Should I Worry

[Kipperman]

Bought a 2008 1200 GS last October from a BMW dealer. Had a great year touring etc so decided to treat the old girl to a service before slowing down for the winter. Took it to my local dealer (not the same one I bought the bike from), who completed the work ok but advised me that I was missing a cylinder head bolt from the r/h cylinder and further inspection revealed that there didn't look to be any thread there anyway. Their advice was not to worry because would have had a problem by now if serious. Would be very interested to hear people views on this because.
1. I buy BMs for their quality
2. I have a invoice from a previous service which should have revealed the problem but didn't
3. I don't feel comfortable riding the bike now
4. I have an invoice with this info on which probably affects the resale value of the bike

Would appreciate views on this - thanks

 

[cookie]

cylinder head bolt or rocker cover bolt?

 

[jwpzx9r]

I would not be too happy with that situation, can't be good when the engine gets hot and you are using a lot of power, I would think the head could warp as an extreme result. I don't suppose you could get the stud re threaded and put on a slightly thicker washer and torque it up? Must have made an unholy F up of the torquing to strip the thread!

 

[stever1]

How many miles have you done since you bought the bike ?. i cant believe a head bolt is missing.
Has the bike got a service history ?. if so is it with one dealer, if its the dealer you bought it off i would be having a word, a very sharp word with them.
How many previous owners are there ?.

 

[Pukmeister]

Paging Mr Steptoe, emergency call at the front desk !!

Seriously, I would expect Steptoe to have seen it all over the years including problems of this nature, and know how to resolve them.

I would be most concerned that if another stud broke, things could come apart with a bang. Bolts and studs are there in numbers for a purpose, otherwise they'd fit one less and save money.

 

[Kipperman]

It's cylinder head bolt.
It was implied that it was never threaded
I've done 6k since buying the bike.
2 previous owners fsh
Invoices from motoraad central in Glasgow but bought from Wollastons Northampton

 

[cookie]

it needs sorting.

 

[OldCroc]

Take it straight back to the dealer you purchased from and tell them to sort it. No questions.

 

[JayC]

Have they told you which bolt appears to be missing and can you ID from this (albeit this is LH side)?

<img id="lightBoxImage" style="width: 800px; height: 565px; " src="http://andyw-inuk.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/R1200GS-BMW-Motorcycle-Photo/R1200GS-Schematics-Diagrams/r1200gscylinderhead/393039210_VwY8C-L.png">

 

[Kipperman]

I don't know which one is missing

 

[wheelnut]

A cylinder head bolt is there for a reason. They aren't put in for the sake of it.

If you got it from a dealer then it needs to go back to be sorted.

 

[Bendy toy]

Even if it's "only" a rocker cover bolt it should be sorted. If there really is no thread, it can be cheaply and very reliably heli-coiled or thread sleeved. Done properly, such a "fix" is stronger than the original thread - Rolls Royce use them on new aero engine threads in the factory.

However, if is a cylinder head bolt, surely the old bolt would have rattled about and you would have heard the noise of it hitting the rocker cover.

Also, the heli-coil or better thread sleeve method is also the best option. for a a cylinder head bolt. It may be easier for BMW to chuck on a new cylinder, but your engine will not be properly balanced with one side run in and the other brand new. If they replace both sides you will have all the hassle of running in, oil consumption, etc, etc.

I'm no bike repair professional but a new cylinder seems to me to be the worst option unless there is something currently unknown going on inside that makes it the only option.

It needs to be properly sorted out and fixed by BMW with all advantages and disadvantages considered for the various repair options.

 

[(RIP) Mark H]

If it is a cyl head bolt missing and youv'e rode it around for 2k miles I,m suprised its not blown a head gasket!!

The heads not bolted to the cylinder by the way, they are long through bolts into the block

 

[Bendy toy]

Deffo!

But IF it is a cylinder head bolt, the same "rule" applies about helicoils or thread sleeves, unless there are other hidden problems.

Get it back to BMW and complain. Not only is there a problem they have fobbed you off.

 

[stever1]

After thinking about this i find it very odd.
1. if the bolt was over tightened when first fitted at production- which is i admit unlikely, where is it ?.
2.Surely the cyl head cover must have been removed to do valve checks at some time, and at that time a mechanic has taken it away, and the problem should have been sorted then.
3.If it was done during a subsequent maintenance operation, what was the original problem ?.

I think i would be talking to the dealer who has just serviced it and ask them to check with the BMW computerised service records and see what the history of the bike is.
Now, I may be bad minded BUT, I wonder if the bike has been to a back street mechanic at some time, and been damaged and they havent been inclined to admit the damage.
Why has a bike bought at one end of the country ended up at the other end ?. Makes you wonder !.

 

[Kipperman]

Thanks for all your comments
The history looks genuine, regular servicing by 3 different BMW garages in Scotland. My dealer said that it looked like there had never been a thread, so how does that fit with quality control from the factory? Also said that if I got this far without a problem then shouldn't worry. But there will have been valve checks (and I have one invoice to support that) so why haven't the other dealers said / done anything. I will take this further but want to make sure I have as much info as possible

 

[Bendy toy]

The dealer still needs to sort it out. "Not to worry" just isnt adequate.

BUT... as he says he can see there is no thread it sounds like he is not talking about a cylinder head bolt because that thread is far too deep to see.

If it is a rocker cover bolt of some sort its easy enough for the dealer to fix with a helicoil or thread insert. As said Rolls-Royce use them when they manufacture aero engines. They are stronger than normal threads simply cut into the alloy.

 

[Mad_Accountant]

How would he know if there was ever a thread there? Does he have little eyes a couple of mm wide that go out on stalks?

To involve BMW customer service you must route your query through a (your) dealer, they will take it up with Bracknell who in turn will take it up with factory if they cannot figure it out.

It all sounds well dodgy but there is no way of telling when/where the bolt disappeared. Obviously this requires rapid rectification, I would personally not risk further damage running with such a component missing.

Edit: per the above posting I'm highly doubtful that it is a cylinder head bolt. If it's a cover bolt it's rather more likely that a techie has stripped the head at service and not owned up to his event (I won't use the expression cock up because I'm sure stripped threads are a regular occurrence - they seem to be with my bikes )

 

[TLSgazza]

I wonder if this is infact just a blank hole that's not actually used for anything and your present dealer has misdiagnosed it.
I've seen quite a few holes like this on engines before, it might even be an oilway.
I was thinking this because your dealer doesn't seem to have told you what should be bolted to said hole

 

[Rasher]

so how does that fit with quality control from the factory?

Perfectly

Defo go back to supplying dealer to start with, as you bought in in this condition they should resolve it, the only issue is they may blame people who have serviced it since - in which case get onto BMW UK.