Cutting Out - scary this am in the wet

[Bramble]

Sometimes when I pootle along on a constant throttle - say in a long 40 or 50mph speed limit - and I come to change down the engine just turns off!!!!!!!!!!!

Just to be clear - I pull in the clutch, blip the throttle, change gear and NOTHING. It's really scary if I don't whip in the clutch. It's as tho' the engine doesn't "catch" as the throttle's blipped.

The bike will then only start again using the starter. It will not start by easing out the clutch and giving it a bit of gas.

It doesn't seem to matter whether the engine has just warmed up or has been running for hours.

It doesn't happen very often but it's not predictable and it's something I'm not enjoying living with.

Oh, I've got a Remus can on at the moment but it used to do it with the standard BM one too.

Has anybody out there experienced anything similar?

And does anybody have an idea how to cure it?

Is it lean running?

Is it operator error?

 

[Blowzorn]

Mine does the same.
Usually while filtering.
Sometimes dumping the clutch will 'bump it' but not all the time.
I've mentioned it when I've had the bike in for service and they can't find any reason why it happens.
I used to think it was just in damp weather, but as you say it can happen anytime.
It happened when I had a standard set up, when I swapped the cat for a y-piece and still happens now I've got a remus on aswell.
You get used to it and faster on the starter button.
Mines an 1150 you didn't say what your on.

 

[Bramble]

Hi Blowzorn
mine's an 1150 too.
Now there are two of us - is this a case of "they all do that sir"?
I'm pleased that your experience is the same as mine - at least it's not just me.
You're right...........I'll just have to keep my thumb hovering over the starter button just in case.

 

[Le singe]

This sounds like a problem with potentially lethal consequences,have you informed Dr ABS?

 

[peteb478]

My R1150R does the same thing occasionally, only when I'm pootling along too, often when I'm slowing for junctions. Completely standard bike.
Begining to sound like 'they all do that, sir!'

 

[Bramble]

ok, now there are 3 of us.

Any ideas on why it happens. & more importantly, how to stop it happening? Le singe you're an engine tuner, what's your view?

 

[cookie]

This sounds like a problem with potentially lethal consequences,have you informed Dr ABS?

 

[Le singe]

My 1100 used to do it after I'd modified the motor.
One reason was I usually keep the tickover at 800-850rpm, when slowing down using engine braking it would occasionally not recover.
The other reason was a patch of over-leanness at around 1/8 to 1/4 throttle.
When I checked the TPS voltage it was only 342mV, increasing it to 370mV has 90% cured the problem, 380-385mV should cure it totally.
Increasing the TPS voltage increases the fuel delivery up to around 1/3 throttle,then the map takes over.
Check the obvious things,fuel filter O.K.,etc, as well.

 

[Bramble]

Thanks Le Singe, I'll give that a go.

I'll just see what Dr ABS had to say about it.................................

 

[AdamZ]

Hmmmm,

I have that when I am dropping down a cog, usually when positioning for filter or coming upto to a roundabount at slow speed. Typical approach from double declutching - clutch in, blip, close throttle, let engine speed match gear speed, clutch out....

In a significant number of instances she dies before the clutch out.

I have BBPower chip so assumed that it was related to this, also seems more prevelant after a service.

I thought that this was related to the throttle setting that is fixed when you start the bike. Seemed to remember that somewhere in the manual of the 1150RT there was mention that you should not turn the throttle when starting the engine due to it establishing a position for the throttle.

If that is the case I assume that it assumes the fuel flow at start-up will be managed by the the manual choke. I very, very, seldom use the manual choke as I tend to forget to switch it off so burn fuel like bu£gery...

It happens frequently, always on the down shift so perhaps there is also may be something to do with the bike angle of attack..

I am prepared for it now and a soon as I feel or hear the loss of tick-over I am ready to hit the starter button before I let out the clutch...

I probably also experience it more coz I use engine braking a lot....

 

[bustah]

my 1150 does this as well, almost causes a heart attack when filtering.......

 

[JediJase]

Mine too, 1150 full remus system. The worst case I was heading down the A40 coming up to North Acton, I was doing 40ish, clutch in blip clutch out, engin dies and the back wheel locked up, I thought I was going to be hit from behind. It doesn't happen as much if I leave the choke on until 1 bar on the oil temp is showing. But if it does I just hit the start button before I let the clutch out.

 

[Sergeant Pluck]

Mine does it occasionally too. Doesn't really bother me too much to be honest - I don't if it's because of the way I ride but I always catch it before the clutch comes back out so I've never locked the back up. It seems to be slighty worse since I changed to a Revolution from a Remus Titanium (I have the y-piece as well) but it happens so rarely that I've usually forgotten about it before I have a chance to start worrying.

As mentioned - I think it's due to a slight lean-patch somewhere around 3000-4000 RPM.

 

[Ian J Hartley]

My 2003 GS did it about 4 times over a period of 6 months from new. Complete and uncommanded engine shut downs which could only be restarted using the start button. nearly pitched me over the bars a couple of times. Certainly knocks your confidence, overtaking needed careful planning, just in case. I reported it to the dealer at the time, but by the time it was due a service the fault seamed to have cleared itself and I haven't had a re-occurance in 18 months (touch wood).

Oddly my 2000 GS also did it several times at the beginning of it's life but then ran without a murmer for the next 25K.

The way the bike shuts down like it does sounds engine management. If it was fuel related it would bump start back into life.

One of lifes great mysteries I suppose.

 

[littleredrooster]

Hmmmm,

I very, very, seldom use the manual choke as I tend to forget to switch it off so burn fuel like bu£gery...

It's only a fast-idle device. All it does is pull the throttles open a bit; all of the enrichment-management for a cold engine is done by the electronics.

 

[littleredrooster]

BTW, I'm with Le Singe on this - correct setting of the TPS voltage makes a HUUUGE difference to the way the engine picks up from a closed throttle.

 

[AdamZ]

It's only a fast-idle device. All it does is pull the throttles open a bit; all of the enrichment-management for a cold engine is done by the electronics.

I appreciate that but my point was that the closed throttle setting is done somehow by the position of the throttle at start up. Mind you I seem to remember that the RT manual said something about having it having to be reset after the battery has been disconnected or gone flat....

 

[verona]

Yep, mine does this too. A GS 1150R 2000 with Remus and Y piece. Have had SPC have a look at it last year when purchased from them and they removed the cat code plug which made things slightly better but not completely cured. Also popped into Dorchester one day where I was told my bike was outstanding a recall for a cat code plug and this only made things worse, only slightly, but I removed it anyway. I usually find keeping the revs up helps this cutting out not to happen as often. In a couple of weeks time my bike goes in for its 24,000 mile service, lets see what happens. Cheers Jay

 

[littleredrooster]

I appreciate that but my point was that the closed throttle setting is done somehow by the position of the throttle at start up. Mind you I seem to remember that the RT manual said something about having it having to be reset after the battery has been disconnected or gone flat....

Yep, almost. When the battery has been disconnected or fuse 5 has been pulled, you need to reset the TPS by turning on the ignition and opening the throttle fully a couple of times for the Motronic to establish min and max positions. It remembers this until the next power-down. It does not affect it under other circumstances, otherwise every time the bike is started it would (potentially) have a different setting.

 

[Bramble]

Increasing the TPS voltage

Is this something my friendly neigbourhood dealer (Williams) can check/do? I haven't asked them yet. I daren't start fiddling myself.

If I get it cured I'll let you know................everyone else's experience seems to be similar to mine: clutch: blip; downshift; (insert expletive) DEAD!

I'm keen to get it sorted as my daily commute comprises about 20 miles of fast country A roads, 10 miles of M-way and 5 miles of filtering, which all-in-all I find challenging enough (and enjoyable enough too) without the fun(?) of a sudden cut-out.................... but I do love the bike