2009 r1200gs help please !

[miskyk25]

Hi folks
Settle down this is a long story !
Firstly some background history. I bought this 2009 r1200 GS just before the COVID lockdown paid too much £4200 ( I think) 60 odd thousand miles half decent condition. Full luggage with a few scrapes and some service history . Bike was put away and hardly used. As a key worker ( allegedly) work took over .
First couple of short outings on the bike when things eases up and the Starter motor failed , replaced and now starts ok. Another 12 months or so and only a handful of miles the Clutch Slave Cylinder failed , this was replaced along with pushrod and felt. Clutch bled and all working again. .
Dragged out to go for the MOT this year and the rear brake master cylinder had failed ( it never ends);So again this was replaced and MOT,d all okay .
Now I have only ever had jap 4s and I find the engine noise agricultural to say the least . It's quiet when it starts up and goes up through the box fine and pulls ok . But !! It makes the most horrendous racket when accelerating from 3 or 4 thousand revs until the wind noise drowns it out.
Even my wife comments that it's like a bag of spanners! Valve clearances and end float checked. Plugs changed . Engine oil and filter changed.
Still the rattle exists . When I'm riding it seems like it's coming from down by my left boot at the back of the engine. Though I'm aware the noise might travel.
So , the next saga. Both final drive rubber boots had small splits. I had these ready to change so today I took the plunge and stripped the bike down.
It all came apart ok , splines both ends were good. No spring clip on the gearbox shaft though ? No rust or water ingress.
I've checked the driveshaft as best I can and there's a very slight notchy feeling the final drive end and gearbox end feels ok
Now I was hoping that I might find the driveshaft was knackered and was causing the racket. Looking at I don't think it is ?
The problem I have found though is there seems to be an oil leak on the internal side of the final drive.
Now I have no problem getting the driveshaft checked and the final drive oil leak fixed. It's just if I chuck a load more money at and get it all back together and it still rattled like it's going to implode. I'm back to where I started . It's pretty frustrating as I don't want to spend the money and still be unhappy with how it sounds.
Just looking for some advice really. I could stick it all back together and sell it with the faults described honestly. Or get it fixed and enjoy it.
Hopefully you are still reading and haven't nodded off . Thank you

 

[botus]

Now I have only ever had jap 4s and I find the engine noise agricultural to say the least . It's quiet when it starts up and goes up through the box fine and pulls ok . But !! It makes the most horrendous racket when accelerating from 3 or 4 thousand revs until the wind noise drowns it out.
Even my wife comments that it's like a bag of spanners! Valve clearances and end float checked. Plugs changed . Engine oil and filter changed.
Still the rattle exists . When I'm riding it seems like it's coming from down by my left boot at the back of the engine. Though I'm aware the noise might travel.
So , the next saga. Both final drive rubber boots had small splits. I had these ready to change so today I took the plunge and stripped the bike down.
It all came apart ok , splines both ends were good. No spring clip on the gearbox shaft though ? No rust or water ingress.
I've checked the driveshaft as best I can and there's a very slight notchy feeling the final drive end and gearbox end feels ok
Now I was hoping that I might find the driveshaft was knackered and was causing the racket. Looking at I don't think it is ?
The problem I have found though is there seems to be an oil leak on the internal side of the final drive.
Now I have no problem getting the driveshaft checked and the final drive oil leak fixed. It's just if I chuck a load more money at and get it all back together and it still rattled like it's going to implode. I'm back to where I started . It's pretty frustrating as I don't want to spend the money and still be unhappy with how it sounds.
Just looking for some advice really. I could stick it all back together and sell it with the faults described honestly. Or get it fixed and enjoy it.
Hopefully you are still reading and haven't nodded off . Thank you

these should be called land rover defenders (a 40 year old one, with a worn diesel engine) run 15W50 oil, wear ear plugs

tell us how many bolts on each valve cover... if each one has 4 set the end float on the rocker shafts at tight end of the scale (then re do the valve clearances) - makes a huge difference

check engine mounts are tight

recent service change - drive shafts are now 37 k mile replacement on all later stuff (previously Liquid cooled one never had any maint regime) - they didn't bother to tell owners of older bikes it should apply to them too - but if its notchy replace it, they fail

rebuild of the rear bevel is normal around 60k miles - mine died this year at 40k

 

[KMD]

When my 1200 made too much noise coming from that area, it was the exhaust. Especially with an aftermarket such as a Remus. It seemed to blast against the number plate area and rebound. Within a certain rev range, and once I was tuned into it I couldn’t not hear it.

 

[miskyk25]

these should be called land rover defenders (a 40 year old one, with a worn diesel engine) run 15W50 oil, wear ear plugs

tell us how many bolts on each valve cover... if each one has 4 set the end float on the rocker shafts at tight end of the scale (then re do the valve clearances) - makes a huge difference

check engine mounts are tight

recent service change - drive shafts are now 37 k mile replacement on all later stuff (previously Liquid cooled one never had any maint regime) - they didn't bother to tell owners of older bikes it should apply to them too - but if its notchy replace it, they fail

rebuild of the rear bevel is normal around 60k miles - mine died this year at 40k

Cheers for the reply, 4 bolts on covers , end float set to get a 0.05 feeler gauge in. They were towards the top end and then valve clearances rechecked. As I said it sounds nice and quiet on start up , no clatter or rattle or excessive ticking from top ends. It just seems to manifest whilst riding and obviously wind noise drowns it out once travelling at speed.
I think I will look at getting the rear bevel rebuilt and the drive shaft replaced / rebuilt.
Thanks again .

 

[botus]

TPS sensor (black thing on the left throttle body) gets old and weird every 30k miles - and makes the engine run rougher and more stupid than normal

CAT sensors fail and engine adaptions can wander making it run rougher and more stupid

Ignition coils give up - replace all four - I did mine at 25k

Hold the throttle at 3k and do throttle body balance - after fitting a new TPS (aftermarket hella) and checking CAT sensors and Ignition coils are behaving

Don't forget these weren't mean to know what E10 or E5 is and Ethanol makes them run stupid... I only use BP97 as it still smells and behaves like petrol - the rest is posh water these days - I also throw in a slug of Dipetane and that smooths things out too https://dipetane.com/

Plus of course the engine map BM gave is only just capable of random joke fueling at its best

I suspect the biggest issue is you are thinking of Jap bikes - whilst the 1200 was the turning point away from worn cement mixers for weird beards - it has a very long way to go to be a normal motorbike

 

[TLSgazza]

Cheers for the reply, 4 bolts on covers , end float set to get a 0.05 feeler gauge in. They were towards the top end and then valve clearances rechecked. As I said it sounds nice and quiet on start up , no clatter or rattle or excessive ticking from top ends. It just seems to manifest whilst riding and obviously wind noise drowns it out once travelling at speed.
I think I will look at getting the rear bevel rebuilt and the drive shaft replaced / rebuilt.
Thanks again .

Rear bevel bearings replaced and a drive shaft will be the best part of £1,000.00 depending upon what needs doing.
I think Mikeyboy in Melton mowbray can sort out the drive
U/J's if the shaft is still mostly ok. Though it may not need it.

 

[miskyk25]

Rear bevel bearings replaced and a drive shaft will be the best part of £1,000.00 depending upon what needs doing.
I think Mikeyboy in Melton mowbray can sort out the drive
U/J's if the shaft is still mostly ok. Though it may not need it.

Cheers bud
I am lucky I am only an hour away from Overland and Classics. I will give Mike a call Monday morning and see if he can help. Thanks for the reply

 

[Slipperyeel]

It's just a thought, but change the oil... Change it to 20/50.

Maybe the previous owner put something like 10/40 into it (normal for a jap 4 cylinder).

Try that and come back to us. With that 10/40 in, they make a racket! As for the FD. Yes. That may need some attention too but not be the source of the 'noise'

 

[Santa-2512]

It's just a thought, but change the oil... Change it to 20/50.

Maybe the previous owner put something like 10/40 into it (normal for a jap 4 cylinder).

Try that and come back to us. With that 10/40 in, they make a racket! As for the FD. Yes. That may need some attention too but not be the source of the 'noise'

+1 for 20/50,,

Ive a thread called lemon (or something similar) in the hexhead section, you should be able to hear what 10/40 sound when its hot lol -

 

[dashfixer]

Don't forget these weren't mean to know what E10 or E5 is and Ethanol makes them run stupid... I only use BP97 as it still smells and behaves like petrol - the rest is posh water these days - I also throw in a slug of Dipetane and that smooths things out too https://dipetane.com/

These bikes have been sold in the USA since they were first produced and ethanol fuel has been sold there since 1970s. E10 is the normal fuel and E15 is also sold. Do you seriously think that BMW would sell a bike in their biggest market that won't run on the fuel available there? Not to mention that ethanol fuel has been sold in Europe since the second world war.

 

[botus]

what does the label on the tank of an air cooled UK spec R1200GS say ? - no mention of ethanol E junk fuel on any of mine

what does the label on a K1300 say ? - no mention of ethanol on the one I had

check daten files on BMW servers - they have LOTS of maps for old bikes - not many suitable for our region - what mods they did for what markets and who cares how their bikes run is not my concern - but over here buy real fuel it runs OK, buy ethanol infected fuel and it doesn't behave the same (being more recalcitrant than the original set up running real petrol...) not to mention 6% of your power has been stolen

 

[DrFarkoff]

what does the label on the tank of an air cooled UK spec R1200GS say ? - no mention of ethanol E junk fuel on any of mine

what does the label on a K1300 say ? - no mention of ethanol on the one I had

check daten files on BMW servers - they have LOTS of maps for old bikes - not many suitable for our region - what mods they did for what markets and who cares how their bikes run is not my concern - but over here buy real fuel it runs OK, buy ethanol infected fuel and it doesn't behave the same (being more recalcitrant than the original set up running real petrol...) not to mention 6% of your power has been stolen

Note to All !!

Don't listen to this "BOT"

It's not useful info

just bluster and Bullschit!!

 

[botus]

you are such a moron...

of course it runs worse - burning differently, ethanol has less energy than real petrol, at 10% ethanol concentrations you get 6% less energy when burning the junk - that's exactly why its in your tank - they can steal more money selling fuel that now does lower MPG

yes ethanol is a budget octane booster (saving them putting in decent stuff, saving more costs).

yes ethanol grows bugs that etch metal helping the corrosion that's inherent with junk fuel's that are hygroscopic - all helping destroy your pride and joy - and yet another reason that rubbish is in your tank

yes ethanol fuels age fast, deteriorating within a few weeks, separating out to jelly, bugs, water, and rust inside 3 months

yes they can ignore the pitfalls, yes they can save money, and yes we can make minor redesigns to an engine and get back most of the power loss with tweaks to the pistons and combustion chamber, raising the compression ratio and tweaking the AFR with later tech

but that never happened on BMW bikes pre 2015 - if you check the user manual for euro spec early K1600s and R1200LCs they don't mention ethanol infected junk fuels either

 

[DrFarkoff]

Laaa laaaa Laaaa

No Useful information contained within this BOT's post above AS USUAL

Just a general search and paste and copy

Just looking for some advice really. I could stick it all back together and sell it with the faults described honestly. Or get it fixed and enjoy it.
Hopefully you are still reading and haven't nodded off . Thank you

@miskyk25

To be honest The bikes are "usually" good, When the Foibles are known, despite what the BOT says !

So I did a job on a 1200GS a Mk1 Early edition for a friend, Oil seemed to be dripping in the lower FD area

By the time I got around to collecting it and stripping it there was a small puddle in the FD nose bearing area but nothing indicating where it came from So as it had 40 odd thousand miles the FD was sent to be rebuilt and when refitted it had a drip at the boot a couple of hundred miles later

The whole problem turned out to be the output seal on the gearbox, no visual evidence in the swingarm or the back of the box (boot pulled back and torch shone in ) when I started the job but this time you could see some staining just below the output shaft seal and a small trail down the swingarm

Anyway I stripped out the swingarm and replaced the output seal and ran it like that to verify it was good

The point of that "Story" is diagnose it! don't just replace a load of parts and then wonder what fixed it

1200 Hexheads, often run terrible at idle! sometimes it is badly adjusted cables or cables not properly seated, A Bad Lambda sensor, bad TPMS, etc etc

This bag of spanners Is it a mechanical sound like a chain thrashing about or a tap tap tap type of sound ?

Who did the valve clearances? Are you sure that they are done correctly, I did have a fella set his own valves and didn;t quite rotate it to the next TDC so one side was as loose as a big bag of loose things BUT easily fixed

Not usually a problem on these but cam chain tensioners can break? Usually easily seen by shining a torch in there and noting if there is a shedload of slack on the chain

Is the balance shaft counterweight centre bolt tight?

You can eliminate if a part is good or bad by simply unplugging it So just unplug the lambda probes did that improve it

Oh and as far as oil ?? Just run a DECENT 20W50 That's what the Workshop pre release told us when the first ones arrived for the release March 2004 Honestly don't get caught up in the "hype" of OMG I must run Fully synth etc etc Unless you are racing You do not need it !