HID for muppets

[Mikefirefighter]

Ok so I thought, get a HID plug it in and job done.

No.

Plugged it in to test it turned the ignition and flash then nothing.
I was thinking the only thing I could have done wrong was wire to two connectors to the original bulb plug the wrong way round.

I put them black from kit to brown on plug
and blue from kit to yellow on plug.

Or its the can-bus says no to HID

Ideas ?

 

[autogs]

yes thats normal,when you start it up all should be well

 

[Mikefirefighter]

Oh dear I am that thick aren't I ?

Thats rhetorical by the way

 

[autogs]

we all have those moments matey,

 

[Mikefirefighter]

At the risk of sounding stupid for the second time.

I connected it up again started it up and I get a 1 second flash then off.
I did this twice got the same thing.

Confused.

 

[autogs]

oh feck,les wassell is your man,look in vendors section and pm him,

even if you dint buy it off him im sure he will help you

 

[scottpa]

My HIDs do the same when turning on the ignition. they don;t fire up until I actually start the bike.Sounds like you might be the same. Try starting the engine and see if that sheds light on the problem!

 

[Mikefirefighter]

Did that and they keep switching off after one second.

 

[Dave The Driver]

we all have those moments matey,

Keys

 

[Doofus]

Hi

I would suspect a duff ballast. I had one do that and a replacement ballast fixed it.

I understand the ballast provides an initial strike voltage to get the cold gas ionised for conduction, and then quickly switches to the lower voltage needed to keep the steady discharge going. I suspect the initial strike voltage part of your ballast works fine (hence the initial flash - both when the ignition is first turned on (i.e. when the ECU tests the lamp), and when the engine first fires up (when the lamp is supposed to start running)), but the part of your ballast that provides the lower voltage for normal use is faulty. However, this is merely conjecture.

When mine failed it would light the bulb for half a second or so, then make a strange buzzing noise for a second or so, and then go quiet - I suspect some safety cut-out kicked in.

Good luck with it, Darren.

 

[(RIP) Arkwright]

At the risk of sounding stupid for the second time.

I connected it up again started it up and I get a 1 second flash then off.
I did this twice got the same thing.

Confused.

I presume yours is specifically for the 1200 otherwise I don't think it would even flash as the canbus wouldn't even attempt to put power to it, they need a ballast resistor in parrallel to fool the canbus into thinking the bulb is OK as there's no circuit through the bulb as such.

Les Wassall is extremely helpful, he and I have had some fun sorting the one for my 80G/S where the was some out of wad wiring but we sorted it!

 

[Doofus]

I presume yours is specifically for the 1200 otherwise I don't think it would even flash as the canbus wouldn't even attempt to put power to it, they need a ballast resistor in parrallel to fool the canbus into thinking the bulb is OK as there's no circuit through the bulb as such.

HID's aren't bike specific in as much as they work from 12v which most bikes have. The HID takes less current than a normal bulb so the CANBUS can sometimes decide the bulb is faulty because it draws less current than expected.

E.g a normal 55w bulb should draw around 4.5 amps in a 12v system. If the bulb is blown it draws 0 amps. The CANBUS therefore measures the current in the initial flash and if it is significantly below 4.5 amps it decides there is a problem and sets the LAMPF warning on the dash.

Some HIDs draw less than the current fault threshold and so these set the LAMPF warning. However, at least on my 2005 R1200GS, there is still 12v supplied to the light so it still works even though the LAMPF is telling you it isn't. I.e. the CANBUS decides the light is faulty and tells you, but doesn't stop sending the power to the light.

You can get rid of the LAMPF if it happens to you (it doesn't happen to me most of the time) by connecting an appropriate resitor in parallel with the HID system (i.e. across the 12v input to the HID ballast). This resistor draws some extra current independently of the HID so the total current through the HID ballast and the resistor is near to 4.5 amps so the CANBUS is happy.

The extra resistor is not acting as a ballast, it is acting as a shunt. All it does is waste electricity to make the LAMPF warning go away. It doesn't change whether or not the HID works (at least on my R1200GS - in principle the CANBUS on another model might be set to not try powering the bulb if there is a LAMPF issue so then there would be a problem).

A simple test for the OP if he is concerned the bike is stopping the lights from working (which I doubt) would be to apply 12v directly from a battery to the HID ballast input and see if the same happens.

regards
Darren

 

[joness7]

Did that and they keep switching off after one second.

I have the same problem.

If I start the bike with a bit of throttle, so the revs jump to about 3000rpm immediately, and I hold it there for about 10 secs, this is enough to fire up my HID.

Once it's nice and bright, I can release the throttle, finish off putting on my gloves and helmet, then get on my way.

 

[joness7]

The extra resistor is not acting as a ballast, it is acting as a shunt. All it does is waste electricity to make the LAMPF warning go away. It doesn't change whether or not the HID works (at least on my R1200GS - in principle the CANBUS on another model might be set to not try powering the bulb if there is a LAMPF issue so then there would be a problem).

Darren

What type and value resistor do you use across your HID? Would be interested in trying this myself.

Thanks
Steve J

 

[joness7]

At the risk of sounding stupid for the second time.

I connected it up again started it up and I get a 1 second flash then off.
I did this twice got the same thing.

Confused.

Forgot to ask - do you actually get the LAMPF error on your dashboard?

 

[SPL]

Mike,

Sounds like you have the Ebay specials (ie cheap) HIDs??

I have used these kits in the past and found that the canbus doesn't like them (especially the slim ballasts).

I suspect it is due to the manufacturing tolerances used by the cheaper suppliers - I had a kit where one ballast would work most of the time (but not always) and the other just wouldn't play at all.

I did a test by sticking them in the car and they both worked fine, so I can only assume the canbus was cutting out because it didn't like the HIDs.

In the end I bought a set from Les Wassal (bit more expensive, but much better quality) and have had no problems since. I wish I'd just gone to him in the 1st place

 

[Mikefirefighter]

Thanks for the reply dazlewis top reply.

Ive seen a product that says it fixes this problem. But just putting in a shunt resistor seems the way to go. I did the same thing when I fitted a LED side light and that worked.

The only difference here is that the computer shuts off the power after one second.

What are the specs for the resistor you would use ?

Oh and I did the test on the HID like you said on a spare 12v battery and both HIDs work fine. I also tried the main beam with HID connected and that worked ok but I dont know if it was generating an error.



And yes it comes up with Lamp error on the dip beam circuit.

I tried the thing with revving it to 3000 RPM but no joy having said that I mite not have revved it for long enough to fully test the theory.

 

[Mikefirefighter]

I know what your saying SLP and your right hands up I did. But then a good 95% of all HID are manufactured in China and then rebranded or repackaged.
Its a good bet that somewere on yours in very small print it says Made in China

 

[autogs]

Keys

you can feck right off muff boy

 

[Doofus]

Darren

What type and value resistor do you use across your HID? Would be interested in trying this myself.

Thanks
Steve J

Hi

I don't use one as mine are fine most of the time (Les's 50W). Once in a while I get the LAMPF but I put that down to fluctuations in the initial test circumstances, e.g. due to temperature and battery voltage variations, meaning the CANBUS test of the current draw falls the wrong side of the LAMPF threshold. E.g. if the battery voltage is on the low side, the HID will draw less current so is more likely to look like a faulty bulb to the CANBUS.

I suspect 35W HIDS might make the LAMPF more likely as they draw less current than the 50W ones I have.

To work out the correct resistor you would need to measure the ballast current during the test flash on ignition turn on so you know how much more current you need to draw to look like a normal 55w bulb. This will be hard to do so I'd suggest you wait for someone who uses one to tell you what works for them. I suspect google would tell you too if you hunt around for a few minutes.

I suspect it would need to be fairly chunky resistor to handle the power (e.g. 10w or so if it was being used to add 1 amp of current draw).

Darren