red hot downpipes (LITERALLY)

[John Armstrong]

I was under the impression that it was two stroke engines that had to be warmed up prior to being thrashed. Otherwise, why does Mr BM say to set off asap after starting then engine

 

[Steptoe]

Perfectly safe to start and ride - so long as your gentle with the engine until it's warmed up -

After all the engine is still working/warming up if your riding it or not.
When riding also helps the engine to warm up evenly along with the transmission and drive line.

If you let the engine warm without riding it the transmission will be cold when you ride off :- hot engine x cold transmission = not a good idea.

Also the mixture will be running richer if you leave the bike to warm up statically, which will end up contaminating the engine and diluting the oil. Not a good idea.

 

[Brian ROSEN]

Ah, but...

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generally I´m at one with Old Git Ray, because the aspect of red pipes is prior an effective result of thermal capacity built by the surrounding material, which is really thin at the pipes in conjunction with simultaneously high exaust gas temperatures at this location, but on the other hand having a relatively huge surface for e. g. at the cooling fins of the cylinders.
This should indead allow to heat up the engine for an appropriate period of time to improve and maintain proper working clearances of parts.
In this context the realisation of a specially designed separate oil circuit provides sufficient cooling of the the critical hot spots.
In comparison this deserves the remark of a big effort in development regarding reducing complexity to avoid for example additional expense for a water cooling system.
At the same time extended stop and go in the city traffic should not go beyond the scope of healthy operating conditions.



Best


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You have forgotten to take into account that this engine is equipped with sodium cooled valves...

 

[Greg Masters]

Steppers is right.

For all the reason cited of parts not fitting etc until the engine is warm, the engine should be warmed as quickly as possible without straining it. This is usually achieved by getting the engine to do some work - ie riding up the road gently.

The suggestion that oil is not circulating for a few seconds is nonsense. As soon as the light is out, oil pressure is up and the oil is circulating.

Greg

 

[RPilot]

Future is yet to come

..Ah,but You have forgotten to take into account that this engine is equipped with sodium cooled valves...

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...oh yes shure, though will this be the only point missing ? ..I apologize for any inconvenience if not....


Best


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[GSband]

... the mechanic says with a grin. 'Some people just won't accept that the best thing to do after start is ride off immediately.'

Some of the posts above show that he seems to be right.

 

[Aggy]

It does seem alien though. My old Bandit 12 was air/oil cooled and that never had a problem with over heating and that had an extra two pots sandwiched in the middle and not stuck out in the air like the panzers.

In fact it never even over heated while riding through Turin, with the temperature around 32 degrees and the traffic stopping and starting due to roadworks. Makes me wonder if the boxer can do that. The owners that have been to hot countries how do they cope when stuck in traffic? I mean its all well and good when you are blasting across the wilderness thinking to your self 'I could be in Stars me' but you still have to get to through towns at some point.

The Bandit just kept on running and the heat never killed it. Mind you the natives with D&G shades on top of their heads driving punto's had a good go at killing me to make up for it

Maybe the boxer lump has less oil floating around the head or a weaker oil pump than Mr Suzuki's engine but it still feels strange for me to start it and then ride off. So, I just start the bike, give it a couple of mins and go.

 

[Uinneag]

Start bike o down to shops come back in 2 hrs

 

[Brian ROSEN]

How we cope

"The owners that have been to hot countries how do they cope when stuck in traffic?" Well, it is often hot enough here but it is possible to avoid becoming stuck in traffic. As I hope most of you have discovered, the French motorist is very pro-biker and will give you every encouragement to overtake or filter.
However it is still often a temptation to take the car (with air conditioning of course) if one needs to arrive cool and fresh. I have seen motorcyclists wearing virtually nothing more than armour, held in place with netting (I think Heine Gerricke produce something ) and very (un) attractive it can be, depending on the wearer and his/her passenger!

 

[Old Git Ray]

....
The suggestion that oil is not circulating for a few seconds is nonsense. As soon as the light is out, oil pressure is up and the oil is circulating.

Greg

Is it nonsense ?

All the oil light tells you is that the pump and switch are working, these are close together. It does not tell you what is happening further up the oil lines. With the oil being cold a measure of back pressure in the veins will initially exist which will turn the light off before oil has completely filled the bearings and coated the cylinder walls.

I did not say the "oil was not circulating", I said it needs to get fully around the engine. It takes time to place a layer of oil between the components and build up the necessary pressure throughout the whole engine to hold the components apart.

 

[Steptoe]

. It takes time to place a layer of oil between the components and build up the necessary pressure throughout the whole engine to hold the components apart.

So tell me What difference does it make if the engine is being ridden or it's idling. Once it's started and running it's the same conditions for the engine oil at standstill or moving .

 

[Greg Masters]

It takes time to place a layer of oil between the components and build up the necessary pressure throughout the whole engine to hold the components apart.

The only time it takes on a decent engine (ie not some old knackered engine that's been to the moon and back) is a couple of rotations of the crank max as the oil should not generally drain back out of the oil galleries.

When the oil and engine is cold you actually an opposing problem which needs to be considered - too much oil pressure (which is why an engine usually requires an oil pressure relief valve) caused by the relative thickness of the oil (mineral oils are worse for this than semi or full synthetics). As I have posted elsewhere, I've seen an oil pump drive sheared by over-revving a cold engine.

Come down to Whitewebbs next month and I'll tell you stories of the oil-circulation on the Broadspeed Jaguar XJ12C race car!

Greg

 

[Aggy]

The only time it takes on a decent engine (ie not some old knackered engine that's been to the moon and back) When the oil and engine is cold you actually an opposing problem which needs to be considered - too much oil pressure

Greg

+1 for that. I used to race in 1600cc single seaters (springs/hillclimbs/monoposto) and ran a Lotus twin cam that used to have too much pressure when cold. I used to leave it ticking over for a few minutes so that the oil pressure would start to drop.

 

[Old Git Ray]

......

Come down to Whitewebbs next month and I'll tell you stories of the oil-circulation on the Broadspeed Jaguar XJ12C race car!

Greg

I am humbled.......see you there.

Lesson learned...only post when you know what you are talking about...

 

[Brian ROSEN]

Oh dear

"Lesson learned...only post when you know what you are talking about.." as I said a few posts ago....."why?."

 

[Old Git Ray]

"Lesson learned...only post when you know what you are talking about.." as I said a few posts ago....."why?."