R1250GS Rattling noise

[GelandeStress]

I had a chat with both the tech who serviced the bike and the master tech (who looked about 12 years old - I must be getting old).

The software was updated but made no difference. The oil was clean, so no sign of mechanical wear which is a good thing.

The master tech didn’t accept that it was pinking or detonation as the sensors would have logged a fault, so they’re mystified at the moment as to the source of the noise.

It’s booked in for a couple of days at the beginning of August for a more thorough exmination, so watch this space….,

BMW are indeed aware of this noise. The tech or master technician might not have the answer but they can definitely find it out. There are 250,000 1250cc boxer engines out there, it can’t be ‘unknown’ !

 

[scarab1987]

I had a chat with both the tech who serviced the bike and the master tech (who looked about 12 years old - I must be getting old).

The software was updated but made no difference. The oil was clean, so no sign of mechanical wear which is a good thing.

The master tech didn’t accept that it was pinking or detonation as the sensors would have logged a fault, so they’re mystified at the moment as to the source of the noise.

It’s booked in for a couple of days at the beginning of August for a more thorough exmination, so watch this space….,

I had exactly same issue with my dealer. When I was inside warranty, in every service I was telling them about the strange noise and they were replying to me that all 1250s do this and is detonation etc etc etc. Maybe 10 times same reply. I am also an engineer and I can understand that noise is similar to detonation but it is not detonation. So I did everything at my engine, to exclude causes. I bought all the tools and I did cam timing, valve clearance, clutch basket replacement, all possible calibrations with GS911, programming for better AFR. I can say that the only thing that reduced the duration of the noise was the cam and Reluctor timing. If before engine did 10 times "tick-tick" in a row, now it does 2 times. Also I have made a big analysis in every mechanical and electric part of this engine. I have replaced clutch basket with new one.Removed and Inspected cooling pump, added spacers to the chain tensioners etc etc. My conclusion is that the "tick-tick" comes when the load increases and shiftcam is in the edge to go to big lobes and back to small. I think that need a little better programming from BMW, to adjust the duration that the shiftcam will remain to big or small lobes and not try to change back and forth all the time. It is just programming for me. The problem is that my programmer cannot even see omand adjust anything that is related to shiftcam. It is like hidden in the maps.

 

[the woodster]

This was my mindset. Then I realised that once you’re outside warranty then BMW will do everything in their power to avoid fixing. Unless you can somehow proceed with legal action there is no body which will hold BMW to account to fix a fault part.

I suggest taking to social media as I’ve had luck complaining publicly towards BMW, whereas emails get ignored for weeks…

I completely agree with you about going to social media. I did the same with an energy company and suddenly an intractable situation was resolved. I know it's easy to say but going to small claims court should not deter anyone from enforcing their rights. The process is easy enough and the onus is with the applicant. It need not go this far anyway. Perhaps the OP should serve a notice on BMW in relation to The Consumer Rights Act 2015. I do note that BMW are still engaged though.

 

[the woodster]

I completely agree with you about going to social media. I did the same with an energy company and suddenly an intractable situation was resolved. I know it's easy to say but going to small claims court should not deter anyone from enforcing their rights. The process is easy enough and the onus is with the applicant. It need not go this far anyway. Perhaps the OP should serve a notice on BMW in relation to The Consumer Rights Act 2015. I do note that BMW are still engaged though.

My apologies, I did not catch that you were in Greece so my ramblings about UK consumer law are irrelevant to you.

 

[scarab1987]

My apologies, I did not catch that you were in Greece so my ramblings about UK consumer law are irrelevant to you.

GelandeSress is from UK. I am in Greece.

 

[sven]

BMW are indeed aware of this noise. The tech or master technician might not have the answer but they can definitely find it out. There are 250,000 1250cc boxer engines out there, it can’t be ‘unknown’ !

The bike has now been in the dealers for a week and, despite dialogue and suggested adjustments/repairs from BMW, they still haven’t found the root cause of the rattle. It looks like they’ll be stripping the motor and rebuilding it

At least they’ve said I can keep the R1250RT LE loan bike until it’s sorted.

 

[GelandeStress]

Good. I had a brand new 1250 for 5 weeks. Free mileage!

I would recommend you communicate with BMW on X (twitter) as the customer support are much more responsive than private emails.

If I ride my bike HARD then the rattle noise does come back, but honestly I’m trying to be more gentle so I don’t hear the noise. If you get an engine rebuild for free (like me) then it’s all positive I think. And if something does happen in 3-4 years you have proof that there was ‘an undiagnosed rattle’.

Best of luck.

 

[sven]

Had an update and they’ve checked and adjusted the valve clearances and I’m guessing the shift cam clearances too, but the rattle is still there. They’re changing the exhaust next, so BMW must think the rattle could be the exhaust valve.

 

[GelandeStress]

Had an update and they’ve checked and adjusted the valve clearances and I’m guessing the shift cam clearances too, but the rattle is still there. They’re changing the exhaust next, so BMW must think the rattle could be the exhaust valve.

No it’s definitely not the exhaust. It it not as we call it a ‘rattle’ which implies something is ‘loose’… it’s more of a ‘excessive tolerance play’ because it only happens at specific RPM. I remember on my F850GS the chain slap was awful and you could isolate the noise by riding in neutral at 20mph over bumps. This ‘rattle’ is only present under load, therefore its an engine noise. But if you get a free exhaust then go ahead…

 

[sven]

Well, I’m down in Wales for the weekend on the loan RT as there’s been no update since last week when they said the exhaust change had made no difference and they hadn’t tried owt else as they were busy with “booked jobs”. Obviously the £18k I spent on the GSA in their shop doesn’t make me a valued customer. It’s not like I’ve been a customer of theirs for 25 years

 

[GelandeStress]

Well, I’m down in Wales for the weekend on the loan RT as there’s been no update since last week when they said the exhaust change had made no difference and they hadn’t tried owt else as they were busy with “booked jobs”. Obviously the £18k I spent on the GSA in their shop doesn’t make me a valued customer. It’s not like I’ve been a customer of theirs for 25 years

Complain on X and keep posting about it. BMW UK have the power to expedite, I know first hand!

 

[GelandeStress]

Well, I’m down in Wales for the weekend on the loan RT as there’s been no update since last week when they said the exhaust change had made no difference and they hadn’t tried owt else as they were busy with “booked jobs”. Obviously the £18k I spent on the GSA in their shop doesn’t make me a valued customer. It’s not like I’ve been a customer of theirs for 25 years

Also my noise has returned after 500 miles. Only a new engine will fix these noises…

 

[Fullchat]

I was out on my 2019 1250 GSA couple of weeks ago on a very warm day. It was rattling its brains out under load. Deeply concerning.
I had filled up at a rural station (Fridaythorpe) which has cheap fuel.
Used most of it and filed up with some BP Ultimate. Long run yesterday and it was cooler but the rattling has all but gone. Only noticed it once riding up a slight incline in a 30 limit.
So at this point I'm filing it under 'cheap shit fuel'.
But for a brand that's supposed to cross desserts on camel piss its worrying.

 

[GelandeStress]

BMW explicitly told me to use only premium fuel going forwards, which is slightly concerning that the bike is designed for lesser fuel (with NO advice/warning about fuel quality)

 

[GelandeStress]

I was out on my 2019 1250 GSA couple of weeks ago on a very warm day. It was rattling its brains out under load. Deeply concerning.
I had filled up at a rural station (Fridaythorpe) which has cheap fuel.
Used most of it and filed up with some BP Ultimate. Long run yesterday and it was cooler but the rattling has all but gone. Only noticed it once riding up a slight incline in a 30 limit.
So at this point I'm filing it under 'cheap shit fuel'.
But for a brand that's supposed to cross desserts on camel piss its worrying.

Also I always use premium fuel and it still rattles

 

[Wierpig]

Its pinking.Ive given up trying to fix it and at 32000 its still not holed the pistons so I put my earplugs in and forget about it.Cooler plugs definately improved it, but lean mixture and vicious ign advance overcome.

 

[DmytroT]

Hi All, I collect the bike yesterday and so far there is no rattle noise anymore.

BMW replaced the clutch basket and all internal parts with wear and I need to be gentle for 600 miles as the engine is running in again.

My best guess is the clutch basket having excessive movement, given where the noise comes from (around the front/top of the engine) and that it has bearings and the ability to develop play over time. Apparently it’s just the basket and not the whole clutch. They did however replace the clutch basket 6 months ago but the noise came back after 2 months… maybe they are commonly faulty/excessive movement?

I was strongly advised by BMW to only use the expensive super unleaded fuel, I’m not sure if this is because of the bike or the fuel quality getting worse due to emissions.

Any questions just ask. All the best with your bikes.

Hello GelandeStress!

It has been a month and a half since the clutch basket was replaced on your motorcycle.

Has the noise never reappeared? And what is the mileage of your motorcycle since the clutch basket replacement?

Unfortunately, I have the exact same problem starting at 20k km on my 2020 r1250 GSA. Now the mileage is already 42k. Two years of trying to fix it with the help of the dealer did not lead to anything, well, you yourself know how it works, they just "don’t hear any strange in the noise coming from the engine".

I have been watching the forum for a couple of month and still waiting for your conclusion based on the experience: does replacing the clutch basket really solve the problem. To my regret, BMW pretends that the problem does not exist and does nothing to solve it. However, I'm hoping that if I know exactly what the problem with my motor is, it would be easier for me to make the dealer to fix the it while the bike is still under warranty.

 

[GelandeStress]

Hello GelandeStress!

Hi,

I had a 600 mile service after the engine rebuild, but 200 miles after this service (total 15,000 miles) the noise started half way through a long journey at 70mph.

I believe BMW HQ (Germany) understand the fault but do not notify local technicians unless the customer is relentless. They clearly knew the fault was present because they spent 2 months rebuilding my engine free of change…

What country are you in? I believe the best way to contact BMW is via X (social media), as they seem to respond quicker on a public platform.

I am going to ignore the noise now and, if a mechanical failure happens out of warranty, then I will be contacting BMW since there has been a clear history of the ‘undiagnosed rattle noise’…

If you can record the noise via a dashcam then that would be the best idea, then BMW can’t ’ignore it’ like they have previously.

If you have the same noise as me then show them my video in the thread above.

I believe it to be the clutch basket, since BMW have replaced it two times and each time the noise has disappeared, the first time for 1 week and the second for 3 months…

Ah… BMW R1250 GELANDE ‘STRESS’ !

 

[DmytroT]

Hi,

I had a 600 mile service after the engine rebuild, but 200 miles after this service (total 15,000 miles) the noise started half way through a long journey at 70mph.

I believe BMW HQ (Germany) understand the fault but do not notify local technicians unless the customer is relentless. They clearly knew the fault was present because they spent 2 months rebuilding my engine free of change…

What country are you in? I believe the best way to contact BMW is via X (social media), as they seem to respond quicker on a public platform.

I am going to ignore the noise now and, if a mechanical failure happens out of warranty, then I will be contacting BMW since there has been a clear history of the ‘undiagnosed rattle noise’…

If you can record the noise via a dashcam then that would be the best idea, then BMW can’t ’ignore it’ like they have previously.

If you have the same noise as me then show them my video in the thread above.

I believe it to be the clutch basket, since BMW have replaced it two times and each time the noise has disappeared, the first time for 1 week and the second for 3 months…

Ah… BMW R1250 GELANDE ‘STRESS’ !

I'm afraid it might not be the clutch basket. The fact is that after a major maintenance of 40,000 km, the noise in my engine also disappeared. I was happy and I was sure that adjusting the valves solved the problem. But after 1,200-1,500 km, the noise came back. And in my case, there is a clear correlation between the noise and the temperature of the surrounding air. At an air temperature below 15 degrees C, there is practically no noise at all. At an air temperature of 30 degrees C, this happens on every light uphill climb until you add throttle. And there is no correlation with the temperature of the oil in the engine (on-board computer data).

At the same time, the motorcycle looks to drive normally, the power and traction are ok. But it sounds like it's sick. It spoils the mood and destroys the joy of the trip.

I will try to record the noise.

 

[Hann]

there is no correlation with the temperature of the oil in the engine (on-board computer data).

Is there a way of seeing the oil temperature on the TFT or are you refering to the coolant temperature?
I think you are on the right track with regards to the noise being more apparent with higher ambient temps, my 1250 makes this noise very occasionally and very minimally in it`s volume but when i think back it has been when outside temps have been high.