hilltop remapping etc

[TLSgazza]

After the bears thread where a few of us have shown a desire to maybe get this done I just wondered what exactly they do to warrant the £350.00 or so pounds they charge for this service.
I only ask because I've had my suzuki TL1000S tuned with five or six dyno runs many times over the years, including TPS check, throttle balance etc etc,and only ever paid between 90 and 120 quid for the work carried out.
Now I'm not being a tight arse about this, I would like to do it as it seems most people who have had it done rave about how well their bikes run afterwards so they obviously do something that makes a great difference to the way the bike runs.
My bike is a 2006 gsa, I have a pipercross air filter and have removed the CAT by fitting aftermarket header pipes, standard silencer. (The pipes aren't remus or anything fancy just some cheap ones that were being made and sold on eBay about 6 years ago) bike has done just under 49,000 miles now.
it's due it's 48,000 mile service as well which will cost a fair bit, probably needs valve clearances doing etc which I would guess will need doing before going to hilltop.
So if anyone would like to enlighten me please do.

 

[Beemerman59]

The cost is to cover the thousands of pounds of investment both in hardware and software that allows you to have a perfectly fueled bike that runs as well as its possible to get. Plus Geoffs expertise of course. It will simply make your bike run as good as its going to get, get rid of low speed lurching, mid range fueling holes due to emissions controls that BMW have to follow but Hilltop doesn't. Many people spend thousands on headers, pipes, air filters etc etc and let their bikes run worse than they were before. Not worth £350? Its like going to the gym and trying to work it all out for yourself or hire a personal trainer and get the best you can out of yourself.

 

[Bryn]

Or looking at it another way... the cost of a fancy can on its own

 

[autogs]

350 quid is a lot of dosh,i had mine done recently and watched the whole process,it does not take that long really as some of the time is the new map downloading into the bike,after 90 mins or so im on my way as i pulled onto the main road from jeffs the bike had changed for the better.the low speed pull away was very smooth as if the 2 cylinders were working togerther instead of having a barney about it.at the other end there is much smoothness and urge,its worth every penny imo.

 

[Bounce]

Had mine done in summer 2014; a worthwhile investment IMHO....am delighted with the result......

 

[Haggler]

Had mine done 18 mths ago, felt imeadiately smoother. Toured Norway Sweden and back through europe last year fully loaded and two up no horses spared and averaged 54 to gallon so for me it was money well spent

 

[Sgt Bilco]

The Hilltop remap is great as is a PC111 on the engine. Both do the same job. You will be paying Hilltop for his expertise, equipment facilities etc etc and whether you feel the £350 is good value is up to you. The power commander is the cheaper way of coming up with the same results

How about another way before you invest in Hilltop or a PC111?. I don't know where you have your bike serviced but I would take it to Mikeyboy (or any other good independent) who is fairly close to you for it's 48k service. He will set it up perfectly and will spend the time tweaking the bike until it's about perfect. I'm not knocking dealers here but they simply don't have the time to do the small things that make a difference.

Mike did my bike last year at 100,000 miles and I have to say it had never felt better. You may feel that it may be enough of an improvement and then you won't need a remap.

 

[Pukmeister]

It's what the market will pay.

He charges what he likes, you either pay the going rate and get his product/service, or you don't. He does discounts for groups as he can batch process them one after the other. Simples.

 

[TLSgazza]

I understand what you are all saying but I guess I was just comparing it to what I normally pay for my tls,
That included quite a few flashes with different settings on a yoshbox before each dunno run,
The guy at road and track in Aylesbury ( not there anymore unfortunately) really knew his stuff and even spent about 3 hours the first time I went there for just 95 quid.

The Hilltop remap is great as is a PC111 on the engine. Both do the same job. You will be paying Hilltop for his expertise, equipment facilities etc etc and whether you feel the £350 is good value is up to you. The power commander is the cheaper way of coming up with the same results

How about another way before you invest in Hilltop or a PC111?. I don't know where you have your bike serviced but I would take it to Mikeyboy (or any other good independent) who is fairly close to you for it's 48k service. He will set it up perfectly and will spend the time tweaking the bike until it's about perfect. I'm not knocking dealers here but they simply don't have the time to do the small things that make a difference.

Mike did my bike last year at 100,000 miles and I have to say it had never felt better. You may feel that it may be enough of an improvement and then you won't need a remap.

I may well send mikeyboy a pm about my service, no longer paying for the extended warranty so makes sense really to go elsewhere, had a few iffy services from my dealer anyway, thanks for the info guys, most helpful.

 

[Delboy777]

Since Hilltop are so far away from me and i have a Dynojet approved centre just 40 miles from me a PC is a no brainer for me. Plus if i ever sell the bike (which i wont ) i could recoup most of the cost of the PC minus the cost of the Dyno setup which i think is £120. So PC it is, but which one ? 111 or V im not sure there would be much difference as i dont want to feck about with the map once its fitted.

 

[Deleted account 200502001]

As Sgt bildo says, whilst I'm considering a remap I'm first arranging for Mikeyboy to wave his magic wand over it, so at least I know the bike is set up correctly etc.

 

[Bryn]

Another recommendation for Mikeyboy.... I've had him service my 09, and it's had a remap... so best of both worlds

 

[Mistacat]

I just wish someone would explain to me how a base map reconfiguration can override the output control of the lambda sensors???.
Under normal riding I am in closed loop for around 80% of the time. (Under the control of the lambda sensors).

 

[Rocketman]

After deciding to keep my bike for another year I will be booking mine in with Geoff
This week ,I'm hoping it might sort out an intermediate stalling on downshift problem I've had since the weather got cooler.
£350 is lot of money but I covered 9k miles last year and I'm hoping to do
More this year so I should get my money s worth ......gav...

 

[stever1]

Tell me more about mikeyboy pls

 

[Delboy777]

I just wish someone would explain to me how a base map reconfiguration can override the output control of the lambda sensors???.
Under normal riding I am in closed loop for around 80% of the time. (Under the control of the lambda sensors).

Not sure about the Hilltop remap, but when fitting a PC the sensors are removed and the holes blanked off.

 

[ossa eck]

In closed loop the fuelling is corrected using info from the lambda sensors, the lambda sensors are an input not an output of the ecu.
The base map can still be too weak or rich and be in closed loop.

 

[Bounce]

Tell me more about mikeyboy pls

All round good bloke & top independent mechanic; based nr Melton Mowbray....his forum name......by strange coincidence....is mikeyboy, so drop him a PM with all your reqts.

Plenty of the forum members use him & have been delighted with the service......

 

[Mistacat]

If the lambda sensors are an input to the ECU sampling and correcting the output Air fuel ratio, then how can the engine run leaner or richer than the 14.7 to 1 ratio in closed loop.
I agree that the base map can still be too lean but this will be corrected by the lambda sensor.
The lambda sensors are disconnected when using a PCV as the PCV Injector pulse width modifications entered in the PCV would be over ridden by the lambda sensor.
As I understand it in closed loop the lambda sensor samples the output AFR and sends the info to the ECU to correct it ?

In closed loop the fuelling is corrected using info from the lambda sensors, the lambda sensors are an input not an output of the ecu.
The base map can still be too weak or rich and be in closed loop.

 

[(RIP) Miff]

If the lambda sensors are an input to the ECU sampling and correcting the output Air fuel ratio, then how can the engine run leaner or richer than the 14.7 to 1 ratio in closed loop.
I agree that the base map can still be too lean but this will be corrected by the lambda sensor.
The lambda sensors are disconnected when using a PCV as the PCV Injector pulse width modifications entered in the PCV would be over ridden by the lambda sensor.
As I understand it in closed loop the lambda sensor samples the output AFR and sends the info to the ECU to correct it ?

If they did that then the bikes wouldn't run dangerously lean.