Mine just broke down...

[Deleted account 190920001]

Any of the Japanese bikes could suffer the same fate. They all have an integrated gearbox (including the S10) so if the chain snapped there is a chance the chain could end up in the gears. The real issue here is the chain snapping in the first place. I imagine the chain snapping mid corner would have a good chance of having you off even if it didn't get in the gears. Sudden loss of power and the valves getting smashed with the pistons could do that on its own.

 

[Packer]

I imagine the chain snapping mid corner would have a good chance of having you off even if it didn't get in the gears. Sudden loss of power and the valves getting smashed with the pistons could do that on its own.

You may have a fighting chance if the gearbox is undamaged and you can pull the clutch lever fast enough. If the whole lot is jammed by broken chain then no hope. It sound from the OP as though the chain can drop straight onto the gear cluster in the WC unit. Having seen a photo of the S10 power unit castings that looks most unlikely to happen, separate compartments only linked for oil circulation.

 

[Packer]

What a bunch of girly worriers! there are numerous things that can go wrong in a motorcycle engine to cause it to lock up - if you are really worried about this stuff then you really shouldn't be riding one. Comparisons with the Yamaha S10 are just plain silly, the GS WC has sold in huge numbers whereas Yamaha have sold about three S10s so if they do have problems it is going to take years for them to come to the fore, by which time everyone will have moved on to newer and better bikes.

It is a really big worry, so much so that I ride like a frightened girlie girl, buy the most reliable bike in its class and never exceed 30mph except on the motorway where I'll sometimes get up to 48mph if a passing truck pulls me into its slipstream.

You are also right that comparisons between the GS WC and the S10 are silly, the WC was designed and built to appeal to journalists who will rant about the great performance and cause hoards of easily influenced buyers to rush out and commit to the brand whilst the S10 was built to be reliable and durable. Yamaha may also have sold over 4 so stop demeaning my chosen product. 3 bikes indeed, hah. In fact the very properties that made me buy a very late model 1150 instead of waiting two months for the new 1200GS are the same that are possessed by the Yam S10.

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

To be fair when was the last time anybody here heard of a camchain snapping in a motorcycle (apart from this case)? The only one I've ever heard of was my own XS750 back in the late 80's and that was my fault.

So, unless we start seeing this happening on WC's on a regular basis I'd suggest it's not something worth worrying about. Fingers crossed you get it sorted to your satisfaction Beaky.

Andres

 

[Engineer]

To be fair when was the last time anybody here heard of a camchain snapping in a motorcycle (apart from this case)? The only one I've ever heard of was my own XS750 back in the late 80's and that was my fault.

So, unless we start seeing this happening on WC's on a regular basis I'd suggest it's not something worth worrying about. Fingers crossed you get it sorted to your satisfaction Beaky.

Andres

How did you snap it? over rev/lack of oil/poorly adjusted?

 

[Engineer]

It was noticeable that there were more BMW K75C's, on the Tour de France this weekend, than newer BMW's of any sort

Just sayin'......................

Newer and revolutionary design isn't always better in the longterm (cue....................Servo ABS, as just one example)

They use K75s because they need something soft and girly smooth and has a top speed of 40mph - anything else would be too scary for the old codgers.

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

How did you snap it? over rev/lack of oil/poorly adjusted?

Crap re-rivetting/peening when I fitted a new chain so, strictly speaking not really a camchain failure more just crap ability on my behalf back in the day......................

Andres

 

[Deleted account 190920001]

You may have a fighting chance if the gearbox is undamaged and you can pull the clutch lever fast enough. If the whole lot is jammed by broken chain then no hope. It sound from the OP as though the chain can drop straight onto the gear cluster in the WC unit. Having seen a photo of the S10 power unit castings that looks most unlikely to happen, separate compartments only linked for oil circulation.

I actually have no idea how the chain could get in the gears of the WC engine. The gearbox is still separate on the back of the crankcase except its a type of cassette now instead of a completely separate unit. Only thing I can think of it that it foweled the mainshaft between the front clutch and gearbox input.

 

[APE]

...the WC was designed and built to appeal to journalists who will rant about the great performance and cause hoards of easily influenced buyers to rush out and commit to the brand whilst the S10 was built to be reliable and durable. Yamaha may also have sold over 4 so stop demeaning my chosen product.

Maybe you should re-read some of your own posts and practice what you preach .....

 

[Deleted account 190920001]

Here is a better picture:

No idea how the chains could get in there.

 

[Melch]

Crap re-rivetting/peening when I fitted a new chain so, strictly speaking not really a camchain failure more just crap ability on my behalf back in the day......................

Andres

You weren't familiar with (Tony) Galea Camchains then back in the day round our old stomping ground?

 

[Engineer]

I actually have no idea how the chain could get in the gears of the WC engine. The gearbox is still separate on the back of the crankcase except its a type of cassette now instead of a completely separate unit. Only thing I can think of it that it foweled the mainshaft between the front clutch and gearbox input.

Doesn't the shaft from the clutch to the gearbox run concentrically inside the shaft from the crank to the clutch?

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

You weren't familiar with (Tony) Galea Camchains then back in the day round our old stomping ground?

There's a blast from the past! Yes, I remember his outfit well.

I didn't have the money back then and the street was my workshop; engine out, top end rebuild and all back together in one day. The bike almost got me to the festi I was off to the next day

More haste, less speed..........

Andres

Edit: Just did a Google and blow me if he isn't still trading

 

[Melch]

There's a blast from the past! Yes, I remember his outfit well.

I didn't have the money back then and the street was my workshop; engine out, top end rebuild and all back together in one day. The bike almost got me to the festi I was off to the next day

More haste, less speed..........

Andres

Edit: Just did a Google and blow me if he isn't still trading

That's exactly what I did after I thought of him. If you look a bit further it seems he went bankrupt in 2013. I'm surprised he lasted so long to be honest if he was mostly still doing cam chains.

 

[stolzy]

They have ordered a new engine, and want to fix it, I have said that I'm not too happy about having a second hand brand new bike. Dick Lovatt have said that I need to talk to customer services, as they are only allowed to do what BMW head office say.

Which is complete bollox. There is consumer legislation that gives you specific rights. The dealer's relationship with BMW is irrelevant and not your concern. They (the dealer) are required (among other things) to provide you with goods that are fit for purpose and of merchantable quality.

I would have thought that an almost new motor vehicle that fails in a manner that could cause a fatality might fall foul of one or both of those criteria.

 

[Packer]

I actually have no idea how the chain could get in the gears of the WC engine. The gearbox is still separate on the back of the crankcase except its a type of cassette now instead of a completely separate unit. Only thing I can think of it that it foweled the mainshaft between the front clutch and gearbox input.

It looks as though the right side cam drive comes straight off a shaft within the gearbox, the back wall of the crankcase actually carries the front bearings and is the front wall of the gearbox. You can see exactly what could go wrong.

APE, I'll try to remember to insert a smiley face when I'm having a laugh

 

[APE]

APE, I'll try to remember to insert a smiley face when I'm having a laugh

Fair enough and I dont like the toilet much either Shame they've moved away from the original G/S concept - thinking RT next

 

[Engineer]

It looks as though the right side cam drive comes straight off a shaft within the gearbox, the back wall of the crankcase actually carries the front bearings and is the front wall of the gearbox. You can see exactly what could go wrong.

APE, I'll try to remember to insert a smiley face when I'm having a laugh

I think that you have misread the picture - I did this first time too, the cam chain is actually the other side of the 'wall' take another look.

 

[Packer]

I think that you have misread the picture - I did this first time too, the cam chain is actually the other side of the 'wall' take another look.

I don't think I have. If you look at post 50 you can see how recessed the back wall of the crank case is from the mating face for the gearbox. The larger hole towards the top is clearly for the crank main bearing and I would suggest that the large radius on the face at the top is to allow the large spoked gear shown in the engine cutaway to be fitted to the end of the crankshaft. The various other recesses in the crankcase wall are for the gearbox bearings. That means that all of the chains are actually in the gearbox aperture and not the crankcase. I think that they run through tunnels the left of which is in the shadow at top left of the mating face in the post 50 image.

With cam chain failure apparently such a rare event this was probably considered acceptable but clearly if a chain does fail it is likely to jam the gearbox as appears to be the case in the op.

 

[Engineer]

I don't think I have. If you look at post 50 you can see how recessed the back wall of the crank case is from the mating face for the gearbox. The larger hole towards the top is clearly for the crank main bearing and I would suggest that the large radius on the face at the top is to allow the large spoked gear shown in the engine cutaway to be fitted to the end of the crankshaft. The various other recesses in the crankcase wall are for the gearbox bearings. That means that all of the chains are actually in the gearbox aperture and not the crankcase. I think that they run through tunnels the left of which is in the shadow at top left of the mating face in the post 50 image.

With cam chain failure apparently such a rare event this was probably considered acceptable but clearly if a chain does fail it is likely to jam the gearbox as appears to be the case in the op.

I just took another look and I think that you are right - hmmmmm would not appear to be the best idea with hindsight - I like to see a real dismantled engine or the workshop manual just to be 100%.