R1200GSA upgrade to Ohlins or Wlbers ESA

[stick]

Yep, 90kg with all riding gear on.

How he explained it to me is this.

Imagine a length of pole. Your suspension range is the full length of that pole.

As you wind up the preload, you're reducing that pole length, so now you have less travel to play with.... and much more force is needed to get the spring working.

This done unnecessarily, is just reducing your shock range. At 90kg you need about 30% sag.... and he measured that at ZERO preload. (If you wind up your preload you may only have 20% or 15% sag, which means your rebound has less range when it needs to extend the suspension) Less range = less traction.

Correct 30% sag means your shock is now working at full stroke range for your weight, and then compression and rebound can be adjusted.

He said Rebound is linked to Sag. So that should stay at his settings.

He said Compression can now be adjusted by me for Hard or Soft preferences, as I see fit....

I adjusted my front forks as they were two clicks too hard. Now its balanced over fast bumps in turns.

If you copy my settings it will feel weird at first, because your changing the geometry of the bike. But stick with it and adapt to the new settings, and see if it makes the bike better? Let me know.

Not to question too much , but sag is measured in mm not % , the spring needs an initial preload to allow the static sag , then you add rider sag etc etc and this will lead to the correct spring rate / strength.
For example my KTM free ride has a spring length of 210mm but requires to be fitted to the shock at 200mm , thus the pre load from the manufacturer , then you can fiddle a bit more with this , but 0 pre load makes me wonder you may have a stiff spring and may need to reduce it.
Compression sets the rate at which the shock / forks compress ie lots of compression a stiffer fork , the rebound controls the rate at which the spring returns to its original position , low rebound a faster return , high rebound the slower it returns.

 

[Warlord]

Not to question too much , but sag is measured in mm not %

Well yes it is measured in mm.... but the target rear shock sag (with rider on bike) is 30% of total shock range.

He said the front target shock sag (with rider on bike) can be around 40-45% of total shock range.

That's how it works.

 

[stick]

Cool its just unusual to have 0 pre load on a shock.
The confusion can be rider sag or static sag.
Dawned on me know your on about the adjuster wheel on the frame you have , not the actual spring pre set pre load … Saturday hey
Im spoilt with the tractive system

 

[Warlord]

Cool its just unusual to have 0 pre load on a shock.
The confusion can be rider sag or static sag.

Well it is unusual, because my shocks have been specifically built for my weight.

So Ohlins built the spring loading to my bike and weight.

The Pro-Tuner said they were set up from factory as perfect front and rear with no-preload.

This gave ideal static sag, and ideal rider sag. No further adjustment necessary, except to set up rebound and compression.

 

[Warlord]

Dawned on me know your on about the adjuster wheel on the frame you have , not the actual spring pre set pre load … Saturday hey
Im spoilt with the tractive system

Spring pre-set was done at factory.

I'm glad I went to the pro-tuner as he's straightened it all out for me and it has made a positive difference.

I now have a fighting chance to make adjustments for my personal preferences without going astray to far.

Not that it was THAT far out in the first place.

 

[Warlord]

Im spoilt with the tractive system

Well yes, I suppose you are having spent an extra £1000 over what I spent.

But it wasn't without it's problems either was it? If I remember correctly, it shit the bed right at the start, so was no smoother setting it up.

At least mine worked first time

Haha

 

[Rockred]

Its good to hear the settings are in a good place now,
compression damping at around 14 click out shouldnt need any tweaking,
if you're curious try a couple of extra clicks out / softer on rebound and see how it feels,
the ttx can be run much softer and maintain control ,
if it gets too soft you will feel the rear getting floaty and fast turn in a little less stable ,
just go back a click at a time until its to your liking,
The ohlins adjustment is linear and 1 click can make a noticeable difference,

Thanks Roamer, they’re working fine but every now and again I get the urge to tinker. They are seeing a lot of the mountains between Cadiz province and Malaga province. Very happy with them....

 

[Rockred]

Yep, 90kg with all riding gear on.

How he explained it to me is this.

Imagine a length of pole. Your suspension range is the full length of that pole.

As you wind up the preload, you're reducing that pole length, so now you have less travel to play with.... and much more force is needed to get the spring working.

This done unnecessarily, is just reducing your shock range. At 90kg you need about 30% sag.... and he measured that at ZERO preload. (If you wind up your preload you may only have 20% or 15% sag, which means your rebound has less range when it needs to extend the suspension) Less range = less traction.

Correct 30% sag means your shock is now working at full stroke range for your weight, and then compression and rebound can be adjusted.

He said Rebound is linked to Sag. So that should stay at his settings.

He said Compression can now be adjusted by me for Hard or Soft preferences, as I see fit....

I adjusted my front forks as they were two clicks too hard. Now its balanced over fast bumps in turns.

If you copy my settings it will feel weird at first, because your changing the geometry of the bike. But stick with it and adapt to the new settings, and see if it makes the bike better? Let me know.

Thanks Warlord for taking the time to reply. I will have a little play, and going on what you and Roamer ( who I bought the Ohlins from) have said, and report back when I can get out again, probably mid week. Thanks to you both.

 

[Warlord]

Thanks Warlord for taking the time to reply. I will have a little play, and going on what you and Roamer ( who I bought the Ohlins from) have said, and report back when I can get out again, probably mid week. Thanks to you both.

Remember to correctly note all your current settings first, so you can go back to them if needed.

 

[roamer]

I appreciate the pro tuner knows his stuff, and the results are good, it just proves correct set up works,
My mention of going a click or 2 on the rebound wont do any harm , as you the rider will feel the difference,
Just 1 click on the rebound is noticeable on ttx i imagine thats why he said leave it alone,
I am speaking from experience,

 

[roamer]

Hi Rockred Its good to hear youre still enjoying the ohlins,
As i said when you bought them , although they were set up and made a big difference,
note the settings from fully closed and have a try, you may find a better setting for you,
One setting at a time 2 clicks will let you feel which way you are going then back one ,
decide 1 or 2 or other direction from there,
Just note where you are at each step if it feels positive ride that setting for a while,
I recall putting in a little extra rear pre load in to balance the front rear sag when sitting on the bike so it went down evenly,
It helped the turn in a bit,

 

[Warlord]

Just to add..... as it may be assumed on either side.

But I DONT carry top boxes, or luggage rails, or side boxes.

What I do carry is around 4kg of stuff in a pillion seat soft bag.

If you carry luggage as well, you'll need to add more preload.

 

[Rockred]

I just ride with the aluminium top box on for my days out, with just an air pump, tyre repair kit, few tools and a leatherman.

Just going outside to check my settings, before I change anything. Then an early morning run up the mountains on Wednesday. I will report back after I get back Wednesday.

 

[stick]

Just to add..... as it may be assumed on either side.

But I DONT carry top boxes, or luggage rails, or side boxes.

What I do carry is around 4kg of stuff in a pillion seat soft bag.

If you carry luggage as well, you'll need to add more preload.

Oh the beauty of auto pre load lol

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Oh the beauty of auto pre load lol

Bam ouch

 

[Warlord]

Oh the beauty of auto pre load lol

... when it works

 

[ferguscawley]

I fitted Wilber’s esa to my 2011 twincam at 600 miles and put 30000 miles on them without any problems. I had them serviced by revs racing at 25000 miles and was told that they were in perfect condition. On my 2017 gsa I completed a 3000 mile Europe trip on the original suspension and found the bike to be too soft and under damped - slightly better when set to two rider setting but not much. I fitted Wilber’s, set to my weight riding style etc and as expected the bike is now perfect for me ie, one doesn’t notice the suspension as it doesn’t intrude at all, simply does it job.
On both bikes I fitted the units my self: twincam - easy, gsa not as simple involving lifting the backend of the bike to get the rear unit in and out and unbolting and moving the front telelever to get the front unit in.
Do it. Makes more sense than a second hand tft.
Alan R

Hey Alan

Sorry to ressurect an old post here, but when removing / fitting the front shock on your GSA LC, did you have to remove the airbox to access the upper shock bolt ?

Thanks

Fergus

 

[stick]

Hey Alan

Sorry to ressurect an old post here, but when removing / fitting the front shock on your GSA LC, did you have to remove the airbox to access the upper shock bolt ?

Thanks

Fergus

Fergus , when I fitted my TT shock the air box needed to be taken off as well , you can buy the clips for the air ducts on line as best to change for new .

 

[ferguscawley]

Thanks

 

[Alan R]

Hey Alan

Sorry to ressurect an old post here, but when removing / fitting the front shock on your GSA LC, did you have to remove the airbox to access the upper shock bolt ?

Thanks

Fergus

Hello Ferguson,
No I didn’t remove the air box. I simply removed all the securing bolts and eased it back, flexing on the manifold pipes. The whole fit wasn’t a difficult job to do: just photograph where parts are before you remove them and mark the route of cables that are to be removed with string.
The most unexpected part of the job was the fact that the installation of the front suspension unit requires the suspension telelever to be unbolted from its pivot and moved forward, to accommodate the larger sized remote reservoir fitted to the Wilber’s unit. Not difficult just not anticipated.

Alan R