multistrada or GS

[Mutley]

Not sure I won't regret this, and I've avoided getting involved with any of these threads on the forum because of the likelihood of getting flamed

Seems like telling anyone that there may be a "better" bike than the one they currently own is like (or maybe worse than) calling their girlfriend ugly

Do you think it may be because this is not only a forum for people that own the bike in question, but also it's populated by people who are genuine enthusiasts for the bike. Secondly they have all made a significant financial committment to ownership. Consequently suggesting that there may be something better out there needs to be done carefully.

(Suggesting that there are legions of us about to switch to a Ducati is not doing it carefully )

 

[snerkler]

Not sure I won't regret this, and I've avoided getting involved with any of these threads on the forum because of the likelihood of getting flamed

Seems like telling anyone that there may be a "better" bike than the one they currently own is like (or maybe worse than) calling their girlfriend ugly

I have an 07 GS (not GSA) which I have covered about 16K miles on - mainly "progressive" road work, both on my own for Sunday blasts and with my wife and luggage around Europe on holiday.

It has been extensively modified, all with the aim of turning it into the best possible fast road mile muncher, and fun steed for hooning on the twisties.
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1681164#post1681164

I think it is a brilliant bike for the road, and I have never really had any desire to take it off road (hence the road tyres, stiffer suspension, etc).

Whenever anyone asked me about it I would say "Don't think a GS is slow and boring - it is a very capable bike, and can show a poorly ridden sports bike a clean pair of heels on anything other than a race track."
If pushed, I would admit that "the things that would improve it for me (making a good bike a great bike) is a bit more power, a bit less weight, improved handling, and a more "exciting" engine character."

Hence the reason I tried a Multistrada - because it had all of the things I like about my GS (comfortable, practical, commanding riding position) PLUS it seemed to address all of the things that I thought could be better.

On the test ride, I loved it, and truly felt it to be the best bike I'd ever ridden in over 25 years and countless bikes, BUT the fueling was shockingly bad, and I said I'd never buy one unless Ducati sorted it out.

I'm happy to say that this has been done, and the fueling is now pretty much perfect (better than my GS was pre power commander).

So, as a fast road bike, capable of covering serious distances in complete comfort, then having a great laugh in the mountains or whatever when you get there, the MTS beats the GS hands down IMHO.

The Ducati is significantly faster, quite a bit lighter, has much sharper handling (even compared to my Wilbers equipped bike) and, for me anyway, it is more comfortable over long distances.

As a full on adventure bike for crossing continents on unmade roads, then I don't believe the MTS is the right answer and you would be better to stick with a GS(A), or maybe even a more dedicated off road machine.

Having said all of this, I have not sold my GS (yet) because my wife loves it so much we've decided to hold on until she's had a chance to try the MTS pillion over longer distances.
Mind you, she loves the GS because it is mega comfortable on the back and the power delivery is so unintimidating that she can sleep on the back even when I'm riding "progressively" - so her criteria for a good bike may not necessarily match mine

I've tried to make my feedback here as balanced as possible, and I'm not trying to start a "My bike's better than yours" debate. But the question was asked and, in my opinion, the MTS is a significantly better ROAD bike than the GS in pretty much every respect.

I genuinely hope that BMW will respond to the MTS and put some serious effort into a new GS that returns it to world beater status. The S1000RR has shown us what they can do when they want to, but the recent revisions to the GS have (IMHO) been a bit lazy - doing just enough to retain the current customer base without trying to move the bike along. If Ducati have given them a kick up the arse which results in a big step to the next model revision, they will have done us all a favour

Good right up. I know what you mean about people being defensive over their posessions, but it's understandable I guess. I try to look at things from an unbiased point of view, and if there's a bike (or whatever is being compared) out there that's genuinely better than mine I'm quite happy to say so. What I don't like is people slating my stuff just for the sake of it, or because they are jealous etc. On saying that I still try to rise above it.

With regards to BMW being a bit lazy and Ducati giving them a big kick up the arse, I'm not so sure. The two bike are clearly very different and aimed at different sorts of riders. It is apparent that BMW are going to lose a certain part of the market though, which I'm sure they'll not be too happy about. It will be interesting to see what they do. Whether they stick with the same philosophy, or try to beat Ducati at their own game.
Personally if I was in charge I'd seriously think about making the GS more like the MTS in the way of being faster, lighter and more agile, and keeping the GSA as the go anywhere, do anything slow plodder. That way BMW will keep everyone happy. The GS would satisfy the 'sensible' thrill seekers, and the GSA would satisfy a lot of the oldskool Beemer tribe (not including those that will stick with the 1100/1150 until the end of time).
However, for the short term at least I think that they will stick with the current formula, especially considering the 2012 GS/GSA is well under development.

 

[Simon_h]

Do you think it may be because this is not only a forum for people that own the bike in question, but also it's populated by people who are genuine enthusiasts for the bike. Secondly they have all made a significant financial committment to ownership. Consequently suggesting that there may be something better out there needs to be done carefully.

(Suggesting that there are legions of us about to switch to a Ducati is not doing it carefully )

I support AFC Bournemouth but I'm aware that other teams play better football. Just because this is a GS site doesn't mean the GS is the best bike in the world.

I'm a biking enthusiast that has a GS....not a GS enthusiast. Each to their own and all that.

 

[SPL]

I'm a biking enthusiast that has a GS....not a GS enthusiast.

Very well put Simon - that pretty much sums me up too.

Mutley - The question was asked mate and, as I own both bikes being discussed, I reckon my reply is valid.

Take a look at the spec of my bike in the link and you will see that I too have made a significant investment in my GS ownership, and I never said it was not a good bike. Neither did I say that there were legions of people on this site about to switch

However, I stand by my conclusion that the MTS is a better bet for people who like to crack on when they're riding, and who don't have any aspirations for rugged off-road type malarkey.

I'm not trying to convert anyone to Ducati, nor am I saying there is anything wrong with sticking to a GS - I was just contributing to the discussion in this thread.

 

[Beemerman59]

The only thing extra I would want on my 1200GSA would be another 25bhp or so, mostly for when two up. If the Duke engine could be shoehorned into a GSA I would be well happy.

 

[Simon_h]

The only thing extra I would want on my 1200GSA would be another 25bhp or so, mostly for when two up. If the Duke engine could be shoehorned into a GSA I would be well happy.

at the expense of economy and low down accessible grunt?

 

[snerkler]

at the expense of economy and low down accessible grunt?

Extra horses doesn't necessarily mean it would lose the low down grunt Plus, with the wonders of development you can get extra horses without a noticeable decrease in economy (unless we're talking massive BHP changes)

 

[Rasher]

Not sure the MTS engine would suit the GS "character" it is more of a supermoto on steroids than an adventure bike, although I too think a few more BHP would help for faster two-up work, the 150BHP MTS lump is probably a bit much.

I think the guys who got Hilltop remaps gained @15 BHP and had increased torque across the range, not bad for a few hundred quid, and probably all the GS really needs

 

[Giles]

The only thing extra I would want on my 1200GSA would be another 25bhp or so, mostly for when two up. If the Duke engine could be shoehorned into a GSA I would be well happy.

I don't want extra bhp for two up, I want it for one up!!!

990 SMT? 990 adventure? GS? MultiStrada? It's good that we have choices, and it's good that bikes from a similar stable are different. We shouldn't get into a mindset that this is better than that, it's just different and will suit one persons tick box list, but not necessarily anothers.

Some peepes are plodders and are quite happy with the performance and grand touring ability of the GS, and there's nothing wrong with that. Some like the Tall Rounder feel of a bike, but want to wring it's neck supermoto style, and the MTS will really float their boat. Choice is good!

 

[Arsey]

Personally if I was in charge I'd seriously think about making the GS more like the MTS in the way of being faster, lighter and more agile, and keeping the GSA as the go anywhere, do anything slow plodder.

No no no !!

Ok,another 20 bhp would be ok,but does a GS/GSA need to be faster ?

I had my old 06 GSA12 cruising at 120+ mph on the autobahn on many occasions.

Try that on a Multi with it's cramped riding position and crap screen !!

And the weight and bulk of the GS/GSA adds to it's stability and planted feel,especially two up.

BMW would be stupid change a winning formula just to pander to a few who need the latest fad for a few months.

The torque and tractability of a GS motor is far far nicer in the real world than a snatchy Ducati power plant.

 

[snerkler]

No no no !!

Ok,another 20 bhp would be ok,but does a GS/GSA need to be faster ?

I had my old 06 GSA12 cruising at 120+ mph on the autobahn on many occasions.

Try that on a Multi with it's cramped riding position and crap screen !!

And the weight and bulk of the GS/GSA adds to it's stability and planted feel,especially two up.

BMW would be stupid change a winning formula just to pander to a few who need the latest fad for a few months.

The torque and tractability of a GS motor is far far nicer in the real world than a snatchy Ducati power plant.

But what I was saying is for BMW to have both They could keep the winning formula AND make a new breed.
Just to clarify, when I say faster what I mean is faster acceleration, I couldn't care less if a bike didn't go above 90mph. The only thing I'd change about my GSA is to either give it a few more horses or change the gear ratio so that it had quicker 1st and 2nd gear acceleration

 

[Big Nick]

Test road the Multistrada today at Ducati Leeds and all I can say is..........Holy crap that things fast!!

I thought I'd grown out of the speed thing, quite clearly I haven't!!

Rode it up to the Dales/Devils Bridge and had an absolute hoot, mega fast, comfortable and great handling. I didn't notice any of the bad fuelling reported by some owners on the bike I rode which was an '11'plate with 350 miles on it.

The only stumbling block is the price which at about £15k is just too much for me coupled with the depreciation which it'll no doubt suffer badly with

To anyone with deep pockets thinking about a GS who'll only use it as a road bike but wants sportsbike speed test ride a Multistrada

"SAY HELLO TO MY LITTLE FRIEND"

 

[Richie B]

I tested a MTS last Sept and bought a GS Nov , the reasons ...........MTS felt cramped , no room for my size 12 feet, also I thought it was dull in the corners (under steer), over priced , did'nt like the keyless ign, did'nt like the screen, to get protection from it it was so high I had to look through it . yeah the power was good , and the looks are slightly better than the GS. But for me the GS is better in all departments. The lack in BHP was a concern to me at first, but now I am 100% sure I made the right choice.

 

[Giles]

Dull in the corners??? Don't understand that! One of the nicest handling bikes I've ridden in ages ....

 

[phooey]

Horses for courses.

MTS simply doesn't appeal to me - I thought it felt plasticky and insubstantial ( sat on not ridden I hasten to add ).

I lost the urge to thrash the nuts off anything on the road some years back - better left to track days imho.
I find the 90odd BHP the adv stumps up plenty if I want to get a move on.

I don't want to go back to chain drive, sub 45mpg or sub 350mile fuel stops.

The GS is a better bike for some - just as the MTS is a better bike for others.

Depends what you want.

 

[Simon_h]

Extra horses doesn't necessarily mean it would lose the low down grunt Plus, with the wonders of development you can get extra horses without a noticeable decrease in economy (unless we're talking massive BHP changes)

so how is extra power gained? I thought it was by increasing air flow (performance filters/headwork/performance exhausts etc) which you would then have to increase fuelling, greater displacement increasing fuelling, higher profile cam thus narrowing the power band and making it higher in the rev range or adjusting the timing in which case it effects engine longevity. Am happy to be corrected.

 

[snerkler]

so how is extra power gained? I thought it was by increasing air flow (performance filters/headwork/performance exhausts etc) which you would then have to increase fuelling, greater displacement increasing fuelling, higher profile cam thus narrowing the power band and making it higher in the rev range or adjusting the timing in which case it effects engine longevity. Am happy to be corrected.

Well you sound like you know more than I do, so I'll be quiet now
What if you increased engine capacity though? Couldn't you acheive more BHP, and even more torque?

 

[Rasher]

so how is extra power gained? I thought it was by increasing air flow (performance filters/headwork/performance exhausts etc) which you would then have to increase fuelling, greater displacement increasing fuelling, higher profile cam thus narrowing the power band and making it higher in the rev range or adjusting the timing in which case it effects engine longevity. Am happy to be corrected.

See here:

http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?t=255076&page=2

Graphs near bottom of page 2, it seems just getting the fuelling right (as it is so far wrong on the GS) makes ahuge difference.

Most bikes are actually rich in stock trim, my ZZR was about 15% overfueled at the top end, a remap with stock exhausts (with cats) gave an extra 8-9 BHP.

I understand the GS is mega weak to pass emissions tests, it looks like correcting this helps greatly. Theoretically should make bike more efficient and therefore even better on fuel.

 

[Simon_h]

may I ask how much you were charged? So the assumption is that the gs is overfuelled due to the prospect of poor fuel and tough weather conditions...but wouldn't this effect its emissions?

 

[Richie B]

umm now thats interesting, cos my 09 gs does 15-20 miles less per tank than my mates 05 gs on the same trip doing the same speeds. (altho I am about 5 stone heavier )