Why won't BMW make a decent gearbox ?

[Tricky]

Sorry but I am afraid your technique is all wrong, the WC is perfect and you can't have a duff one.






My standard 14 reg WC had an awful gearbox with lots of crunching up and down particularly between 1-2-3. Thought if might get better with more miles but it didn't. Changed it for the Adv version last month and the gearbox on this one is certainly smoother.

Guess it is just pot luck as to whether you get a decent one or not.

 

[Neil W]

I can admit that the wc has the potential to be an excellent motorcycle but it has a combination of faults, now some bikes seem to have absolutely no issues whatsoever.

Others may have minor issues with say failing switchgear or baggy seats, no real biggie.

Yet other ones may have esa issues or gearbox issues which is are more serious and make owning the bike a much less pleasurable experience.

However, feel sorry for the poor sods who have all of the above, no bikes if fully tested should ever get through the factory gates with such issues but they are

Also every issue seems to be a fight with dealers/bmw to get it recognised and rectified, maybe something to do with spiralling warranty claims causing issues with profit margins

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

i'm pretty sure i've never owned a bike that won't go into neutral at a standstill, unless the clutch was dragging for some reason. that reason being, it's badly adjusted normally. latest BMW boxer clutches appear to drag as a matter of course, at least a fair proportion of them seem to.
it is obvious to me that the whole issue is caused by a poor design of clutch that doesn't release cleanly, and is nothing to do with the gearbox itself.............

Must just be me then....... I can think of very few bikes I've owned that will just snick into N just be pulling in the clutch and tapping the lever. They have all required some sort of tecnique such as a little blip of the throttle, or feathering of the clutch so it just starts to bite or some such similar. My 630 Husky is a right bugger and will hardly ever go into N at a standstill despite playing with the clutch adjustment (at both ends). Agreed it's nearly always down to clutch drag.

Andres

 

[Titto]

Do some testing chaps...You will probably find different results when altering the clutch lever adjuster.

Position:#1) Close to the bar - Loads of crunching and bollox changes, neutral impossible all the time, everywhere in any situation!
Position:#2) A little further from the bar - Lots of rubbish gear changes, neutral still impossible most of the time.
Position:#3) Further away - Less rubbish changes, less crunching them in, AHA!!! I am starting to get neutral now!
Position:#4) Furthest - need long fingers - No shit changes, Neutral 100% of the time.

Those were my findings on my lemon 2013 GS. On my 2014 version with all the updates, I can ride fine now in position #2 and forget about it, no distraction whatsoever anymore.
That being said, i must have ridden in excess of 10 GS's now 2013 models and 2014 versions. ALL were different. ALL had gearboxes / clutch issues.
I have not met many people that don't have issues with them - except engineer on this forum. BUT he has done MEGA miles on his, and maybe his was a good one from the start, and maybe they do get better with age? Time will tell.

 

[Norfolk Tiger]

Must just nbe me then....... I can think of very few bikes I've owned that will just snick into N just be pulling in the clutch and tapping the lever. They have all required some sort of tecnique such as a little blip of the throttle, or feathering of the clutch so it just starts to bite or some such similar. My 630 Husky is a right bugger and will hardly ever go into N at a standstill despite playing with the clutch adjustment. Agreed it's nearly always down to clutch drag.

Andres

My Husky is the same but as I have just read the experiences you had with your bikes I can put it down to lack of mechanical sympathy from previous owner

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

My Husky is the same but as I have just read the experiences you had with your bikes I can put it down to lack of mechanical sympathy from previous owner

You can feck right off sir

Andres

 

[(RIP) Tunneruk]

I'm prepared to bet that the gearboxes are all identical but the fault is in fact at the clutch, I've had many conversations with WC owners who fixed their appalling 'gearbox' by adjusting the clutch lever to give maximum throw. Problem solved ..... well not problem solved but problem diagnosed. I'm not saying that it's the right solution and BMW should be looking at the new design of multi plate wet clutch in this application as it seems to be unsuited to a boxer engine in it's current state.

 

[Deleted account 251212001]

New clutch pack fixed mine , no crunching change issues now it's snicketty snick.

 

[Matty589]

I love my GS but it exhibits the same issues some have mentioned - absolutely will not go into neutral from 1st (but will almost always go down from 2nd to neutral at a standstill so I can work around it), harsh and clunky 1st to 3rd gears and generally OK above that. Engine too seems fine at a crawl (sub-15mph) and above 50mph but crap in between. And no it is not blipping the throttle, poor technique or anything else - Having owned over 25 bikes of every major make and varying ages I have never encountered such a poor gearbox. They need to visit Suzuki - for all their faults in build quality I've had 4 completely different Suzukis and the gearbox and transmission were faultless, even on a shitty 15-year-old Bandit 600.
It could be the way the clutch works, the trade-off for the light clutch action, the transmission or the light flywheel or all of the above but mine is NOT a bike to enjoy anywhere below national limit A road speed. A shame as the chassis, suspension, power (and dare I say it build quality and finish) are great. Haven't tried the heavier flywheel model so maybe it's better but I'm not going to spend £5K to find out!

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

BMW should develop a DCT style 'auto' box......................sorted (and another gadget for Nutty to buy)

No more moaning owners about duff clutches

Job done

 

[cookie]

Must just be me then....... I can think of very few bikes I've owned that will just snick into N just be pulling in the clutch and tapping the lever. They have all required some sort of tecnique such as a little blip of the throttle, or feathering of the clutch so it just starts to bite or some such similar. My 630 Husky is a right bugger and will hardly ever go into N at a standstill despite playing with the clutch adjustment (at both ends). Agreed it's nearly always down to clutch drag.

Andres

maybe i just do that stuff subconsciously now?

 

[Frequentflyer]

BMW should develop a DCT style 'auto' box......................sorted (and another gadget for Nutty to buy)

No more moaning owners about duff clutches

Job done

I can't imagine how bad a BMW DCT might be!

 

[cookie]

BMW should develop a DCT style 'auto' box......................sorted (and another gadget for Nutty to buy)

No more moaning owners about duff clutches

Job done

a great idea, but from BMW, a company with a long and unsurpassed* tradition of producing rubbish manual boxes? might be asking a bit much


*possibly pipped by Jawa

 

[johnfoxllb]

I can't imagine how bad a BMW DCT might be!

It would be as good as the SMG box they put in the M3 (crap)

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

I guess BMW would be introducing a auto-box option very soon, can't be far away and they won't want to be upstaged by Honda

 

[cookie]

I guess BMW would be introducing a auto-box option very soon, can't be far away and they won't want to be upstaged by Honda

honda have been building bikes that don't break down for decades. BMW never minded being upstaged that, and still apparently don't.

 

[WindyChuffer]

Don't know what all this clutch business is about. I rarely use the clutch for gear changes when moving, both on and off road.
Gear lever moves up and down through gears quite smoothly.

I do however have a problem with neutral on the GSA WC but no different to my KTM 300 2 stroke. The hexhead was problematic for neutral, but easier. However I normally just dump the clutch and stall the engine as opposed to fannying around looking for neutral, which works fine for me.

There's a jerk into first from neutral but so what?

 

[Grahamb]

Do some testing chaps...You will probably find different results when altering the clutch lever adjuster.

Position:#1) Close to the bar - Loads of crunching and bollox changes, neutral impossible all the time, everywhere in any situation!
Position:#2) A little further from the bar - Lots of rubbish gear changes, neutral still impossible most of the time.
Position:#3) Further away - Less rubbish changes, less crunching them in, AHA!!! I am starting to get neutral now!
Position:#4) Furthest - need long fingers - No shit changes, Neutral 100% of the time.

The problem with your theory is that I have my lever adjuster set on #1 and the take up point is right at the furtherest limit of my reach. Putting the position to 2 or more would make it unrideable. The demo bike I took for a comparison ride was set at #2 and changed gears fine - better than my old 1200RT with 100,000ks on it.

So the new gearbox and clutch design seem fine in theory (otherwise all bikes would be crap) but problems with poor manufacturing tolerances or materials is causing variations making some bikes crap while others are fine.

The good news is that this means that it should be fixable by replacing parts or adjusting out of tolerance items. The bad news is that I have to convince BMW that it is a problem and get them to admit it's their fault so it can be fixed.

I have noticed that there seems to be an adjustment on the clutch lever where it pushes against the master cylinder piston. It should allow the lever to be moved to a better position. However there is a lock screw with red paint on it underneath the adjuster. Has anyone tried moving this adjuster? I don't want to break the seal just yet, otherwise it could void the warranty. I'll see what the dealer says about it.

Graham

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

honda have been building bikes that don't break down for decades. BMW never minded being upstaged that, and still apparently don't.

He shoots.................he scores



Compliments of the season, Cookie

 

[cookie]

and you JB