactly what I need very quickly.

The main difference, is you can pull up on your tft screen what I can on the Navgator. Each has their pros and cons. I'd set things up just the same if I had the TFT instead of what I have. My main LCD panel is kept as clear and clutter free as possible and the only thing I'd alter if needed are suspension settings depending on road surface but for the most part I leave mine on dynamic (suspension) and the same on the engine management virtually all the time. I like to keep things nice and simple. If I want to alter routing I'll stop and do it by the side of the road or on a break. I find the rev counter on the lcd virtually useless and unnecessary since I rarely take my bike to the red line. All the other important stuff is either left off or dotted around the edges which makes it harder to read on mine, so I have the screen "1" set up with just the simplest of things presented clearly. Miles left in tank, speedo, and a few other bits of info. The rest can be accessed via the wheel control and navi if I need it.

 

[Wapping]

The upshot then is:

Both the TFT (along with its associated phone based navigation) and GPS devices carry a lot of data and screens, accessible or not, depending on what the rider wants to see.

Both have become safer with the introduction of the whirlywheel.

Both systems have their place, favourites and detractors, depending on a number of personal preferences and / or bias.

Both are perfectly safe, providing that the rider does not become distracted. Much the same as riding a bicycle, driving a tank, crossing the road or stepping out of the shower.



What will be interesting, is when the first manufacturer does away with the need for a separate phone and builds the whole navigation system (and more besides) into the bike itself. In a small way it’s easy to see the start of this, with BMW’s SOS system, which has leaked over from the cars.

 

[Morety]

I agree. There's no reason except base cost, not to have integrated GPS systems. The one drawback is it does put all eggs into one basket and if a fault occurs is more likely to result in a new complete console unit than economic repair of outside of software/firmware updates. In some ways I prefer to keep bike systems sperate for that reason alone. One thing I loathe is large touch screens in cars (don't get me started on that one!) or reliance on one screen for all functions if driving. I much prefer analogue dials or at least analogue presented dials for essential information. Another thought is that the advent of HUD in cars to me has been beneficial since my speed and GPS navigation instructions come up on my windscreen without me needing to take my eyes off the road. I wonder if this will ever be viable for touring bikes with screens?

 

[Wapping]

Head up display on motorbike screens is fundamentally different to a car windscreen. In a car, you look through the windscreen. On a motorcycle, most riders look over the screen, rendering it ineffective. Having a form of it, displayed on a helmet visor, would (I guess) be an answer. There are some drop down head up things already (all a bit Star Wars) but I don’t know anyone who has tried the gizmo out yet.

 

[craigholt]

Dense question, but new bike set up intended is the system I prefer - Zumo + iPhone + PackTalk, which I intend to install tomorrow (remove nav prep and wire up etc).

I have the connected app and have paired to the new bike. Not sure why, just part of setting it up I guess?

Will that connection interfere with my preferred set up?

If so, assume deleting the connection will be required? If not, is it of additional use?