Clacks , Crunches, or cant get Neutral

[Deleted account 181015003]

When I test rode the LC yesterday I noticed when I started the bike in gear with the clutch in the I could feel the bike trying to drive forward as the starter turned the engine over once it started it stopped. The gears and clutch were fine on the bike in every other way.

 

[Bails]

When I test rode the LC yesterday I noticed when I started the bike in gear with the clutch in the I could feel the bike trying to drive forward as the starter turned the engine over once it started it stopped. The gears and clutch were fine on the bike in every other way.

You should feel drag if starting in gear ! If you have any understanding of how a wet clutch works you should expect drag ! If you don't understand this then you shouldn't be riding any motorcycle more complicated than a Vespa !

 

[GS_or_bust]

I sent mine back to BMW. the dealer is 170 miles away. They state my bike is just like the 2 new bikes in the showroom.
I will go up there next Tuesday and compare.
A test:
Owners with good gear change do you get the clutch drag like i do in the video?
Owners with bad gear changes do you also have the drag?
I would be interesting to see if there is a trend. I think the clutch drag is the problem.

I get clutch drag on mine and if I put gentle upward pressure on the gear lever in neutral then it sounds the same as your video, but a sharp upward move and it goes into gear as you would expect.

I'm happy with my bike but as I have said before, I don't use neutral so never have to find it or change out of it. So the only thing I would say is the gear changes can be a bit loud.

I'll be interested to hear how your comparison goes.

 

[Deleted account 181015003]

You should feel drag if starting in gear ! If you have any understanding of how a wet clutch works you should expect drag ! If you don't understand this then you shouldn't be riding any motorcycle more complicated than a Vespa !

I know how a wet clutch works and yes some will drag but most you will not notice any drag at all. If they all should drag as you say up to the point of driving the bike forward how would you start a large capacity motocross bike with a kickstart when stuck in the mud if you have done or even watched any motocross racing you will know the riders dont mess about finding neutral they just pull the clutch in and kick the bike off, maybe you should he on the Vespa clutch drag up to the point of driving the bike forward when starting is not normal.

 

[Engineer]

I can feel the clutch drag if I put it into first pull in the clutch lever and start the bike - all wet clutch bikes will drag a bit - mine 'clonks' loudly into first just like so many other wet clutch bikes - because of the clutch drag then one has to tap the lever sharply downwards when going into first and not slowly and gently like the numpty in the video was doing otherwise it will do exactly as he showed - I thought everyone new this!

All other gear selections are fine - again because of wet clutch drag one sometimes has to rotate the gears slightly when selecting neutral, you also had to do something similar to select first gear on the dry clutch bikes because the gears were stationary and the dogs not aligned, this was best done by deliberately generating some clutch drag by partially releasing the clutch as one tapped the lever - I thought that almost everyone knew this too! When I got my fist GS after riding a Ducati Monster for years I had to learn this technique otherwise it was a real bugger to get it into first.

I am sure that there maybe a few real problems out there but I bet 99% of the complaints are just that people are not used to a boxer with a wet clutch.

 

[Jazbee]

I'm picking mine up tomorrow afternoon with a bit of luck, it was only built last week, I'll let you know how it is........ but I may be a while test riding you understand

 

[patzx12]

I can feel the clutch drag if I put it into first pull in the clutch lever and start the bike - all wet clutch bikes will drag a bit - mine 'clonks' loudly into first just like so many other wet clutch bikes - because of the clutch drag then one has to tap the lever sharply downwards when going into first and not slowly and gently like the numpty in the video was doing otherwise it will do exactly as he showed - I thought everyone new this!

All other gear selections are fine - again because of wet clutch drag one sometimes has to rotate the gears slightly when selecting neutral, you also had to do something similar to select first gear on the dry clutch bikes because the gears were stationary and the dogs not aligned, this was best done by deliberately generating some clutch drag by partially releasing the clutch as one tapped the lever - I thought that almost everyone knew this too! When I got my fist GS after riding a Ducati Monster for years I had to learn this technique otherwise it was a real bugger to get it into first.

I am sure that there maybe a few real problems out there but I bet 99% of the complaints are just that people are not used to a boxer with a wet clutch.

I am the numpty, they are my bikes, the 2013 bike gear selection is a horror slow, fast, medium, throttle blip and all other techniques.
I don't really care about all the wet clutch "How it Works" I am trying to get some collective opinions from LC owners before Tuesday when i go to the dealer.
I rode a G650 today the gearbox was totally sweet if fact i didn't give the gear selection a thought just rode the bike.

 

[GC6269]

If you don't understand this then you shouldn't be riding any motorcycle more complicated than a Vespa !

Really? Do you think Marc Marquez knows how a wet clutch works?

Do you know how a TV works? I bet you watch one.

 

[GC6269]

And (mainly because I'm warming to my theme) don't a lot of Vespas now run automatic cluthches which are considerably more complicated?

Don't ask me though, my technical knowledge is basic and that's why I'm such a crap rider.

 

[Engineer]

I am the numpty, they are my bikes, the 2013 bike gear selection is a horror slow, fast, medium, throttle blip and all other techniques.
I don't really care about all the wet clutch "How it Works" I am trying to get some collective opinions from LC owners before Tuesday when i go to the dealer.
I rode a G650 today the gearbox was totally sweet if fact i didn't give the gear selection a thought just rode the bike.

You may have a problem with your gearbox or your expectations are out of kilter, I don't know without riding your bike BUT slowly and gently pressing the gear lever generally ain't the way to select first gear with a wet clutch (or any gear for that matter)

Do the video again and give the lever a short sharp tap instead of slowly and gently - the gear box will clonk into first but there will be none of that rattly nasty stuff going on. Mine is sweet as anything on clutched up changes, I can feel some slight 'feed back' on down changes but really nothing much different from any other bike I have ridden.

 

[red1]

Please find attached sectional images taken above the elbow on Engineers left and right arms.

 

[needlongerlegs]

Please find attached sectional images taken above the elbow on Engineers left and right arms.

LOL.


so so true I wonder how much they pay him...


I'm thinking of giving up motorcycling as I'm stupid too.


So stupid I have none of these issues with the four other wet clutch bikes in the garage cluless Engineers

I know I was one once LOL

 

[alp]

Strange isn't it how people ignore the obvious when they post?
Clearly they should remember that BMW are putting effort/cost into improving this clutch. If it didn't need improving why would they go to this expense?
Of course it needs improving, not only for the crunches etc but just get caught in traffic in Reims or Baden Baden and not be able to move the gear lever out of 1st due to clutch drag and stalling it and not be able to start it again until lt's in N with traffic building up behind you. Not funny, not funny at all. I've never had this in a lifetime of biking.
There are new test parts in the field (ref owners on this forum) and new parts in manufacture (ref BMW Tech at Garmisch), so clearly BMW agrees that it needs improving. Just hope they get it right when the parts come through.
Yours faithfully
C.Eng.M I. Mech E. (i.e. A proper engineer)

 

[telbenj]

At last

Strange isn't it how people ignore the obvious when they post?
Clearly they should remember that BMW are putting effort/cost into improving this clutch. If it didn't need improving why would they go to this expense?
Of course it needs improving, not only for the crunches etc but just get caught in traffic in Reims or Baden Baden and not be able to move the gear lever out of 1st due to clutch drag and stalling it and not be able to start it again until lt's in N with traffic building up behind you. Not funny, not funny at all. I've never had this in a lifetime of biking.
There are new test parts in the field (ref owners on this forum) and new parts in manufacture (ref BMW Tech at Garmisch), so clearly BMW agrees that it needs improving. Just hope they get it right when the parts come through.
Yours faithfully
C.Eng.M I. Mech E. (i.e. A proper engineer)

At last a sensible responce, like I said in an ealier post once the root cause has been found I am sure BMW will be carrying out a recall.
Hopefully sooner rather than later for those that have a problem.

Terry

 

[Emoto]

I hope that if any sort of technical bulletin is sent to dealers about shifting/clutch issues, that we could see a copy of it.

 

[fennel]

I sent mine back to BMW. the dealer is 170 miles away. They state my bike is just like the 2 new bikes in the showroom.
I will go up there next Tuesday and compare.
A test:
Owners with good gear change do you get the clutch drag like i do in the video?
Owners with bad gear changes do you also have the drag?
I would be interesting to see if there is a trend. I think the clutch drag is the problem.
I would love to have a look inside my bike, the first thing i would do is test run the bike with one of the friction plates removed.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/YCmRAiECCGI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mine behaves like yours in the video and it has bad gear changes

 

[Engineer]

Strange isn't it how people ignore the obvious when they post?
Clearly they should remember that BMW are putting effort/cost into improving this clutch. If it didn't need improving why would they go to this expense?
Of course it needs improving, not only for the crunches etc but just get caught in traffic in Reims or Baden Baden and not be able to move the gear lever out of 1st due to clutch drag and stalling it and not be able to start it again until lt's in N with traffic building up behind you. Not funny, not funny at all. I've never had this in a lifetime of biking.
There are new test parts in the field (ref owners on this forum) and new parts in manufacture (ref BMW Tech at Garmisch), so clearly BMW agrees that it needs improving. Just hope they get it right when the parts come through.
Yours faithfully
C.Eng.M I. Mech E. (i.e. A proper engineer)

Why do you say that you can't start the bike in gear when stuck in traffic with a queue building up behind you????? just pull in the clutch! I will be in Reims next week on the bike so I'll let you know if it won't start in gear

I resigned my engineering commision years ago because the institutions had become nothing more than self serving group of old farts sooooooo far out of touch with the modern day it was embarrassing - very few people in Electronics bother with the Institutions these days because they are so out of touch and move more slowly than a crippled snail!. They have been promising to improve the status of Engineers for as long as I can remember and they have achieved precisely nothing in 40 years or more! So forgive me if I don't take much notice of people who put Institution letters after their names.

 

[patzx12]

You may have a problem with your gearbox or your expectations are out of kilter, I don't know without riding your bike BUT slowly and gently pressing the gear lever generally ain't the way to select first gear with a wet clutch (or any gear for that matter)

Do the video again and give the lever a short sharp tap instead of slowly and gently - the gear box will clonk into first but there will be none of that rattly nasty stuff going on. Mine is sweet as anything on clutched up changes, I can feel some slight 'feed back' on down changes but really nothing much different from any other bike I have ridden.

Watch the video the last thing i do is try a rapid engagement of 2nd gear.
A painful experience for me being an engineer.
I still think it is clutch drag, the drag isn't sufficient to propel the bike forward but its sufficient to keep the box out of syncro.
With the clutch pulled in, 2nd gear and engine off its a real effort to turn the rear wheel.
I think the gear selection system is good.
This is typical K bike stuff (the new GS is a 2 cylinder K bike).
All of the K bike transmissions are poor compared to the competition.

 

[jonnyp]

My bikes has been sat for the past 4 weeks as I can't ride right now. I started it for about 2 mins last Monday and that's it.

Today I pushed it out of the garage. In neutral pushes fine, into first with the clutch in, the resistance is there but it still moves. Up on the centre stand, first gear clutch in, it does take a bit to move the rear wheel but it's no more that I expect especially cold..

Off the stand, in first, clutch in, press the button, the bike fires up and pulls forward just a little no more than an inch or to. Then with the engine running it free wheels easy, as easy as in neutral with or with out the engine running.

Engine running and back on the stand, I try the same as you Pat and unless I really, only very lightly push down or lift the lever, it goes through the grears, no problem.

I don't have too let the clutch in and out for the gears to go up or down, I pass neutral and with a light touch get that from first or second with no real problem, and as good as any other bike I've had..

I still have the first grear clunk but that seems to be coming as much from the bevel gear as the box..

Still sad to hear some are having so much trouble and I hope BM come up with a fix for you..

 

[Paul G (BHT)]

.... I still have the first grear clunk but that seems to be coming as much from the bevel gear as the box....

Eh?.... run that one by me again