Reliability - summary for newbie

[Rasher]

I have gone past all the "How Wonderful" threads and now found this, it looks like these are the least reliable bikes in the world!

I had heard of a few problems and been warned of BM's by a few people, mainly "urban myths" about electrics being useless and transmissions blowing up, then I look here and it all seems true!

I understood boxers were the bike to last you 100k, it seems like a Ducati 996 with no service history and drilled sump plug would be a better long term bet.

I hope I am wrong!

 

[(RIP) Miff]

Don't listen to 'em.

 

[Merv]

I have gone past all the "How Wonderful" threads and now found this, it looks like these are the least reliable bikes in the world!

I had heard of a few problems and been warned of BM's by a few people, mainly "urban myths" about electrics being useless and transmissions blowing up, then I look here and it all seems true!

I understood boxers were the bike to last you 100k, it seems like a Ducati 996 with no service history and drilled sump plug would be a better long term bet.

I hope I am wrong!

Just done 7000 miles in 4 months on a 12gsa ,no trouble whatsoever,held of changing up from 1150gsa[yes up] because of reading to much on here regarding 12s, before i said f**k it il giv it a shot,turns out to be the best bike ive ever had and ive had a few,including ur duke and il be pissed if it only does 100k.Good luck with whatever u get

 

[red1]

I hope I am wrong!

You are ... and then again you're not.

To be honest it seems a bit of a lottery.
There are 1200's that go forever and there are those that simply have more trouble than is believable.

From the start in 2004 there were problems with the final drive of launch models which seems to have been cured quite quickly. If you had an early model the FD either blew up are lasted forever.
Then there were the fuel pump and EWS problems for which BMW stuck their head in the sand and pretended didn't exist. These took the best part of 4 years to fix, with some bikes having multiple problems and riders carrying spare parts with them.
Recently there seems to have been a spurt of reports of FD problems affecting most model years. Some poor sods on here have had 2 or 3 FD repair/replacements.

1200RT's also suffer from faults that BMW seem to ignore. Front master cylinder failure (which I suffered personally) is a known fault, as is "popping" the right piston. Both of which also seem common with police bikes. The piston fault also occurs on the GS but is unusual.

The BMW "blue-bloods" on the forum will point out that BMW will sort it out under warranty, "so what's the problem". The only sensible way is to purchase extended warranty at £300+ every year of ownership.

BMW customer service is excellent. When my brakes failed on a trip to Spain in March they were fantastic. Problem was that all I actually did was ride to Spain, have bike picked up and repaired, collect bike and ride home. Didn't ride a single mile in Spain apart from the journey to and from. Spent the whole time there in an Avis VW Golf.

There are a lot more trouble free bikes than "rogues" out there but as I said earlier it can be a bit of a lottery.

 

[Sgt Bilco]

The GS's are no better or worse than anything else. Ive done over 60k in 4 years with no issues to speak of whatsoever and believe me, mine isn't mollycoddled. In fact I'd go as far as to say it's the most reliable bike I've ever owned.

They aren't bomb proof though and just because you've spent 10k + doesn't mean you don't have to look after the beast. They will suffer corrosion and maybe the odd mechanical just like any other bike you buy. Don't presume that because it has BMW on the badge it means it's some kind of magic machine that never has an issue.

If you go second hand, make sure all the recalls are done and you'll be fine.

You have to remember that only people who have issues generally shout so the huge majority are running around happy with their bike

I'm nt changing mine for a very long time and I want to see way over 100k on the clock and I confidently expect that without many issues.

 

[Demongroover]

On balance the 1200GS is generally a brilliant package, definitely 'more than the sum of their parts' type equation.... but....

As with everything, stuff goes wrong, wears, corrodes, fails.

The most expensive is the final drive so it's best to formulate a contingency plan, whether it's extended warranty or source a good engineer who can do the repair (remember you would have replaced chain & sprockets on a 'conventional' bike so it's not a zero cost option), or keep an eye out for cheap ebay bargain.

I've had a few other bits go, but no more than any other bike. Gear position sensor, coil, a few corroded items, but no real drama, I expect this, this is Britain afterall, weather, temperature etc all contribute.

Also, and shhhh, don't tell them I told you but....
... there's a lot of people on here that buy a BMW for £10k or £12k and expect it to get the same treatment and service and reliability as a BMW 7 series car. You won't, it's a bike afterall.

 

[cookie]

As with everything, stuff goes wrong, wears, corrodes, fails.

The most expensive is the final drive

an absolute bargain compared to a dropped valve, i suspect

 

[Sgt Bilco]

an absolute bargain compared to a dropped valve, i suspect

.....and of course no other engine in the history of time has ever dropped a valve

FFS, that's happened to a few engines in god knows how many 1000's have been built.

 

[Rasher]

Cheers guys, I was getting the impression every owner had at least one FD failure and about 5 FPC's.

How much is a new FD, and have they resolved it, or could you be unlucky and keep having to change them every 10k at whatever cost.

6 years since model launch they really should have it all sorted by now, no excuses for either not sorting it, or not helping with design faults post warranty.

I have never had a major failure in 20+ years of jap superbikes except an RG500 that blew the gearbox through the engine cases, and Suzuki to their credit gave free parts on out of warranty bikes.

Apart from that about 100,000 fairly trouble free miles on about a dozen bikes with just stuff like discs, bearings and seals, never been left stranded except by tyres and never had an expensive repair bill.

 

[cookie]

.....and of course no other engine in the history of time has ever dropped a valve

FFS, that's happened to a few engines in god knows how many 1000's have been built.

you're so sensitive. is there a thread on this site slightly criticising 1200 reliability where you've not jumped in to claim it's all exaggerated?

just pointing out that a new final drive is a walk in the park compared to replacing a top end, and cleaning out the debris from the engine.

personally, my 06 GSA has had engine/gearbox seals done quickly, efficiently, and probably unnecessarily by bmw under warranty.

no FD failures.

no FPC failures.

no NWS failures.

no warped discs (has anyone mentioned that yet?).

i fancy a new bike, but can't think of anything better.

 

[Beemerman59]

Don't assume an FD failure requires the mandatory replacement of a complete new assembly. I think BMW in the early days just did a complete replacement but now it seems they are taking the view that some are repairable. I had my Crown wheel bearing go recently on my '08 GSA at 18K and the nice lads at Bahnstormers fixed it for £260 all in including free loan bike. The bike's out of warranty but a goodwill claim has been agreed - just waiting to find out how much but even so, nowhere near the grand I was at first expecting.

 

[Sgt Bilco]

you're so sensitive. is there a thread on this site slightly criticising 1200 reliability where you've not jumped in to claim it's all exaggerated?
.

I'm a very sensitive soul and don't like all the negativity surrounding the bike sometimes I just think it's the best all round bike on the planet and a lot of the perceived issues are really exagerrated. Yep, there are problems but the vast majority bimble around the planet with the riders grinning like mad things.

I'd hate to see someone put off owning one because the thing that they all suffer from an FD problem when it's clearly not

 

[Yonkyo]

I'm a very sensitive soul and don't like all the negativity surrounding the bike sometimes I just think it's the best all round bike on the planet and a lot of the perceived issues are really exagerrated. Yep, there are problems but the vast majority bimble around the planet with the riders grinning like mad things.

I'd hate to see someone put off owning one because the thing that they all suffer from an FD problem when it's clearly not

Well said

17,000 miles of hard use, in 15 months on my GSA now. Not so much as a blown bulb. And she looks good as new.

 

[Stretchamus]

Well said

17,000 miles of hard use, in 15 months on my GSA now. Not so much as a blown bulb. And she looks good as new.

All this brand loyalty reminds me of when we where all much younger

Most people with Japanese motorcycles would not dream of making the above statement and think its good for a mere 17,000 miles

I bought mine in April and knew nothing of final drives, If I had waited and bought Yamaha's new contender, would I, in the relatively short miles to come, be expecting the F/D to go, will the Jap forums be saying they spent 13+K plus and their F/D's are fecked, will they bollox

So come on no excuses, its Cr@p end of

Best regards Stretch

 

[Popell]

Well said

17,000 miles of hard use, in 15 months on my GSA now. Not so much as a blown bulb. And she looks good as new.

Buggar, I had a bulb go once!!

 

[Rasher]

So this is a lottery thing then, some will last 100k, others a few miles, still I don't reckon it is good enough, if it is such a rare thing why can't BMW just step in a resolve it as a goodwill gesture?

My bike has common issues as do many modern vehicles, which are all getting worse as companies are run by bean counters and not engineers, but I can live with warping discs and cheapo chains as you just wait for them to go and fit something better.

I think the FD is my biggest fear, would not be so bad if it was a £1,000 gamble, but once done it would last forever, but when you could spend £1,000 having it fixed for it to go 5k later with no warranty or support from BMW that is maybe asking a bit much.

Does nobody do exchange units and put them together properly with quality bearings?

 

[Wapping]

Rasher, from post #125 in this thread http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2481941#post2481941 it is clear that you have decided not to buy a 1200GS.

Having satisfied yourself that it is a pile of crap, made of Chinese components, assembled by idiots, in a company run by accountants and (in all probability) ridden by people too stupid to realise that they have been hoodwinked, isn't it time to stop? If only to give yourself some breathing space to simply enjoy the bike you (might) have decided to buy?

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

Cheers guys, I was getting the impression every owner had at least one FD failure and about 5 FPC's.

How much is a new FD, and have they resolved it, or could you be unlucky and keep having to change them every 10k at whatever cost.

6 years since model launch they really should have it all sorted by now, no excuses for either not sorting it, or not helping with design faults post warranty.

I have never had a major failure in 20+ years of jap superbikes except an RG500 that blew the gearbox through the engine cases, and Suzuki to their credit gave free parts on out of warranty bikes.

Apart from that about 100,000 fairly trouble free miles on about a dozen bikes with just stuff like discs, bearings and seals, never been left stranded except by tyres and never had an expensive repair bill.

Buy a 1100GS and be happy

 

[R17GSR]

To be fair to BM, I've been waiting for my FD to fail. I've done 26k miles in 12 months on a '07 GSA, in the last 10 k I've fitted 2 FD oil seals and they're still leaking. No play in wheel. Last Monday the shaft uj's gave up but the FD is fine. Fitted another seal ( for a hobby), and the 'new' 180 ml of oil, see if it still spews out after 500 miles. Put a line of silicon sealer around the drive casing to act as a drip ring, to stop the oil flicking on to the brake disc. Off to Sweden Tuesday, we'll see what happens.
Oh, New shaft drive disc rubber boot and seals nearly £400
Ride safe.
Gary

 

[cookie]

I think the FD is my biggest fear, would not be so bad if it was a £1,000 gamble, but once done it would last forever, but when you could spend £1,000 having it fixed for it to go 5k later with no warranty or support from BMW that is maybe asking a bit much.

only if you averaged 2500 miles per year.