Poor braking - service or replace?

[Jurassic Mark]

Hi,
The brakes on my 1997 1100GS (ABS) are getting worse, lacking bite. They feel quite spongy, they haven't been great since I've had the bike (2 years). Pulling the lever harder for less effect, however it has recently passed it's MOT without any braking issues being highlighted. Not sure I could brake hard enough for the ABS to kick in although maybe I'm just lacking in motivation when the needs not there! My question is would a brake service improve this issue sufficiently or would new stainless braided hoses make a marked improvement. As far as I know the hoses are still the original ones so getting on a bit. I've had a look and a new set of Goodridge hoses is about £120.
Anyone else found themselves in this position and fitted new hoses, if so was there a marked improvement in braking? Mr Steptoe will be doing the work so a good job is assured!

 

[stuart kerr]

Steptoe serviced my bike last year and is a top bloke, I'd ask him to service the brakes and he'll know what's best. Just a full brake service may prove the bike .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jurassic Mark]

Cheers Stuart,
I'm sure Steptoe will know what's best. To be honest after almost 18 years of service I'm sure the hoses need changing but having never done it before I was interested if it makes a difference.
I'll probably do it anyway as am concerned one of the old hoses may fail, no doubt at a time when I need it most!

 

[The Grey One]

Cheers Stuart,
I'm sure Steptoe will know what's best. To be honest after almost 18 years of service I'm sure the hoses need changing but having never done it before I was interested if it makes a difference.
I'll probably do it anyway as am concerned one of the old hoses may fail, no doubt at a time when I need it most!

18 year old brake hoses are an accident waiting to happen. Personally I am glad that you are riding roads 1,000 miles away from the ones I ride!

John

 

[cartejo5]

Stainless hoses and fresh fluid made a big difference on my bike.

I'm guessing you've not heard of the numerous cases of the hoses splitting on this model, personally I would be changing them ASAP.

 

[uncle dick]

Stainless hoses and fresh fluid made a big difference on my bike.

I'm guessing you've not heard of the numerous cases of the hoses splitting on this model, personally I would be changing them ASAP.

The OP is lacking friction, hydraulic improvements won't change that.

 

[Dragon Master]

The OP is lacking friction, hydraulic improvements won't change that.

If you have air in the system, you can't get friction because you can't get the pressure on the pads 'cos the air is being compressed.

Old rubber hoses can become weak and expand under pressure, taking the pressure from the pads.

Of course improvment to the hydraulics can improve friction...

 

[uncle dick]

If you have air in the system, you can't get friction because you can't get the pressure on the pads 'cos the air is being compressed.

Old rubber hoses can become weak and expand under pressure, taking the pressure from the pads.

Of course improvment to the hydraulics can improve friction...

Only if you reach the end of the travel in the master cylinder - which wasn't evident from the OP's comments. He said he pulled harder to less effect, not that travel had increased.

 

[Dragon Master]

Only if you reach the end of the travel in the master cylinder - which wasn't evident from the OP's comments. He said he pulled harder to less effect, not that travel had increased.

Hmm.. OK, I can go with the way you read it, but he did say it feels 'quite spongy'. And it would still be a good idea to replace 18 year-old rubber hoses...

"He pulled harder with less effect"... sounds like he's got FJ1200 brakes fitted...

 

[Jurassic Mark]

Thanks for all the advice. Feel a bit stupid really. Bad brakes - service them and replace old parts = better braking. Not rocket science I guess!!!
I don't know how old the hoses are as I have only had the old girl for two years but I shouldn't take risks.
To clarify I don't run out of brake lever travel just not much power in the brakes and a spongy feel at the lever(no 'feel'). They've never been great, I came from a 660Z tenere which had simply awesome stoppers to a teenage bike with much weaker anchors. But they do seem to be getting worse or in my aging mind I'm becoming much more aware of my mortality! Off to Steptoe for new hoses and fluids etc.
Cheers for all the comments.
Mark

 

[Dragon Master]

Good luck with getting it sorted, Mark.

If I might just continue, with a slight hi-jack, just to add something regarding what 'Uncle Dick' said...

I mentioned FJ1200 brakes. The front brakes on these are notorious for their lack of 'feel'. Even with the much improved (over original) R1 'Blue-spot' calipers fitted, they are still very 'wooden'. Pull as hard as you like, the lever doesn't go back much, and it takes a long time for anything to happen after the initial bite.

The most popular way to 'fix' this is to fit the master cylinder off a Kawasaki ZZR1100. Apparently the angle between the lever and piston is much more favourable than that on the original Yamaha M/C, thus improving the hydraulic action, and making the brakes work as they should.

Mine currently has plenty of feel, even with the original M/C. But that's down to a 1mm warp on one of the discs. Makes it feel like the ABS is working all the time.

But it doesn't have ABS.

OK, end of Hi-jack.

 

[Jurassic Mark]

Good luck with getting it sorted, Mark.

If I might just continue, with a slight hi-jack, just to add something regarding what 'Uncle Dick' said...

I mentioned FJ1200 brakes. The front brakes on these are notorious for their lack of 'feel'. Even with the much improved (over original) R1 'Blue-spot' calipers fitted, they are still very 'wooden'. Pull as hard as you like, the lever doesn't go back much, and it takes a long time for anything to happen after the initial bite.

The most popular way to 'fix' this is to fit the master cylinder off a Kawasaki ZZR1100. Apparently the angle between the lever and piston is much more favourable than that on the original Yamaha M/C, thus improving the hydraulic action, and making the brakes work as they should.

Mine currently has plenty of feel, even with the original M/C. But that's down to a 1mm warp on one of the discs. Makes it feel like the ABS is working all the time.

But it doesn't have ABS.

OK, end of Hi-jack.

Hi-jack away, it doesn't bother me and this is an open forum for folk to discuss their bikes. It's been a very long time since I've ridden a FJ1200, I'd only just passed my test and remember it being shocked at the power and speed. The biggest big I had ridden before that was a KLE 500, a purple and pink one at that, which I suspect was the slowest colour!

 

[Colban]

You should have Brembo calipers on the bike.I had a similar problem to you;down to sticking pistons in the calipers.
New brake lines and a good service required;dont skimp on brakes.

 

[Peter]

I have a 1995 R1100RS with 81k miles on it. At approximately 50K I changed the original hoses to braided hoses from "Hell". That together with new fluid vastly improved the overall braking. One huge advantages was that the brass "T" junction under the front mudguard has iron fixtures from 3 brake pipes joining it. These were badly corroded and because of there in accessibility they were never checked at an MOT.
I also find that a yearly brake fluid change make a positive improvement to the feel of the front brake. Incidentally "Hell" were most helpful in copying my original hoses. They were quick and when they got one with an incorrect bend angle they replaced they expressed a replacement. Great company to phone.

 

[TIV]

Good luck with getting it sorted, Mark.
If I might just continue, with a slight hi-jack, just to add something regarding what 'Uncle Dick' said...
I mentioned FJ1200 brakes. The front brakes on these are notorious for their lack of 'feel'. Even with the much improved (over original) R1 'Blue-spot' calipers fitted, they are still very 'wooden'. Pull as hard as you like, the lever doesn't go back much, and it takes a long time for anything to happen after the initial bite.
The most popular way to 'fix' this is to fit the master cylinder off a Kawasaki ZZR1100. Apparently the angle between the lever and piston is much more favourable than that on the original Yamaha M/C, thus improving the hydraulic action, and making the brakes work as they should.
Mine currently has plenty of feel, even with the original M/C. But that's down to a 1mm warp on one of the discs. Makes it feel like the ABS is working all the time.
But it doesn't have ABS.
OK, end of Hi-jack.

Mine has master cylinder off a Kawasaki ZZR1100 and ABS and it works great. One day I will change all the hoses with Hell. Could be expensive though because of the ABS.
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/364165-FJ1200?p=3926009#post3926009

 

[Old Codger]

Stainless

The way to go ,made one hell of a difference on my 1100

Was lucky had a ballooned hose and a lucky escape.

 

[Jurassic Mark]

New stainless hoses fitted all round by Steptoe. Brakes are working well, definite improvement. Of course I now have a weeping master brake cylinder so am hoping the Jedi Master will fix that for me next.