Here we go again - flat battery

[chickenlegs]

Chug click chug
A perennial problem seems to have reared its head again - flat battery even with intermittent charging and I have been left stranded at work on a few occasions. I am not using any additional power drains at the moment (heated grips, lights etc.)
Around two years ago (because of the same problem) I changed the bike's original battery for an Odyssey gel version and all seemed to be working well; quick starts and no charging required through two winters - until now. The likelihood of a dead battery seems to have increased recently and I have now been let down again tonight by the unreliability of the bike.
I would take it to my BMW dealer, but having gone through that scenario before and been told that there is no noticeable problem or short on the bike, it doesn't seem worth it.
Any other ideas?
Chris

 

[Deleted account 210609001]

Bad news. Batteries do have a lifespan, though.

 

[Wapping]

Chug click chug
Around two years ago (because of the same problem) I changed the bike's original battery for an Odyssey gel version and all seemed to be working well; quick starts and no charging required through two winters - until now. The likelihood of a dead battery seems to have increased recently and I have now been let down again tonight by the unreliability of the bike.
I would take it to my BMW dealer, but having gone through that scenario before and been told that there is no noticeable problem or short on the bike, it doesn't seem worth it.
Any other ideas?
Chris

Not much to go on, is there?

Batteries do not last forever, as Robin points out.

Your first battery failed, despite intermittent charging. Your Odyssey battery has apparently failed, despite no charging, over two winters.

Is your bike garaged at night or does it sit outside 24/7/365 in the frozen west of England?

What are your riding patterns? Used every day? Long runs or short hops? Used just on odd occasions on short runs?

Is the alternator / rectifier working properly? BuMW told you it was, I guess? But that was two years ago, on a bike that was then two years old. Your bike is now four years old. Is it still working properly?

Do you have an alarm / immobiliser that is sitting there quietly eating into the battery's reserves of charge?

Is there power in the garage (if you have one) or, if it sits outside, is there anyway you can connect it to a 24/7 maintenance charger like an Optimate?

Start with the simple things first:

You talk about the unreliability of the bike. Are you sure it is the bike? Are you sure it's simply not the batteries dying?

Are you riding the bike reasonably regularly (not balls out, just a decent speed) and long enough to get and keep the battery in tip-top charged condition?

Does it sit outside, in all weathers, having had just a two mile run up the road every third month?

Is it charging properly?

 

[Slowdown]

......intermittent charging......

Bingo! You're starting a 1200cc engine with a battery the size of a matchbox. If you're using the bike for short journeys or leaving it to stand then it really should get charged every night.

You *could* try a de-sulphation program on a decent battery charger - it *might* work.....

But the bottom line is keep the battery fully charged all the time.

 

[John Armstrong]

Bingo! You're starting a 1200cc engine with a battery the size of a matchbox. If you're using the bike for short journeys or leaving it to stand then it really should get charged every night.

You *could* try a de-sulphation program on a decent battery charger - it *might* work.....

But the bottom line is keep the battery fully charged all the time.

Will a de-sulphation work on an odyssey?

I charge the 650 commuter bikes battery once a week even though I shouldn't have a problem as it gets 40 minutes each way each day. Now that it's getting colder the heated grips get more use IIRC a car starting first crank, needs 15 minutes of running to recharge the battery.

 

[ELIMINATOR]

http://www.yuasabatteries.com/pdfs/TechMan.pdf

This may be of use?

 

[Taff]

The battery seems to be spoiling your enjoyment of the bike, so it may be worth getting an Optimate perhaps?

I bought one after I suffered a totally dead 3 yr old battery (the more I think about it, the more I reckon I must have left the parking light on for a week) and it got the bike started within 24 hrs.

Working on the principle that "prevention is better than cure" I now plug it in after every ride just to keep it topped up, and haven't had a problem since. Good piece of kit.

 

[karnevil]

I have my optimate lead permanently hanging out in the back yard.My bike is out side 24/7/365.It gets used most everyday mostly to go to work 3 miles or so and back.Apparently this is not a sufficient distance to replace the charge drawn from the battery.During warmer months it does not seem a problem,but when the temprature drops I just plug the optimate in I even put a BMW origonal equipment socket on the RHS of the cockpit looks nice and I have a direct feed from the battery for accesories into the bargain.I have been off work sick these past two weeks and so because I knew I would not be using the bike I put it on charge.Went to it yesterday started fine.Im still on the first battery bike is just over two years old.I also have a Yamaha FZR600R and i keep that on an optimate too.Its not hard to park up and put it on.If the bike is a long way away from an electrical socket one can even buy extension leads(Chargeing side)for the optimate.

 

[Readz]

I had similar problem with batteries but my journey in a morning is only 10 miles stop start. The battery seemed to go flat remarkably quickly like 2 or 3 days. I have the Odyssey battery and on the recommendation from MotoWorks guys I purchased a C-Tek charger never had a problem since. I have purposely left it off the charger for 3-4 days and so far its always cracked up OK.

Maybe worth an investment, or better still I am sure I say in Bike magazine last month they were offering these chargers free with 12 months subscription.

 

[Wapping]

All the rec's for an Optimate (or a charger) are fine if chummy can run one. What happens if his bike is parked out in the street 24/7/365, possibly yards from his house?

Is he meant to take the battery out each time?

Hence my questions to him.

Let's wait to see what news (if any) he has.

 

[karnevil]

All the rec's for an Optimate (or a charger) are fine if chummy can run one. What happens if his bike is parked out in the street 24/7/365, possibly yards from his house?

Is he meant to take the battery out each time?

Hence my questions to him.

Let's wait to see what news (if any) he has.

Yeah I wondered if the guy was a way away from a mains socket thats why i mentioned the extensions available.I just soldered extra wires to mine
Mind you one would not want to trail wire across a pavement.Maybe investing £20 in one of those carry about charger/starters would be an idea?

 

[chickenlegs]

Flat battery problem

Oh my word what a lot of brilliant replies - thank you all for taking the trouble.

I respond to some as follows:

Batteries do not last forever, as Robin points out.
I would have thought that just under two years is a little poor for a product that has no moving or electronic parts, but I will try and investigate if it is a battery failure. Somehow I doubt it is the as the problem is so intermttent.

Your first battery failed, despite intermittent charging. Your Odyssey battery has apparently failed, despite no charging, over two winters.
I can't be sure that my first battery failed as I swaped it out for the Odyssey after it started to let me down, periodically. After fiting the Odyssey everything was fine again.
Is your bike garaged at night or does it sit outside 24/7/365 in the frozen west of England?
My bike is garaged every night.
What are your riding patterns? Used every day? Long runs or short hops? Used just on odd occasions on short runs?
It is used every week-day for a ten mile commute to and from work in midly heavy traffic. Bristol traffic I guess is like most cities.
Is the alternator / rectifier working properly? BuMW told you it was, I guess? But that was two years ago, on a bike that was then two years old. Your bike is now four years old. Is it still working properly?
Sorry to sound pathetic, but I have no idea how to check if the alternator is working - I don't have any testing equipment.
Do you have an alarm / immobiliser that is sitting there quietly eating into the battery's reserves of charge?
Yes, I have a factory alarm/immoboliser. I also have an intercom + garmin gps but these have not been used for a little while. I put the alarm on whilst the bike is outside at work, but I don't put it on whilst it's in the garage as the garage is alarmed.
Is there power in the garage (if you have one) or, if it sits outside, is there anyway you can connect it to a 24/7 maintenance charger like an Optimate?
I do have power in the garage, right next to the bike, but for a bike of this sort it does seem rediculous to have to charge the battery EVERY time it's parked up. I do appreciate that a lot of 1200 riders do this. What happened, BMW to the go anywhere, do anything bike they promised me?
Start with the simple things first:
You talk about the unreliability of the bike. Are you sure it is the bike? Are you sure it's simply not the batteries dying?
I apologies - the bike, apart from this issue has been extremely reliable.
Are you riding the bike reasonably regularly (not balls out, just a decent speed) and long enough to get and keep the battery in tip-top charged condition?
As already stated - used every week day and somethimes at weekend in my commute to work (all year round). I am a careful rider and understand the consequences of doing low mileage. I appreciate that this might be the problem, but I don't quite understand why this issue is therefore intermittent.
Does it sit outside, in all weathers, having had just a two mile run up the road every third month?
As above
Is it charging properly?
Yes, it has been on charge here at work, all morning and the charger, a C-TEK (as recommened by Odyssey) has done its job - it is now showing fully charged and I'm sure it will be ok for the next few days. However, unless I plug it in every night, I am begining to distrust the battery and its starting capability.

My feeling is, that this is one of those 'difficult-to-put-your-finger-on' type of problems and there is not really going to be an easily idetifiable solution to it, other than to charge the bike up every night and hope for the best (as Taf seems to have to do), or buy another (quite expensive) battery.

My only other thought is that the workshop that fitted new suspension springs to the bike recently, might have dislodged something electical or caused something to short or not put it back correctly. I haven't had a chance to check this yet and will do tomorrow. This does seem very unlikely tho, as they shouldn't have had to disconnect anything major in fitting the new springs but I will check. This work roughly (and not directly), co-incides with the starting-up problem.

Chris

 

[karnevil]

My only other thought is that the workshop that fitted new suspension springs to the bike recently, might have dislodged something electical or caused something to short or not put it back correctly. I haven't had a chance to check this yet and will do tomorrow. This does seem very unlikely tho, as they shouldn't have had to disconnect anything major in fitting the new springs but I will check. This work roughly (and not directly), co-incides with the starting-up problem.

Chris

Hi Chris,There is a good chance the mechanics removed the battery to change your suspension or at the very least disconnected it.Check the terminals are tight.Your commute sounds just about on the limit for getting the charge back into your battery.This may sound back to front but try doing the run with the heated grips on it will prompt the alternator to charge!

 

[SilverFish]

Your commute sounds just about on the limit for getting the charge back into your battery....

Chris also mentioned mildly heavy, stop/go traffic. This might mean that his 10 mile commute each way might involve only short spurts of speed followed by lots of pauses, or sedate riding.

I'm no expert, but I have found that in order to replace the charge lost to cranking each day, I need to average 40mph+ for at least 30 mins...

I think it might be as simple as the alternator not having enough time or surplus watts to charge the battery, in which case, the Ctek is you're best answer for now.

Either that or take the long way round each time

Mike

 

[Wapping]

OK, so now we are getting somewhere.

My suggestions:

You have no idea why your original battery failed. You simply swapped it for an Odyssey and now expect a life time of no problems. It ain’t often that easy. Two years down the line, it too is making a fuss.

Forget any idea about a 1200GS (or just about any motorcycle) as being an automatic get-me-around-the-world vehicle. If you were going around the world – which you are not – a flat battery (and how to deal with it) would be the last of your mechanical, spiritual or electrical worries. Stick it on your battery tender when the bike is in the garage 24/7/365. It won’t break.

On paper at least you are only just riding the bike often enough and far enough for the battery to get a basic charge. If that is the case, it will need the battery tender to help it along.

You can check the alternator is working quite easily.

http://www.expertvillage.com/video/20323_car-battery-change-test-charger.htm

Or take it to a BuMW dealer (who you distrust) or any half competent auto electrical test station (look in Yellow pages). I suspect that it will be fine but if it’s not, you have found the cause.

Check that nothing is draining the battery when the ignition is off. You originally told us that there was nothing extra fitted. If it’s an aftermarket alarm it is probably the work of Satan, the BuMW ones (perhaps) not much better. Did you wire all the other gubbins directly to your battery? If so, just check that nothing is shorting out.

In the end? The battery is probably just stuffed or not getting enough basic charge, expensive Odyssey or not. Easy to remedy. Stick it on the battery tender, when the bike is in your garage.

 

[Mucky Helmet]

It is used every week-day for a ten mile commute to and from work in midly heavy traffic. Bristol traffic I guess is like most cities.

Chris

You do exactly the same mileage as I do (10.4 miles) - I commute in from Nailsea to Bristol City Centre - and I don't have the same issues. Unless of course yours is 10 miles daily total which may explain the lack of juice!

The only flat battery issue I have had is a misbehaving Quest mount connected via the front accessory socket and a software update that allowed the mount to keep the ZFE high, thereby draining the battery overnight! As the weather gets colder, the bike does get "sluggish" on Monday mornings if I don't ride at the weekend. If I know that I'm not going to be riding for a few days, I plug the Optimate in - keeps everything tip top. I have the original BMW battery ('07 12GS)

It wouldn't take long to determine whether your bike is charging properly or whether there is draw on the battery when idle. I have the equipment and garage if you wanted to pop over to Nailsea to check.

PM me for details if this is an option for you.

 

[Wapping]

Chris

You do exactly the same mileage as I do (10.4 miles) - I commute in from Nailsea to Bristol City Centre - and I don't have the same issues. Unless of course yours is 10 miles daily total which may explain the lack of juice!

The only flat battery issue I have had is a misbehaving Quest mount connected via the front accessory socket and a software update that allowed the mount to keep the ZFE high, thereby draining the battery overnight! As the weather gets colder, the bike does get "sluggish" on Monday mornings if I don't ride at the weekend. If I know that I'm not going to be riding for a few days, I plug the Optimate in - keeps everything tip top. I have the original BMW battery ('07 12GS)

It wouldn't take long to determine whether your bike is charging properly or whether there is draw on the battery when idle. I have the equipment and garage if you wanted to pop over to Nailsea to check.

PM me for details if this is an option for you.

A pretty good offer, I would have thought.

 

[teamwimp]

I agree with most of the above.
1. alarms are terribly wastefull of electrical power
2. Optimates (ETC) are excellent and if you attach the fly lead to the battery then not really much hassle
3. Batteries seem designed to fail as soon as they are out of warranty
4. do you have servo brakes - a known electrical glutton in traffic

good luck

 

[[email protected]]

ANYONE

had my GS 3 1/2 weeks(650 miles so far), had to have BMW breakdown out as my bike wouldnt start,It was a flat battery, I took it off the bike ( my garage has no electricty) and I charged it, it started the bike but went flat overnight, it was showing a shelf life of 05/08. Mechanic fitted a new battery and checked the alternator output ,which he said was fine and the bike has been okay for past 3 days.
I ride my bike to work 7 miles mixed open road and city center riding, usually with the heated grips on and I like to blat about when Im off.

I have had every other bike I ve owned on a trickle charger and never had any problems, however the GS wont fit down the side of my house into my nice shed and so is living in a rented council garage( with lots of locks).

The BMW mechanic said I should get a solar powered trickle charger which would be enough to keep the battery topped up, has anyone used one or got one, I see Maplins were doing a 12volt one for £12, does anyone know if this will work, I'd hate to be left with another flat battery, thanks ,also he said it was best to leave the bike with the steering lock on, something to do with the alarm, could someone explain

 

[Slowdown]

The BMW mechanic said I should get a solar powered trickle charger which would be enough to keep the battery topped up, has anyone used one or got one, I see Maplins were doing a 12volt one for £12, does anyone know if this will work, I'd hate to be left with another flat battery, thanks ,also he said it was best to leave the bike with the steering lock on, something to do with the alarm, could someone explain

No idea about the steering lock/alarm, but the solar charger is very recommended!!!