Driveshaft Splines Stuck to Pinion

Tomb1988

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Hi All,

I have an 04 R1200GS with about 25,000 miles on it. Bought from my father when he got cancer in his eye. He always maintained it - by taking it to a mechanic that specialises in GS's. Just before I bought it, 8 months ago, the front swing arm boot was replaced. Now I am trying to replace the rear - because it is perished.

I have followed the very useful guide at advrider and what advice i can from the various threads that came up when googling, however, the driveshaft is rusty and properly stuck on the final drive pinion - and in trying to detach these two, the shaft has popped off the gearbox end. I have wedged some things in between the end of the pinion and UJ (someone suggested that they had used a ball joint splitter - I have one but cant get it in) which got it to move a little, but I am far from getting it all the way off.

I am surprised it is stuck on there given that the front boot was replaced such a short time ago, but perhaps that mechanic didn't detach it from the FD end at all...

I see on RealOEM that the 04 GS may have a snap ring at each end, rather than just at the gearbox end, and wonder if this is what has rusted or is otherwise preventing the removal of the drive shaft.

Does anyone have any ideas of how to get this apart? I am worried if i heat it, that could damage the bearings.

Or do i leave the two stuck and forget about it? Although I read that it is nigh on impossible to get the drive shaft mated with the gearbox if still attached to the FD - though thinking about it this can't be true if the guy who did the front boot didn't take the rear apart.

Thanks in advance to anyone that has any hints, tips or wonderful ideas!

Tom
 
Tomb1988 said:
I am surprised it is stuck on there given that the front boot was replaced such a short time ago, but perhaps that mechanic didn't detach it from the FD end at all...
Click to expand...

It's impossible to fit the front gaiter without removing the shaft from the final drive.
 
Hi Steptoe,

Thank you for confirming.

I guess the only thing to do is continue to try and separate the UJ from the pinion - there's no turning back now!
 
Last edited:
Sorry for replying to my own thread twice in a row... not sure if that is considered a faux pas.

Anyway, I figure that seeing as no one has made a 'how to' or really concluded their struggle with removing a stuck driveshaft I would at least try to contribute to the knowledge on here once I have successfully parted the two offending items. I have seen a few people mention it has happened to them, but nothing overly conclusive - perhaps because of the variable nature of how stuck rusted bits can be. Isolated posts have suggested:

Use a ball joint splitter, as I mentioned earlier
A chap, called roamer on here, said use normfest super crack
Use penetrating oil over days and it'll come off
Put penetrating oil on and ride the bike for some distance

At the moment, by hammering a 3/8" extension between the UJ and pinion I have moved the thing a few mm. I now have a steel wedge but it doesn't want to budge any more and I don't want to force it and break something being impatient - done that too many times in the past, plus it's pissing down and the bike is outside (under a cover). My plan is to use roamer's suggestion of super crack, combined with using GT85 every day until the can of super crack arrives.

Again, if anyone has any suggestions I would be most grateful to hear them. Otherwise, if you're at all interested, I will provide further updates in the coming days.

Best,

Tom
 
Heat from a blowtorch then a smack or two with a copper headed mallet ??

(Expand the female splines a bit with heat to release their grip)
 
I've an electric bike ramp. I attach one end of the shaft to the base and the other end to the ramp.

I press the button, up goes the ramp, and POP goes the weasel. Separated. :D
 
Pukmeister said:
Heat from a blowtorch then a smack or two with a copper headed mallet ??

(Expand the female splines a bit with heat to release their grip)
Click to expand...

Thank you for the suggestion Pukmeister, I had read stories of people warping a bearing cage, not sure which one, by using heat.

Although, in spraying penetrating oils in there some has inevitably made its way on to the UJ which is now no doubt buggered.

Just tried the super crack spray and a few good taps with a hammer with no success.

At this stage I am considering cutting the shaft and using a puller...
 
You make it sound so easy, Steptoe! 😄 How do you secure the final drive and the other end of the driveshaft? I am wondering about using a car jack or something before I go cutting the shaft to get a puller in...
 
Tomb1988 said:
You make it sound so easy, Steptoe! �� How do you secure the final drive and the other end of the driveshaft? I am wondering about using a car jack or something before I go cutting the shaft to get a puller in...
Click to expand...

Tie down straps.
 
I cannot see how cutting the shaft will help in any way.
You have already suggested that the u/j may be unserviceable,
Chances are the pinion bearings will be buggered as well on an early machine so heat will not cause many extra issues as the fd will poss need a rebuild anyway.
There is NO snap ring on the lower joint,it’s supposed to slide.
Best advise I can give is to remove the fd and driveshaft together clamp it down to something solid and get the lower spline really hot(200 degrees) then drive a wedge between the the joint and the pinion spline.
This will obviously ruin the seal on the fd and the u/j.
Time to raid the piggy bank:comfort
 
mikeyboy said:
I cannot see how cutting the shaft will help in any way.
You have already suggested that the u/j may be unserviceable,
Chances are the pinion bearings will be buggered as well on an early machine so heat will not cause many extra issues as the fd will poss need a rebuild anyway.
There is NO snap ring on the lower joint,it’s supposed to slide.
Best advise I can give is to remove the fd and driveshaft together clamp it down to something solid and get the lower spline really hot(200 degrees) then drive a wedge between the the joint and the pinion spline.
This will obviously ruin the seal on the fd and the u/j.
Time to raid the piggy bank:comfort
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply!

I thought about cutting the UJ so that I could get puller hooks on the bottom of the splined section and the pusher bit on the pinion. Someone else said they had done this with success.

Is there any way to tell if the pinion bearings are gone before I go down the heat route?

Did I read on this forum that you're the man to speak to about rebuilding fd's and driveshafts? What do you generally charge, if you don't mind me asking?
 
Tomb1988 said:
Thank you for the suggestion Pukmeister, I had read stories of people warping a bearing cage, not sure which one, by using heat.

At this stage I am considering cutting the shaft and using a puller...
Click to expand...

You need to heat the splined female coupling only, high direct flame heat from a Turbotorch or similar, for about 30 secs to a minute. If you get it glowing red you've buggered it, you only want to expand the metal slightly not alter its properties. Don't cut the shaft otherwise you will be into the hundreds of pounds to replace it rather than a simple overhaul by Mikeyboy.

Where abouts are you in West Sussex? Near the Hampshire border ??

If close enough to me I am happy to pop over and do my worst and show the bugger who's boss.

P.S. Do you have a workbench with an engineers vice by any chance? If so, remove FD from bike complete with shaft, clamp shaft in vice, use heat and soft face hammer to separate FD from shaft.
 
Pukmeister said:
You need to heat the splined female coupling only, high direct flame heat from a Turbotorch or similar, for about 30 secs to a minute. If you get it glowing red you've buggered it, you only want to expand the metal slightly not alter its properties. Don't cut the shaft otherwise you will be into the hundreds of pounds to replace it rather than a simple overhaul by Mikeyboy.

Where abouts are you in West Sussex? Near the Hampshire border ??

If close enough to me I am happy to pop over and do my worst and show the bugger who's boss.

P.S. Do you have a workbench with an engineers vice by any chance? If so, remove FD from bike complete with shaft, clamp shaft in vice, use heat and soft face hammer to separate FD from shaft.
Click to expand...

Ok, I will borrow a blowtorch and give it a quick heat and see what happens.

I am near Horsham so not very close to Hampshire I don't think. Although, I will happily supply tea and biscuits if you want to ride over here.

I'm afraid that I don't have a vice attached to a bench (garage under construction) though my neighbor does, so I can use his - along with his blowtorch and jack's if needed... I am lucky to have very nice neighbours!
 
I struggled with the very same problem. It was a 1150, but same design.

We first managed to separate the finel drive from the rear u-joint. But the part with the rear u-joint and splines was stuck to the shaft.

We then managed to remove the shaft from the gearbox, but we where stuck with a shaft that would not separate, thus it was stuck inside the swingarm.

We ended up using two of these: https://www.amazon.com/ABN-Bearing-Puller-4-5-Inch/dp/B074XF8JF7?ref_=Oct_TopRatedC_15708861_1&pf_rd_p=a0e5ebfc-c454-58f3-ade7-e3394b7c5963&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-6&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_i=15708861&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=9QMYCZBTG2A3V3G9K8EB&pf_rd_r=9QMYCZBTG2A3V3G9K8EB&pf_rd_p=a0e5ebfc-c454-58f3-ade7-e3394b7c5963 and managed to squeeze them in between the end of the driveshaft and the rear u-joint.

Then we started to wedge a screwdriver in between the two plates. And ever so slowly we managed to separate the parts, mm by mm. It was a struggle all the way to the last remaining 5 mm.

And the culprit and cause of the problem was that someone had greased the internal splines at the rear of the driveshaft with Graphite grease. The graphite leaves an extremely thin layer of graphite on to the surface it's being applied to. With the very close tolerance between the splines inside the shaft, it became too crowded, resulting in a stuck rear u-joint to the shaft. It took me three hours of elbow grease to scrape away the graphite layer, and at the end the shaft was as good as new (it was not corroded, and the u-joints where fine).

I do not recommend using heat if you hope to reuse the shaft. The shaft is in two parts, bonded with a rubber sleeve. Heath will probably ruin the rubber bonding, thus damaging the shaft permanently.

If there is something to be learned from this: I can not emphaisise strongly enough that the recommended by BMW grease must be used.

So, if the shaft is in a condition that it may be reused if separated without damage, don't give up.
If, on the other hand, the shaft is so corroded that it will be discarded, I'd go for an angle grinder.
 
One more thing:
When time comes to rejoin the driveshaft, make sure to mark the two parts of the driveshaft. It is important that the two u-joints are 100% parallell.
 
Thanks for the information and encouragement knutk, I am not sure if the bike I have is slightly different to yours though. I wouldn't be able to get a bearing puller in there. I tried to add a photo but can't quite figure it out :nenau every year I get older I feel like I understand technology less! :rob
 
Tomb1988 said:
Thanks for the information and encouragement knutk, I am not sure if the bike I have is slightly different to yours though. I wouldn't be able to get a bearing puller in there. I tried to add a photo but can't quite figure it out :nenau every year I get older I feel like I understand technology less! :rob
Click to expand...

The bikes are indeed different, but take a look at the picture below:
48867515277_d6aa58489e_c.jpg


Try to press one of the puller plates into the slot as pointed by the arrow. If you have a plate with good steel quality, it will handle to barely touch the edge of the shaft. Use the two bolts that pulls the two halfs of the plate together as hard as you dare, then the other plate may be expanded slightly as it is the one pushing towards the u-joint. You mount the two puller-plates back to back . You may be surprised to learn how tiny surface a quality puller will be able to handle without slipping.
 
Tomb1988 said:
Thanks for the reply!

I thought about cutting the UJ so that I could get puller hooks on the bottom of the splined section and the pusher bit on the pinion. Someone else said they had done this with success.

Is there any way to tell if the pinion bearings are gone before I go down the heat route?

Did I read on this forum that you're the man to speak to about rebuilding fd's and driveshafts? What do you generally charge, if you don't mind me asking?
Click to expand...
Feel free to call me during the day,
07786340692
 
I may have misread your reply slightly.

When you say "not getting a bearing puller in there"..
Is the driveshaft still attached to the bike?

In my case, we had to release the swingarm, and brought it back to where we would get access to the forward splines and managed to release the driveshaft from the bike. Then, as we twisted and pulled the driveshaft, we managed to get the shaft back far enough to where we could attach the tools. But like you said, different bikes...
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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