Fuel / temp gauge issues

[Jiffy176]

Took bike out for a run today and needed to fill up about 7 miles in. So as I am planning a trip next week I brimmed it to as full
As I could get.
When I got back on the bike I find fuel gauge at zero nothing showing and the temp gauge showing 3 bars
Back on the move rid temp wouldn't go over 3 bars and then started to flick to 4
About 20 odd miles later when I got near home note as I accelerate temp returned to normal when off the power rid played up.
When I got home bike on side stand ignition off then on again and it shows temp and fuel correctly when back up on centre stand starts play up again.
Any thoughts why it is effecting the temp gauge too. Worked fine before I filled up and seems to be getting better as I use fuel. I did have the tank pulled back this week to get underneath it. But it worked ok today before adding a lot fuel.
Where is the connector I see talked about on here please
I wonder if the extra weight is enough to throw it over the edge
Jiff

 

[flatdog]

Where is the connector I see talked about on here please
I wonder if the extra weight is enough to throw it over the edge
Jiff

RHS rear of tank by the rear mounting position. If you are rough taking it apart, the female connections can open and make bad contact with the male connectors. Just close them up again using a small flat screwdriver and ensure everything is clean.

 

[slaphead GSER]

Hi Jiff
I have had a very similar problem with mine for this last year. Fill the tank and I have no reading at all on RID and oil temp all over the place, once I have done about 80 miles it all returns to normal. If you find the cure please tell me as I have spent a lot of time trying to sort mine !
Gareth.

 

[Jiffy176]

Right.
Followed Flat dogs instructions, found the plug took apart, all hunky dory?

Plug back in bike upright turn ignition on nothing, do the same on side stand tah dah, full tank of fuel showing, no temp but it's cold now.
Check cables, the electrical one was bent up and lightly cable tied to a fuel line, i guess to stop someone ripping it out in case they forgot to disconnect, That broke with a little wiggling before I got at it with the snips and I have now routed the cable down, success I thought.... maybe. Er no.

Still the same. BTW throughout fuel pump works fine.


I am now wondering is it my RID.
It's knackered. Depending on what time it is depends on how much it wants to tell you. This has never affected bike temp before but does fuel and I loose the bottom half of the time, gear and fuel bars.

What I was wondering is that, and I have no knowledge of how a fuel gauge works over that what I vaguely remember reading somewhere.
If the fuel tank is full and the gauge is reading full then is the voltage? ampage or whatever from the fuel gauge sender stronger or weaker than when it has a little gone?
What I am wondering is, Is the higher or lower voltage coming out of the sender going to the rid enough or not enough to knacker both displays on the rid?

Literally as I nailed the throttle and the fuel went to the back of the tank and the sender down a bit so the temp gauge went up and then down again when i cam off the gas.

I can't see any other way how the electrics in the tank could effect the oil temp pic up. Logic tells me that higher or lower electrical current from the fuel sender is in effect knocking the RID out because is knackered?

Does anyone know where the oil temp pic up is?
Can they explain how one could alter the other before the signal gets to the rid and why it is affected by the fuel level?

I was going to put a new RID on over the winter anyway so it stayed on all the time.

Anyone any thoughts on this, would be greatful.

 

[Jiffy176]

Gareth what have you tried please.
Jiff

 

[Jiffy176]

Anyone explain how the fuel gauge sender works and how it tells the rid to display more or less fuel?
1150 GS 2001
Cheers

 

[MikeO]

Do you have HID lights? I seem to remember someone reporting weirdness with their RID after fitting the ballast nearby...

Mike

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

Anyone explain how the fuel gauge sender works and how it tells the rid to display more or less fuel?
1150 GS 2001
Cheers

The fuel guage sender is a float connected to a potentiometer whose variable output voltage is read by the motronic and converted to a suitable format for the RID to show its display values.

 

[Nick Marshall]

what mike said

Do you have HID lights? I seem to remember someone reporting weirdness with their RID after fitting the ballast nearby...

Mike

had this happen to me, just needed to re-route the HID wires and everything then worked fine.

 

[Jiffy176]

No hids yet

Thanks for the fuel lesson makes me think either a motronic issue. I hope and think unlikely as it works when some fuel has gone. Think I will try a replacement rid and take it from there as that's knackered already.
Anyone got a used but working rid?

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

Hang on...

Wrong spec's on the end of my nose this morning. The Motronic is not involed here so it's either the level sensor, which can be checked with a multimeter, or the RID or the wiring to the RID.

 

[warmshed]

With logic faulting it seems that the varying voltage form one gauge is affecting the other gauge, so the common to each gauge, presumably the earth side, may be high resistant, worth a check on the RID earthing wire, or connection inside the RID where the cables terminate.

I repeat this is just logic faulting , I have no in depth knowledge of the RID.

 

[NeilDD]

IIRC
MattW had something similar, which was traced to the earth connections inside the main loom to the dash.
BWM just crimp all the earth wires together, and this leads to corrosion and broken wires. It maybe necessary to cut back the outer insulation on the loom to trace faults.

HTH
Neil

 

[warmshed]

The crimped earth connections on my 05GSA were found running along the righthand side of the headtock, if you cut the cable ties you will find a dead end, three inch long piece of loom. The crimp connections were in there.

 

[Jiffy176]

Thanks guys some use things to try.

I have a multimeter, purchase last week to do the TPS voltage,
But that is my limit of multimeter knowledge, I know where the RID plugs into the harness and where the fuel level plugs into the harness.
My questions is where do I test and how do i do it, what setting should the meter be on?

I'm still thinking rid as when i adjust the clock some digits displayed in the minutes field cause the time, fuel and gear fields to loose some or half of their bits. Also some lines in the fuel and temp fields stay like halfway between being on and off when the ignition is off. From what's been said I think it might be an earth fault in the rid which is only occurs with the higher voltage to set the top bars?

Anyway any pointers on using a multimeter and which pins to check welcome.
Steve.

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

Try measuring the resistance between Pin 1 (Brown) and Pin 3 (Yellow) with your meter set to ohms (2000 or 20000 or whichever setting allows kilo ohms to be read) and moves the float up & down. You should see the resistance vary with position. If it reads zero or infinity then it is probably broken. This is done on the black connector which is disconnected to to remove your tank.

Now, the Pin 3 mentioned above connects to Pin 8 on your RID through the loom and is yellow with a violet stripe: Check this for continuity using your multimeter.

It would probably help if you had a little read of the manual which hopefully came with your meter, or one their website, to help you with it's operations. If you have a practise it will help your diagnostic skills for the future and give you more confidence when challenging these problems. BE CAREFUL WHEN MEASURING CURRENT and DO NOT try it on your bike or car. I'm sure there's loads of websites showing how to use a multimeter.

A Haynes manual would probably help as well, although it's not perfect.

 

[Jiffy176]

Cheers Ditch.

I know the fuel gauge works as when lent on side stand and before I filled up it all worked fine.
It just seems that when the tank is really full it knocks everything out. What i'm looking for is a bad earth in the rid i think when too much current is sent to it which I am guessing corresponds with full tank.

The multimeter book is pants but thanks for giving me a starting point, will try this and will do some net research.

Cheers.

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

I know the fuel gauge works as when lent on side stand and before I filled up it all worked fine. It just seems that when the tank is really full it knocks everything out.

Okay. We'll accept that for now but may come back to this if you can't find the fault elsewhere.

What i'm looking for is a bad earth in the rid i think when too much current is sent to it which I am guessing corresponds with full tank.

This is assumption, which can be done, but you are indicating a signalling or receiver problem and you mention the fuel guage, which you think is working. It's all the same system and needs treating individually for an accurate diagnosis.

If you think your fault is in the RID then you will need to look inside it and see if there's anything obvious, like corrosion or burning, or components that are deformed due to overheating. BTW, It'll be a voltage that the RID is looking for, to convert for the digital display. Don't worry about the current, let your battery do that.

The multimeter book is pants but thanks for giving me a starting point, will try this and will do some net research.

Cheers.

With more practise you'll be able to power up your RID on the kitchen table and inject a voltage into Pin 8 and check your display. Good Luck.

 

[slaphead GSER]

Hi Jif

To date I have removed the HID's , given the RID a seperate Earth supply and tried my RID on a mates 1150GS ( it worked as it should ). Was going to swap tanks with my mates bike to see if it is the fuel guage thats causing the problems. As I fill the tank every time and hit the trip I have got used to the RID not working and at least I see the correct oil temperature after about 80 miles.

Hope this helps , Gareth

 

[Jiffy176]

Ok.

Tested number pin 1 and 3 but my pin 3 is green.
Is that right, as it showed just 1 ohm?
Fuel/ temp gauge still does the same works on side stand not on centre due to fuel movement.
Jiff