O ring on rear speed sensor.

[AustinW]

I have lost speedo and therefore ABS so looking at the speed sensor. All looks ok but on removing the speed sensor there is no O ring. Mr Haynes says there should be. Is he correct? If so where does it fit and what size? Ta.

This is after wiping it down....

There's a washer, could be a crush washer but nothing I would call an O ring, ie round, black and made of rubber. There's no leaks though.

New sensor is ordered.


Edit....the bike is a 2011 GSA

 

[m1keyp]

Should have an oring, items 15 & 16 on my 08 machine.

Here is a great resourse:-

http://www.ascycles.com/Illustrated...Right-angle gearbox with vent&bindCat=33_1622

15 Centering ring 1 33117707796 $1.25
16 O-ring 15X2 1 34527708523 $1.55


Cheers Mike

 

[seahorse]

34527708523 is part no. or BRA08523 from Motorworks. I bought a few of these as I use the speedo sensor hole for re-filling FD with oil rather than the filler plug. Green in colour I believe.

 

[mikeyboy]

If that photo is your bike ,the o ring is still there.
In the fd housing,it's green in colour

 

[Neil W]

Have you checked the wiring where the plug from the sensor goes into the main loom (attached to the frame rail on the right side of the bike slightly in front of the battery), it came unplugged on my 2011 bike

 

[AustinW]

Should have an oring, items 15 & 16 on my 08 machine.

Here is a great resourse:-

http://www.ascycles.com/Illustrated...Right-angle gearbox with vent&bindCat=33_1622

15 Centering ring 1 33117707796 $1.25
16 O-ring 15X2 1 34527708523 $1.55


Cheers Mike

Thanks for that Mike, I had had a browse around that site for a few minutes but couldn't find the right fiche.

34527708523 is part no. or BRA08523 from Motorworks. I bought a few of these as I use the speedo sensor hole for re-filling FD with oil rather than the filler plug. Green in colour I believe.

Good tip, I have ordered a second hand sensor from Motorworks. It was only afterwards I thought about the O ring I use the filler hole usually to fill up the drive.

If that photo is your bike ,the o ring is still there.
In the fd housing,it's green in colour

Yes, my bike. Maybe its my eyes but nothing looks particularly green to me. If you mean the slight shoulder with a what looks a clean edge to it just in the hole then I had a gentle pluck at that but it didn't want to move. Perhaps I need to be braver.

I could also do with a chat with you about the FD. For the last 4 times I have changed the FD oil its been grey in colour. Not quite emulsified and mayonnaisey but thin and grey. Water ingress I am guessing which I thought was coming in through the breather as it was a poor fit; It probably still is but I slapped some silicone grease on it hoping to seal it - about 3,000miles ago at 48k. The oil on the sensor when I took it out was the same grey stuff, so still leaking somewhere. Detaching the FD and greasing the splines is on my list of jobs to do, and I strongly suspect that I will it all full of water. Which I think means the seal is allowing water in, (but doing what its supposed to do and keeping the oil in) and I think will also mean bearings in the FD are likely to be affected and worn. The FD doesnt whine or anything but is noisy in a clack-clack clunk sort of way at low speed.

Have you checked the wiring where the plug from the sensor goes into the main loom (attached to the frame rail on the right side of the bike slightly in front of the battery), it came unplugged on my 2011 bike

Yes checked all that but thanks for the tip. Connector was good and test of the sensor showed infinite resistance, which I think means its a dud.

 

[mikeyboy]

It's just being held in by the road crud,get a small screw driver behind it and pull it out,
If it was missing it would piss oil everywhere
The hole needs to be really clean before refitting the sensor or it won't seat correctly,
If you clean it up you will find the o' ring

 

[mikeyboy]

When you drop the fd ,to do the splines,check for play in the pinion bearings by rocking the fd input shaft .
There should be minimal play,preferably none,
The grey oil may be down to pinion nose bearing wear

 

[AustinW]

Speedo works off the front sensor after about 3 miles

I just thought I would add that the speedo kicks in after about 3 miles of riding even with the rear sensor not working at all. The ABS light stays on which I assumed meant the rear sensor still wasn't working. I checked this by putting the bike on the centre stand after the speedo had restarted and without switching the ignition off and then running it in gear for a few moments. The speedo does not work, but ride off again and it does.

Clearly then after a period of running with no input from the rear sensor the bike's electronics switch to the front sensor for speedo input. Everything resets when the ignition is switched off.

Still waiting for the replacement sensor to turn up, but have got moly and lithium grease to drop the FD and check out for rust and wear.

 

[Bendy toy]

Oil will flood out if you fit the sensor without the O ring and ride the bike. DAHIK

 

[Phil-H]

Austin, the green O ring is visible still in the hole.
Wasn't your fd weeping oil last time we met up?

Prob time for a rebuild, particularly taking into account the trips you do

 

[AustinW]

Austin, the green O ring is visible still in the hole.
Wasn't your fd weeping oil last time we met up?

Prob time for a rebuild, particularly taking into account the trips you do

It wasn't weeping, it was FS365 - I think......I hope! Rebuild, perhaps if there is wear and perhaps as a precaution along with a suspension rebuild or even replace with Wilbers. (a daydream about North, Central and South America in 2016 is slowly taking shape).

 

[Phil-H]

Hmm, it did look oily & weepy from around the shaft seal, which would tie in with grey oil (metal)....
Any play anywhere?

 

[Bendy toy]

If there is ANY doubt about the internal condition, send the FD to MikeyBoy who does an excellent rebuild service. You could swap the wheel bearing seal to find far more problems hidden away.

Grey oil is not a good sign. For what the rebuild costs compared to a new final drive, it's a no brainer.

 

[AustinW]

Hmm, it did look oily & weepy from around the shaft seal, which would tie in with grey oil (metal)....
Any play anywhere?

If there is ANY doubt about the internal condition, send the FD to MikeyBoy who does an excellent rebuild service. You could swap the wheel bearing seal to find far more problems hidden away.

Grey oil is not a good sign. For what the rebuild costs compared to a new final drive, it's a no brainer.

I know, I know, i have been burying my head in the sand hoping it will go away or just stay as it is (as it has for around 35,000miles now), but I know that really I should have got it fixed ages ago. The new sensor and seals were posted today from Motorworks, so they will get fitted tomorrow and I will drop the FD to check for play at the same time. But, I suspect I will sending it off to mikeyboy for a rebuild.

 

[AustinW]

Brilliant, fitted the new (to me) speedo sensor and that's fixed the speedo and ABS warning.

But, this is what I found when I dropped the FD.

Rusty shaft UJ and splines

There was no discernible movement in the shaft from the FD. Nothing knocking anyway just a very slight soft movement that I only noticed coz I could see it in the water sat in the housing.

Water in the housing

And coffee coloured FD oil

The FD boot had a split in it inside one of the bellows so that's been replaced. The O ring for the sensor looked to be ok but was replaced anyway. The FD oil was replaced too. The drain plug had a little bit of black very smooth grease like deposit on it. No iron filings, just smooth, and buttery soft.

Is there another seal that could be letting water in?

 

[mikeyboy]

the water collects in the front of the fd housing and gets drawn past the seal as the unit cools,
there is a spacer ring behind the pinion nut that the lip of the seal runs on which may be corroded or worn.
looking at the state of the oil it will not have done the bearings any favours,
two choices,refill with fresh oil and keep an eye on things now the boot has been replaced,or pull the unit off and strip.

 

[Phil-H]

Isn't it feasible to drill a small water drain hole?

 

[AustinW]

the water collects in the front of the fd housing and gets drawn past the seal as the unit cools,
there is a spacer ring behind the pinion nut that the lip of the seal runs on which may be corroded or worn.
looking at the state of the oil it will not have done the bearings any favours,
two choices,refill with fresh oil and keep an eye on things now the boot has been replaced,or pull the unit off and strip.

Thanks Mikey. The area behind the pinion was very crusty and looked like something that was just beginning to rot and decay - look at the bit behind the nut where the flats are. I will get in touch around the end of February for a rebuild as I am going to be away for a month or so shortly (not on the bike). I have a trip to North, Central & South America in the planning stages for later in 2016 so would like it sorted and settled in by then.

Isn't it feasible to drill a small water drain hole?

I think this was being discussed in another FD thread. I think the issue would be its supposed to be dry in there so unless you could be sure there was a working one way valve it sorta guarantees water would be in there. TBH its so simple to pivot the FD down I really don't know why its not a service item: drop it, clean and dry it, spray some rust inhibiting oil on the UJ (mine got ACF 50 on it), lube the splines, check the boot, and stick it all back together.

I have also got the FD breather on order at Bowker BMW.

 

[Phil-H]

Why would it need a 1 way valve?
Small hole to allow water out is better than the water being standing in there & being drawn into the fd & you could stick a straw up there to spray some wd40 ocasionally